How much do you agree with these statements?

[kabbes]

I’m interested to know how much you agree with these statements.

• No insult to our honor should ever go unpunished.
• Obedience and respect for authority are the most important virtues children should learn.
• Books and movies ought not to deal so much with the sordid and seamy side of life; they ought to concentrate on themes that are entertaining or uplifting.

Let’s get some views on them first and, don’t worry, I will return later to add more context to the discussion. I’d like to know first what the gut reaction is, though, and why. Do you agree with all or some of them? Do you view the questions as being independent or bound by a theme? Is there one that stands out for you?

 

[Silas Loom]

The first one is easy. Obvious nonsense. Sticks and stones, and all that.

Second one: begs the question of whether they are virtues, but I suppose if you were going to assent, you'd assume they were. I personally think they are important, but kindness and so on are probably more so.

Third one is horribly question-begging, because it assumes that the sordid and seamy cannot be entertaining. I'd happily argue the reverse and adduce a huge number of books and films to prove the point. In general, the answer to an assent-based question which is flawed should always be "no" - it tends to give me funny scores on things like the political compass, though, especially when it comes to interpretations of what "ought to" means.

Anyway, I'd be perturbed by anyone who signed up happily to all three. I don't see an obvious common theme, other than that in the popular imagination there's a link between being patriotic, socially conservative, prissy and authoritarian.

 

[TruXta]

Who's the we in the first question?

 

[kabbes]

Who's the we in the first question?

It’s open to personal interpretation. Maybe the personal interpretation is even part of what makes the answers interesting.

 

[xenon]

Are you a Victorian moralist.

 

[Thimble Queen]

No to all.

1) Insults to honour sounds fucking weird, nationalistic and patriarchal. What even is our honour and who is the us being spoken about.

2) Kids should be free to question stuff and learn for themselves (in an age appropriate way)

3) Art and culture should explore all sides of life not just happy clappy shit* We can't Limit expression to positive stuff esp when artistic expression gives an outlet to people suffering and in pain - that's often the good shit too.

*unless it's naked dudes and 4 yo then Spy gets upset.

 

[Silas Loom]

A quick google later, I'm scared.

Spoiler

Which leading financial institution is getting its finest mind to algorithmise and update the F-scale for authoritarian leanings, and why? Is it the obedient or the unruly who represent greater risks as borrowers and investors?

 

[kabbes]

I have some other statements too I wanted to include but I didn’t want to overwhelm the poll. But for those who are interested, here they are:

• Weaknesses and difficulties can hold us back; will power is not enough.
  
• Familiarity breeds contempt.
• If people would discuss matters more before acting, everybody would be better off.

 

[kabbes]

A quick google later, I'm scared.

Which leading financial institution is getting its finest mind to algorithmise and update the F-scale for authoritarian leanings, and why? Is it the obedient or the unruly who represent greater risks as borrowers and investors?

It’s okay, I’m just doing a psychology degree. It’s got nothing to do with my work. I found some intreresting early research and thought it might be fun to explore it here.

 

[Silas Loom]

I have some other statements too I wanted to include but I didn’t want to overwhelm the poll. But for those who are interested, here they are:

• Weaknesses and difficulties can hold us back; will power is not enough. Agreed. The reverse is lunacy and magical thinking, fit only for Noel Edmonds.
  
• Familiarity breeds contempt.Well, contemptibility breeds contempt, but you do need to be exposed to it to recognise it. Partially true, I suppose.
  
• If people would discuss matters more before acting, everybody would be better off. Depends on the people and the wider set. Analysis-paralysis is real, and can be a bad thing. More often true than false, though.

 

[Silas Loom]

I’m just doing a psychology degree. .

That, at this stage of your life and career, is interesting - and if it's in your spare time, very impressive. Have you done a separate thread on this, in one of the parts of the board to which I currently don't have access?

 

[xenon]

1. Pure nonsense.
2. Critical thinking and hense healthy skeptisism regarding authority. Do not know and hold to your station.
3. Art should not be constrained by centiment or imposed niceties.

 

[Silas Loom]

Oh - sorry. Just occurred to me that the second one is question-begging on a further count: it assumes that respect for authority needs to be learned. However, it's perfectly possible that childhood respect for authority is innate and hard-wired, but can be eroded over time by harsh and capricious authority - or, perhaps, diminishes in adolescence, for reasons which would satisfy a biological determinist. That's another reason to refuse assent.

 

[Thimble Queen]

I have some other statements too I wanted to include but I didn’t want to overwhelm the poll. But for those who are interested, here they are:

• Weaknesses and difficulties can hold us back; will power is not enough.
  
• Familiarity breeds contempt.
• If people would discuss matters more before acting, everybody would be better off.

Of course weaknesses and difficulties can hold us back. For many situations there's no amount of will power that's gonna change stuff. And some 'difficulties' are down to systemic issues. So yeah.

I think people can get bored and frustrated doing the same shit/person day in day out but I dunno for contempt to arise maybe there has to be something more than familiarity... unmet needs, lack of communication, some unresolved resentment or something.

People should definitely talk more in terms of relationships and stuff. But this is well broad... People should listen to each other more maybe. But sometimes you just need to get on with shit. Everybody would be better off is niggling me somehow too, in this context but I can't put my finger on it.

 

[planetgeli]

• Weaknesses and difficulties can hold us back; will power is not enough. Agreed. The reverse is lunacy and magical thinking, fit only for Noel Edmonds.
  
• Familiarity breeds contempt.Well, contemptibility breeds contempt, but you do need to be exposed to it to recognise it. Partially true, I suppose.
  
• If people would discuss matters more before acting, everybody would be better off. Depends on the people and the wider set. Analysis-paralysis is real, and can be a bad thing. More often true than false, though.

Liked because I agree but particularly for 'analysis-paralysis'. I have a friend who I am sooooo going to introduce that term to.

 

[kabbes]

That, at this stage of your life and career, is interesting - and if it's in your spare time, very impressive. Have you done a separate thread on this, in one of the parts of the board to which I currently don't have access?

No, I’ve not really mentioned it on here that I can recall. Maybe once or twice. I’d just found a year ago that I was reading a lot of related material on the subject and thought I’d do it properly. I am still working full time, but so far so good. In the end I fancy maybe going into research. Insurance is so dull, I need an escape route...

 

[kabbes]

I’m interested in Spymaster ’s responses given his recent thread...

 

[Silas Loom]

No, I’ve not really mentioned it on here that I can recall. Maybe once or twice. I’d just found a year ago that I was reading a lot of related material on the subject and thought I’d do it properly. I am still working full time, but so far so good. In the end I fancy maybe going into research. Insurance is so dull, I need an escape route...

The grass may not be greener. I've been earning a meagre living from research for a score of years and it hasn't made me happy in the slightest. Everything is both dull and interesting when it is your work; pooled risk is one of civilisation's greatest achievements, up there with pipes for hot water and connectivity, so it's difficult to see anything else being as simultaneously socially useful and lucrative as insurance.

 

[TruXta]

I don't really agree with the binary response format here, as it forces extreme answers to what are quite nebulous questions.

 

[Thimble Queen]

I don't really agree with the binary response format here, as it forces extreme answers to what are quite nebulous questions.

Same.

 

[kabbes]

I don't really agree with the binary response format here, as it forces extreme answers to what are quite nebulous questions.

That's intentional, believe it or not.

 

[kabbes]

The grass may not be greener. I've been earning a meagre living from research for a score of years and it hasn't made me happy in the slightest. Everything is both dull and interesting when it is your work; pooled risk is one of civilisation's greatest achievements, up there with pipes for hot water and connectivity, so it's difficult to see anything else being as simultaneously socially useful and lucrative as insurance.

You're right, of course. It's not that insurance is boring, it's that I'm bored of having been in the same field for 20 years. I've never been intrinsically interested in finance in any way, and I want to do something I am actually interested by. And I'm lucky enough to be in a position where I can do it.

 

[Thimble Queen]

kabbes it's been years since I've done any psychology learning but this is Adorno/F scale right? Has their been a renewed interest in these ideas more recently?

 

[kabbes]

kabbes it's been years since I've done any psychology learning but this is Adorno/F scale right? Has their been a renewed interest in these ideas more recently?

God no. Just my own interest being piqued is all.

 

[Thimble Queen]

God no. Just my own interest being piqued is all.

These are the bits of psychology that always interested me... along with the famous experiments by Zimbardo, Millgram etc... the bystander apathy stuff. Fascinating.

 

[TruXta]

That's intentional, believe it or not.

Why do you intentionally want skewed responses?

 

[TruXta]

These are the bits of psychology that always interested me... along with the famous experiments by Zimbardo, Millgram etc... the bystander apathy stuff. Fascinating.

No love for behavioural analysis?

 

[TruXta]

You're right, of course. It's not that insurance is boring, it's that I'm bored of having been in the same field for 20 years. I've never been intrinsically interested in finance in any way, and I want to do something I am actually interested by. And I'm lucky enough to be in a position where I can do it.

You can make a fucking killing in the psychometrics field. Seriously. You'd be streets ahead of 99.99% of the competition in terms of statistical rigour too, should you so wish.

 

[discokermit]

the first question i took on a personal/class level as the only insults to my honour have been from employers. for these, every single slight, misword, fiddled penny etc., i hope to extract some form of violent revenge, if not on them individually, then them as a class.

 

[teuchter]

Because the questions are vague, the only sensible thing for anyone to do is to not agree with them.

For similar reasons I hardly ever agree to sign petitions.