Immigration to the UK - do you have concerns?

[brogdale]

Yeah, but you would think that by the time people got to university they would own a dictionary, and be able to look up terms with which they were not familiar.

Or even use an internet search engine?

 

[Edie]

Or even use an internet search engine?

Bet you’re loads of fun down the pub

 

[Edie]

brogdale if I was to try to “listen to understand” what changes would you make if you were to become Prime Minister with a large majority?

Not socialist Revolution and communism or anarchism. Based in the world as it currently is. What do you think would make the biggest changes for the better?

 

[PTK]

I find it can often be rewarding to look up words you think that you know the meaning of, but sometimes you have been misinformed, and the etymology can be quite enlightening.

 

[brogdale]

brogdale if I was to try to “listen to understand” what changes would you make if you were to become Prime Minister with a large majority?

Not socialist Revolution and communism or anarchism. Based in the world as it currently is. What do you think would make the biggest changes for the better?

So you’re asking me, whilst assuming no meaningful system change is possible, to select a single policy/legislative change that would make the “biggest changes for the better”?

Well, it’s late and I don’t like the rules of the game, but....I suppose economic democracy?

 

[PTK]

State ownership of the private rented sector?

 

[PTK]

The solution to the "small boats" problem is to allow those seeking asylum in the UK to take the ferry across the Channel.

 

[Gramsci]

Given some people drowned in channel trying to get here anyone got views on this governments way of dealing with the asylum seekers issue?

I did post up about this governments immigration policy on asylum seekers and so called illegal immigrants a few pages back.

 

[Gramsci]

Pregnant woman among 12 dead after boat carrying migrants capsizes in English Channel

Downing Street says the news is "truly horrific" and people smuggling gangs were "taking even more dangerous risks".

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[lengualo]

Conservatives want to maintain things as they are, and reactionaries want to return to things as they were.

It amazes me that our education system does not teach such basic political concepts.

Agreed, but not all that amazing when you consider in whose interests the curriculum is devised.

Yeah, but you would think that by the time people got to university they would own a dictionary, and be able to look up terms with which they were not familiar.

No you're not likely to be taught a lot of the terms people on politics forums unless you studied those fields (in school or indie).

However, PTK your explanation was much clearer and to the point than a lot of definitions for political terms are. I checked and it is way more accessible than the first page of Google, including the dictionary definitions that pop up.

And terms can be odd, I've never understood why we use the term "reactionary" because it logically sounds like it should mean something different to what it does.

So it does pay for people to just ask.

 

[ElizabethofYork]

Pregnant woman among 12 dead after boat carrying migrants capsizes in English Channel

Downing Street says the news is "truly horrific" and people smuggling gangs were "taking even more dangerous risks".

www.bbc.co.uk

6 of them were children.

 

[lengualo]

6 of them were children.

Ffs. Lets see if they go in hard on this, or whether they're fighting age women and children.

Of the 12, 6 were minors and 10 female. They should smack that across the heads of people who bang on about fighting age men, but they wont.

 

[Gramsci]

Pregnant woman among 12 dead after boat carrying migrants capsizes in English Channel

Downing Street says the news is "truly horrific" and people smuggling gangs were "taking even more dangerous risks".

www.bbc.co.uk

This is what Yvette Cooper home secretary says:

The gangs behind this appalling and callous trade in human lives have been cramming more and more people onto increasingly unseaworthy dinghies, and sending them out into the Channel even in very poor weather.

"They do not care about anything but the profits they make, and that is why - as well as mourning the awful loss of life - the work to dismantle these dangerous and criminal smuggler gangs and to strengthen border security is so vital and must proceed apace," she adds.

What she doesn't say is that this country and EU strengthening border security is what drives the demand for people smuggling.

Yvette Cooper logic is that dismantle the gangs and people will stop trying to get here.

 

[Gramsci]

Pregnant woman among 12 dead after boat carrying migrants capsizes in English Channel

Downing Street says the news is "truly horrific" and people smuggling gangs were "taking even more dangerous risks".

www.bbc.co.uk

Here is what a charity says. I agree with this,

Steve Smith, Care4Calais chief executive, says: "One life lost in the Channel is too much, but this year these tragedies have occurred with much more frequency and that is a deeply worrying trend that needs to be stopped."

He says these have been "avoidable tragedies" and criticises an "obsession" with improving security measures, calling instead for safe routes to be made available.

"It’s time politicians were held accountable for their choice to dehumanise people seeking sanctuary from horrors back home," he adds.

 

[Gramsci]

The solution to the "small boats" problem is to allow those seeking asylum in the UK to take the ferry across the Channel.

Yep. That would be humane way to do it.

But of course we mustn't forget people's "concerns".

So let's make it as difficult as possible and blame people smugglers.

 

[Edie]

So you’re asking me, whilst assuming no meaningful system change is possible, to select a single policy/legislative change that would make the “biggest changes for the better”?

Well, it’s late and I don’t like the rules of the game, but....I suppose economic democracy?

Co-operatively owned businesses?

 

[Pickman's model]

brogdale if I was to try to “listen to understand” what changes would you make if you were to become Prime Minister with a large majority?

Not socialist Revolution and communism or anarchism. Based in the world as it currently is. What do you think would make the biggest changes for the better?

brogdale will doubtless differ but were I to succeed him as pm with a large majority I'd jail anyone peddling the lie about mht being good for the country. The politics of the country have had her at the centre for far too long and the notion that anything to the left of her is bolshevism has poisoned parliamentary politics for decades. The cult of personality about her must be dismantled.

 

[Serge Forward]

State ownership of the private rented sector?

Nationalise the top 200 fish and chip shops.

 

[Pickman's model]

Yep. That would be humane way to do it.

But of course we mustn't forget people's "concerns".

So let's make it as difficult as possible and blame people smugglers.

Yeh but by putting them in big boats you could argue persuasively you'd stopped the small ones. And you could take them off boats altogether by putting them on the eurostar

 

[nino_savatte]

You're the one who took digs at my language skills. You make a habit of that? With people who are dyslexic? Who didn't get the best education? Non native and bilingual speakers? If not, then don't do it at all because you don't know peoples circumstances. You understood what I was tring to say, because you corrected it, and instead of replying to the point I made you decided to mock. Whether you disagree with me and think I'm a prick or not, you're way out of line for that.




OK, so you interjected into a heated conversation trying to be smart? Fine, I retract my earlier comment to you however, as I pointed out in an earlier response, you are incorrect in the BIB, I do not consider ALL opinions to be equal and considering we are on a left wing progressive forum I presume most of us are more or less on the same kind of page and don't have to be pedantic. In the context of what was being discussed I think my comments were fair.




Treatise? See above. I'm participating with opinions on an internet forum, like 90% of people do. I'm not conducting no academic work or acting as an authority source. I saw that there is a forum on here for academic discussion, so presume this board is more for casual conversation.

I did no such thing. If you think that, you're either very thin-skinned, you're trolling or both.

You're a returning poster, no?

Grow up, ffs.

 

[lengualo]

Co-operatively owned businesses?

Its a broad term that refers to several business models, but boiler-plating it down, a business that is ran via democracy (the members, be these a unionised board, the workforce itself, or even consumers) who have some kind of shared ownership, stake, and executive decision over the business.

 

[nino_savatte]

Treatise? See above. I'm participating with opinions on an internet forum, like 90% of people do. I'm not conducting no academic work or acting as an authority source. I saw that there is a forum on here for academic discussion, so presume this board is more for casual conversation.

You're a big fucking baby, chief.

 

[lengualo]

I did no such thing. If you think that, you're either very thin-skinned, you're trolling or both.

You know exactly what you were doing with this post:

You're not making sense. Do you know what the word "inference" means? Clue: it isn't the same as insinuate or imply. One more thing, I said that I wasn't asking for a dissertation and here you are repeating my words. Are you feeling okay?

You're a returning poster, no?

Grow up, ffs.

What? No, I came from AVF because they were two siding with right wingers. Are you one of those types (who thinks anyone who isn't exactly like them is a previously banned member or troll)?

 

[Pickman's model]

I did no such thing. If you think that, you're either very thin-skinned, you're trolling or both.

You're a returning poster, no?

Grow up, ffs.

I think we'd remember him if he'd been this way before

 

[lengualo]

You're a big fucking baby, chief.

This doesn't even make sense in response to what you quoted, perhaps I'm missing something? Or, perhaps you're being needlessly antagonistic.

 

[brogdale]

Co-operatively owned businesses?

If they were worker controlled as well as owned; yeah, why not?

 

[lengualo]

I think we'd remember him if he'd been this way before

Its OK Pickman, I'll keep my thoughts about class and class warfare to myself in future. Its clear that its a super prickly subject here and I wasn't aware when I signed up that if you go against the grain it'll rub a lot of people up very badly. I'm sorry if I've upset anyone, but this is all getting really, really dickish.

 

[brogdale]

Immigration anyone?

 

[lengualo]

Immigration anyone?

Sorry, I'll stop and ignore.

 

[xenon]

Its OK Pickman, I'll keep my thoughts about class and class warfare to myself in future. Its clear that its a super prickly subject here and I wasn't aware when I signed up that if you go against the grain it'll rub a lot of people up very badly. I'm sorry if I've upset anyone, but this is all getting really, really dickish.

Don't worry about them. Post as you will. No idea what Nino is on about and just looks like he's being a dick rather than clarifying or moving on. Such are the boards at times.