Hundreds of women assaulted in German NYE celebrations

[bimble]

That assertion I quoted is absurd, and you're right about this thread, it's like voluntarily swimming upstream through shit .

 

[Pickman's model]

That assertion I quoted is absurd, and you're right about this thread, it's like voluntarily swimming upstream through shit .

you little salmon you

 

[Anudder Oik]

What is the point that you're seeking to make here?

No left wing sources have covered this vigorously, perhaps.

 

[butchersapron]

No left wing sources have covered this vigorously, perhaps.

In what way does that relate to me calling this thread a cesspit?

 

[DotCommunist]

I am stunned at the constant assertions on those lines without evidence.

its going to get accepted as fact by dickheads before long. We've seen in this very thread the rotheram comparison. Where on the ground workers had signalled concerns in the strongest terms, where the police had constantly done nothing because of a virulent class prejudice that drives me insane- worthless slags of the estates talk. Where senior management had brushed it over and when that pustule of wrong burst into view the claim was 'Victims of the PC Brigade' (actual sun headline). Its increasingly clear that right wing thought has recognized what is socially unnaceptable now but seeks to use it in a manner that deligitamises the left critiques of the structural issues. As if they have found a key to a complex puzzle rather than having a clue.
And the overwhelming lie, again and again, is that leftists don't care. Are mental lenin bots.

 

[Anudder Oik]

In what way does that relate to me calling this thread a cesspit?

Is this a style of debate? Just asking constant random quick fire questions? Obfuscation? Trying to tire the thread out in the hope that it will go away?

 

[butchersapron]

Is this a style of debate? Just asking constant random quick fire questions? Obfuscation? Trying to tire the thread out in the hope that it will go away?

Relating posts made to me to things I've said, yes. That is a style of debate.

 

[Anudder Oik]

its going to get accepted as fact by dickheads before long. We've seen in this very thread the rotheram comparison. Where on the ground workers had signalled concerns in the strongest terms, where the police had constantly done nothing because of a virulent class prejudice that drives me insane- worthless slags of the estates talk. Where senior management had brushed it over and when that pustule of wrong burst into view the claim was 'Victims of the PC Brigade' (actual sun headline). Its increasingly clear that right wing thought has recognized what is socially unnaceptable now but seeks to use it in a manner that deligitamises the left critiques of the structural issues. As if they have found a key to a complex puzzle rather than having a clue.
And the overwhelming lie, again and again, is that leftists don't care. Are mental lenin bots.

I can see your point here. Although my experience is that left wing people do make excuses to avoid the issue, even if it wasn't covered up by them in the first place as you point out

Don't you think the left in general has buried it's head in the sand re this issue on NYE in Cologne? Is anyone talking about the capitalist narrative behind the motive of bringing so many at the same time and the IMF's attempt to push back the minimum wage?

 

[Pickman's model]

I can see your point here. Although my experience is that left wing people do make excuses to avoid the issue, even if it wasn't covered up by them in the first place as you point out

Don't you think the left in general has buried it's head in the sand re this issue on NYE in Cologne? Is anyone talking about the capitalist narrative behind the motive of bringing so many at the same time and the IMF's attempt to push back the minimum wage?

i would not be surprised if people of all political views made excuses so as not to discuss things with you

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Sihhi was talking about precisely the minimum wage thing and I was talking about some fairly closely related stuff but it was invisible because it doesn't fit this 'left have nothing to say' narrative and we didn't advocate right wing solutions.

 

[Pickman's model]

I can see your point here. Although my experience is that left wing people do make excuses to avoid the issue, even if it wasn't covered up by them in the first place as you point out

Don't you think the left in general has buried it's head in the sand re this issue on NYE in Cologne? Is anyone talking about the capitalist narrative behind the motive of bringing so many at the same time and the IMF's attempt to push back the minimum wage?

your second paragraph: you seem to think these's some motive behind bringing all thrse people to europe at the same time. ok. so the overthrow of gadaffi and the collapse of iraqi and syrian authority in the north and east of those countries respectively is, with the resultant stream of refugees forcing their way into europe, iyo a capitalist conspiracy. you really are a loon.

 

[Pickman's model]

Bernie Gunther
what anudder oik is saying is that someone had a motive to bring all these people to europe at the same time. the man's a particularly loony conspiraloon

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Yeah well, I think it's possible to have a sensible discussion about capital and the production of refugee flows, but probably not in a thread that's as fucked as this one.

 

[Casually Red]

And thank you, too,for putting words in my mouth.
I'm not looking for a number, I'm looking for an acknowledgement by him that "safe" is entirely *relative, rather than his simplistic original formulation.

*It's relative because there's an awful lot more than just male ill-intent that informs feelings of safety.

No you aren't , you're fucking nitpicking for the sake of it . Like a bloody 5 year old .

 

[Casually Red]

...how do you hide a truncheon in a pair of speedos...?

If its round the back I hope they're at least issued with telescopic ones .

 

[Casually Red]

and finally spread all over social media by propaganda campaign prior to NYE and further by the media fenzy that followed.

The media frenzy that followed the deliberate media cover up ? Sorry , the deliberate media cover up in Germany . Which was separate from the deliberate media cover up in Sweden .

I think it's clear you're mightily ticked off that cover up..sorry..those cover ups ...weren't still in place . Which they would have been had it not been for social media .

 

[DotCommunist]

edited

 

[Casually Red]

From the WSWS article, figures from 21st Jan (probably actually 20th Jan I guess):



I don't know if there's anything as reliable more recently than that.

There's no mention of hamburg there . Supposedly around 350 victims of attacks, and could have been much worse were it not for the actions of the cities bouncers .

From what I've read yet again cops were close by but did nothing . Massively outnumbered . The nightclub bouncers got together and escorted numerous women to a temporary safe zone they'd set up in a yard . Only for that it most likely would have been worse than cologne .

Eta

As would Bielefeld have been had those 500 animals made it through the nightclub doors . Again determined door staff the only thing standing in their way . Door staff who had to drag women in off the street to protect them. A number of them already stripped naked in the street .

 

[Casually Red]

one of the interesting if annoying things is to see the CR foghorn at work. Follows a well worn path as well, similar to syria threads and ukraine thread. Starts from the position then argues it relentlessly and then is eventually reduced to copying out right loon propaganda vertabim nearly. As his own work. His fellow travellers will also repeat the failure of the left line over and over. In the hope that sheer volume of noise will drown out signal. He's not done bad here, picked up a few useful idiots and pretty much shifted the discussion along certain lines.

The threads not about me you fucking twat . No matter how hard you and a few others try to distract people down that path and away from the issue at hand. As a squad of you have done incessantly since the thread began . Just more obfuscation and distraction . Kitchen sink chucking , but it won't go away .

 

[DotCommunist]

suck my balls

 

[sihhi]

That assertion I quoted is absurd, and you're right about this thread, it's like voluntarily swimming upstream through shit .

No evidence as to why it is absurd. It's a heavy accusation against me that I am cess polluting a cesspit so I have to answer it.

I don't have a database program to do any kind of proper search.

But a google search of news reveals the Guardian's first report was on 5 January, exactly the same day as the Telegraph's first report. The Guardian has a report filed from Berlin and its correspondent there, and The Telegraph has a report filed from its correspondent there.

From then on both have reports and comment and editorials related to the events. They are as vigorous as each other.

The only case of a media cover-up is the decision by the ZDF Germany's equivalent of BBC not to broadcast material on 4 January, the first working day of the new year. Their justification was that they wanted more material to do a longer report and corroborate details. They did broadcast their news reports on 5 January. It was an error, but it has zero to do with the left. The insistence on placing this as the fault of the left is just unspeakable.

 

[Casually Red]

I am stunned at the constant assertions on this thread without evidence



The claim is that Henriette Reker is an uber liberal - in fact she's a centre-right independent supported by the CDU into office.
No minister - liberal or otherwise - has announced that discussion on the internest is as criminal as the events.

.

Henriette Reker..apart from being a complete twat..is an uber liberal. She was stabbed in the neck because of her campaigning fr office on a platform of open borders . You don't have to be left wing to be a liberal . Neo liberals are another example were the new right and large elements of today's left share common positions .

Ralf Jaeger ...from the SDP..is the minister for the interior for north Rhine Westphalia . He has gone on record as stating the discussions about this on social media " are at least as awful as the acts of those assaulting the women " . So you might be right...it's possibly worse than the attacks according to him.

Cologne sex attacks 'require police rethink' - BBC News

As for all the rest of your waffle I realise I'm discussing this with someone who was trying to make out the poor gang rapers are the real victims of the piece . So I'll not even go near your assertions on the left wing media performance . The abysmal nature of them speaks for itself .

 

[Casually Red]

its going to get accepted as fact by dickheads before long. We've seen in this very thread the rotheram comparison. Where on the ground workers had signalled concerns in the strongest terms, where the police had constantly done nothing because of a virulent class prejudice that drives me insane- worthless slags of the estates talk. Where senior management had brushed it over and when that pustule of wrong burst into view the claim was 'Victims of the PC Brigade' (actual sun headline). Its increasingly clear that right wing thought has recognized what is socially unnaceptable now but seeks to use it in a manner that deligitamises the left critiques of the structural issues. As if they have found a key to a complex puzzle rather than having a clue.
And the overwhelming lie, again and again, is that leftists don't care. Are mental lenin bots.

We've also seen in this very thread the Oktoberfest comparison , again and again and again . Which pretty much upends everything your saying .

And we also saw Sihhis pleas for understanding of the social pressures gang rapists are under in this day and age .

Mental, and not a fuck given .

 

[coley]

For those of you not here in the great 'sexual jihad' war around 2010, have a little search for this past bollocks. That it has re-appeared under his guise of concern for women is one of the most demoralising things i've ever seen on here.

Aye, fair point, but people and their attitudes change, let's see how it goes?

 

[sihhi]

Henriette Reker..apart from being a complete twat..is an uber liberal. She was stabbed in the neck because of her campaigning fr office on a platform of open borders . You don't have to be left wing to be a liberal .

Ralf Jaeger ...from the SDP..is the minister for the interior for north Rhine Westphalia . He has gone on record as stating the discussions about this on social media " are at least as awful as the acts of those assaulting the women " . So you might be right...it's possibly worse than the attacks according to him.

Cologne sex attacks 'require police rethink' - BBC News

The mayor Henriette Reker was a non-party bureaucrat as much from the right as the left, I disagree that she is an uber (consistent) liberal, an uber liberal would not have made those comments about women needing to keep safe together. A bureaucrat, top board member, manager would. I expect we disagree as to what liberal actually refers to.

State level, not a German cabinet member, Ralf Jaeger's reference was to "right-wing platforms" not general social media - there is an active right-wing movement in Germany that is preparing the ground for provocations for some sort of crimes, for ongoing tit-for-tat race based violence see the NSU murders, behaviour by Germans against Arab and Turkish immigrants in Marzahn or elsewhere, about 300 arson attacks against places where refugees live in Germany in the past year. The reference is clear when put into context, that AFD and NPD speech and claims are about this kind of nightmare scenario.

 

[Casually Red]

your second paragraph: you seem to think these's some motive behind bringing all thrse people to europe at the same time. ok. so the overthrow of gadaffi and the collapse of iraqi and syrian authority in the north and east of those countries respectively is, with the resultant stream of refugees forcing their way into europe, iyo a capitalist conspiracy. you really are a loon.

According to Forex, and senior EU official Ralph Timmerman, at least 60 percent of these migrants aren't refugees at all .

60% of refugees heading to Europe are economic migrants – top EU official

That backs up the account of that left wing writer I posted the other day . Whose freinds whod been helping asylum seekers were pissed off after finding out most of them werent . As indeed does the reported nationalities of the suspects identified so far . There's no getting away from the fact merkel specifically told these guys to come to Europe, that the door was open . And that German business leaders were straight out of the traps behind her publicly licking their lips . They definitely saw it as an opportunity .
I don't believe for a second those wars were about creating a cheap labour pool. But I do believe the refugee crisis those wars created was a good pr opportunity to take in a cheap labour pool from wherever wanted to come. That refugees fleeing war was a good way to sell the mass importation of cheap labour from wherever to the european public .Because the fact is if you're ticked off at hundreds of thousands of Algerians ,Tunisians, Moroccans etc being granted entry then you must hate refugees . So you're a bad uncaring person and should shut up .

 

[Casually Red]

The mayor Henriette Reker was a non-party bureaucrat as much from the right as the left, I disagree that she is an uber (consistent) liberal, an uber liberal would not have made those comments about women needing to keep safe together. A bureaucrat, top board member, manager would. I expect we disagree as to what liberal actually refers to.
.

No , an idiot would regardless of political orientation . The woman's a fucking idiot. As well as a liberal . She also made comments about it being impermissible to say the attackers were migrants . When it was obvious they were .

 

[Casually Red]

State level, not a German cabinet member, Ralf Jaeger's reference was to "right-wing platforms" not general social media - there is an active right-wing movement in Germany that is preparing the ground for provocations for some sort of crimes, for ongoing tit-for-tat race based violence see the NSU murders, behaviour by Germans against Arab and Turkish immigrants in Marzahn or elsewhere, about 300 arson attacks against places where refugees live in Germany in the past year. The reference is clear when put into context, that AFD and NPD speech and claims are about this kind of nightmare scenario.

He's a minister , a senior politician now matter hw much you obfuscate . He also mentioned chat rooms as well as right wing platforms , in a general sense . But of course you deliberately left that bit out . As if people can't read the fucking link themselves .
And it's completely irrelevant anyway . This subject being discussed on right wing platforms plainly isn't anywhere remotely as bad as armies of gang rapists assaulting women in their hundreds all over Germany . Not even remotely . And only a bigger fucking idiot than Henriette Reker would try and say it was .

 

[Casually Red]

The swimming pool panic seems to be quite widespread (Belgium, two baths in Germany & this swedish story). It's only Swedes who have responded with undercover police though the rest seem to have imposed various sorts of bans on .. men who aren't German/ Belgian or whatever being allowed to go swimming at all.

A lot of nightclubs are barring them now too .

 

[sihhi]

We've also seen in this very thread the Oktoberfest comparison , again and again and again . Which pretty much upends everything your saying .

And we also saw Sihhis pleas for understanding of the social pressures gang rapists are under in this day and age .

Mental, and not a fuck given .

Wanting to understand phenomena, that includes criminal gangs as well as self-defence gangs in opposition to them or any type of social reality is not mental. Similar things happened in the early 1990s in Germany with refugees from the war in northern Kurdistan and the Balkans. The absolute degradation of people and morality, heroin sales, sexual assaults, arson, murders. Wanting to understand how people ended up in these situations - and that goes for any situation be they the tops or the dregs of society etc is not mental.

Time and again it has been repeated to you that the comparison is not to claim elsewhere and Cologne are the same. But to draw out the differences in official and cultural response depending on the citizenship component of sexual crimes.