Hillsborough Independent Panel findings and release of documents.

[DaveCinzano]

Poor, misunderstood South Yorks Police:

Avon & Somerset JBB ‏@ASPolfed 11m
Many of us were at school when Hillsborough occurred but press commentary takes no account of this.

SYPF ‏@SYPFederation
@ASPolfed many of our members were not born!

6:05 PM - 22 Oct 13

 

[ddraig]

aww the poor police forces getting picked on for what their previous officers did, really not fair

 

[butchersapron]

Unbelievable - Bettison was guest of Wolves chairman (who is himself ex-lfc) at Bradford last saturday.

 

[DaveCinzano]

Investigation into whether Nottingham Forest fans' accounts of Hillsborough were altered by police

...The commission has discovered that some Forest fans were among those who filled in questionnaires given to them by West Midlands Police, alongside large numbers of Liverpool fans, police and stewards.

Some of these accounts were later converted into official witness statements by the West Midlands force.

The IPCC has unearthed "inconsistencies" between some of the original questionnaire accounts and the later statements.

The commission is now launching an appeal for any Forest fans who completed the forms to come forward – and it still wants to talk to any other fans who saw events on the day...

http://www.nottinghampost.com/Inves...ans-accounts/story-20024887-detail/story.html

 

[Bernie Gunther]

<snip>

Someone put a thought into my head earlier - given the police infiltration etc of the Lawrence, Alder and other campaigns, when are we going to hear about the first similar hillsborough related activity?

It would be incredibly surprising if they hadn't done something like that given their extensive previous form.

 

[brogdale]

Looks like Hogan Howe has been dissembling wrt evidence of his role.

 

[butchersapron]

Looks like Hogan Howe has been dissembling wrt evidence of his role.

The Observer picking up on a story the Star was pushing nearly a year ago. I know Conn has done useful reporting on this (rather than investigation) he should be doing exactly what Corke at the Star (and i know they are in contact) has been doing.

 

[brogdale]

The Observer picking up on a story the Star was pushing nearly a year ago. I know Conn has done useful reporting on this (rather than investigation) he should be doing exactly what Corke at the Star (and i know they are in contact) has been doing.

Oh right.

Maybe the 'news' in the story is Hogan's "welcoming" of the IPCC inquiry into his role/evidence?

 

[butchersapron]

Oh right.

Maybe the 'news' in the story is Hogan's "welcoming" of the IPCC inquiry into his role/evidence?

Yes, and to be fair there has been a slight bit of movement in that HH now admits he was wrong to say he'd made a statement, whereas before he was just sitting tight-lipped.

 

[butchersapron]

Corke today suggests:

Jonathan Corke@JonathanCorke
Documents show Hogan-Howe apparently declining to give a #Hillsborough statement to @WMPolice investigator in 1990

 

[TopCat]

Oh right.

Maybe the 'news' in the story is Hogan's "welcoming" of the IPCC inquiry into his role/evidence?

He would welcome this with open arms. He can predict the process and the result.

 

[butchersapron]

It now appears that he said that he gave statements - plural - to the Taylor Inquiry. So his wriggling over having been confused over who he gave a single statement to is seriously undermined. One yes, ok, you've got yourself some wriggle room, more - no, you've got yourself some trouble.

edit: oh yeah, the challenge panel has now been established:

The independent panel, which will consist of three experts, will look at the progress being made in the inquiries by the IPCC and Operation Resolve.

The panel will consist of criminologists Dr Silvia Casale and Prof Roger Graef, and retired Court of Appeal judge, Sir Stephen Sedley.

Their task will be to work separately from the IPCC and Operation Resolve to ensure they meet key timescales and look at how they communicate with the families of the 96 who lost their lives in the 1989 disaster.

Sir Stephen is renowned as a legal essayist and made judgements in several high-profile cases during his long legal career.

In 1989 he penned an essay in support of transparency from the authorities and the public inquiry process.

New York-born Prof Graef made several hard-hitting films looking at police conduct and the impact of crime on victims, while Dr Casale is an international expert on human rights and the prevention of torture.

Earlier this year a review she led into the 2008 death in custody of Sean Rigg in Brixton, south London concluded police had used “unsuitable force” and that the IPCC had made basic mistakes in investigating the case,

 

[butchersapron]

Did Hillsborough police help cause crush outside ground?

But now the possibility is under consideration that police did not just respond poorly to the initial problem, but actively – if inadvertently – helped to create it, and may have tried to obscure the full facts.

Research by Dr Andrew Watt has compared the initial version of events given by Supt Roger Marshall, who was in overall charge of policing Liverpool supporters outside the ground, with accounts of officers under his command.

Dr Watt found that in a briefing with chief constable Peter Wright and other senior officers held at 9am on the day after the tragedy, Supt Marshall said that between 2.30pm and 2.45pm mounted officers and those on foot were “actually rounding up fans to get them into the ground. We were busy trying to shepherd fans towards the gate”.

Supt Marshall also refers, in his witness statement, to mounted officers “shepherding people” to the turnstile area.

Dr Watt said: “Supt Marshall seems to have told the officers under his control to herd fans towards the gates.

“The question needs to be answered as to whether it was officers under Supt Marshall's control who actively caused the crush that led to the Hillsborough disaster.

“I can't find any statement from the officers under Supt Marshall’s control that admits that the police herded fans towards the gates.

“All the statements I have read express mystification as to how the crush developed. It seems possible that those officers premeditatedly concealed the part their actions played in causing the Hillsborough disaster.”

 

[butchersapron]

This was in the Guardian yesterday:

Hogan-Howe's work with Hillsborough families was 'a shambles'

The Metropolitan police commissioner headed an operation dealing with bereaved families at the Hillsborough disaster which was "utter chaos" and "a shambles," according to a senior church figure who was involved in ministering to the families.

Stephen Lowe, then the archdeacon of Sheffield, said "there was no organisation, no information, no sense of the police working in partnership," at the Hillsborough boys' club where anxious families were kept waiting for news, which was overseen by Sir Bernard Hogan-Howe, then an inspector in the South Yorkshire police.

Lowe said one member of the clergy and one social worker were allocated to each family at the boys' club, but Hogan-Howe and his police officers kept themselves apart while providing no information about the many people missing.

"The inspector was not working as part of the team," said Lowe, who later became bishop of Hulme in Manchester. "There was no organisation – it was utter chaos, a shambles. The police were defensive; we could not get information; there was no sense of partnership or that they were there to help us do what was needed...

 

[laptop]

More...

Hillsborough: IPCC considers Hogan-Howe disaster role probe

The watchdog probing police conduct during the Hillsborough disaster could formally investigate a complaint about the Metropolitan Police Commissioner.

Sir Bernard Hogan-Howe, then a South Yorkshire police officer, was on duty at Sheffield Boys' Club where relatives waited for news of loved ones.

The IPCC said it had received a formal complaint from the family of a victim. It expects the London mayor's office to rule it should be investigated

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-24990791

* Awaits scalp *

 

[DaveCinzano]

Any further light on this? Just popped up on twitter feed today. Don't know anything about it.

The Sth Yorks Police induction prank that led to 96 deaths in 1989, as #Hillsborough match commander changed #jft96 pic.twitter.com/meZAusbq6R

https://twitter.com/wrong_kennedy/status/404605960368304128/photo/1

 

[laptop]

Any further light on this? Just popped up on twitter feed today. Don't know anything about it.


https://twitter.com/wrong_kennedy/status/404605960368304128/photo/1

I don't follow. Is it that the Inspector who was suspended for the prank was due to be commander at the match, and would somehow have done it right?

 

[Smyz]

I don't follow. Is it that the Inspector who was suspended for the prank was due to be commander at the match, and would somehow have done it right?

Duckenfield had no experience of policing matches.

Are they saying that he replaced one of those suspended?

 

[butchersapron]

Superintendent Brian Mole was moved because officers he was in charge of pulled that prank. Duckenfield then replaced him. (This isn't new stuff btw Scraton wrote of it many times before)

 

[butchersapron]

Russell Brand is donating his fee for this article to the Justice for the 96 campaign

(Not read the story, seems to be a waffly attack on the Sun)

 

[laptop]

Russell Brand is donating his fee for this article to the Justice for the 96 campaign

(Not read the story, seems to be a waffly attack on the Sun)

Quite an entertaining one:

Rupert Murdoch, an animatronic al-Qaida recruitment poster...

 

[butchersapron]

Operation Resolve

Site for the criminal investigation into Hillsborough. This is the Stoddart one.

 

[butchersapron]

9 former SYP officers have refused to attend interviews over allegations of statement altering. They can only be compelled to attend if criminal suspect.

 

[Favelado]

9 former SYP officers have refused to attend interviews over allegations of statement altering. They can only be compelled to attend if criminal suspect.

I'm going to take a cynical guess that we don't even get to find out who they are.

 

[butchersapron]

I'm going to take a cynical guess that we don't even get to find out who they are.

Well, Operation Resolve the criminal investigation has just kicked off - let's see what they do about this. People in the know are suggesting that the IPCC inquiry will be dragged out until 2018 in order to allow a whole host of officers to retire. As 40 have already done so in the year since the independent panel reported back.

 

[butchersapron]

More shortly:

Jonathan Corke@JonathanCorke
Solicitors acting for 20 #Hillsborough families have accused @IPCCNews of "impeding us in our efforts to properly prepare for the inquest.."

Potentially massive, potentially playing into the game of dragging it out.

 

[Favelado]

I've said it before but thanks for these updates. Some of the things you are catching I am missing elsewhere and they also save me a trawl through RAWK.

 

[butchersapron]

The solicitors asked @IPCCNews for names of officers identified by #Hillsborough Independent Panel as having altered statements. They say @IPCCNews has refused the request and say it is "another example of the IPCC stonewalling"

Remember what we said above about officers refusing and retiring?

 

[butchersapron]

I've said it before but thanks for these updates. Some of the things you are catching I am missing elsewhere and they also save me a trawl through RAWK.

More than welcome mate. There's a real fight going on that the fuckers think they can win if it's kept secret - let's stop that happening.

 

[belboid]

Anne Williams will get the Helen Rollason award at SPOTY on Sunday.

http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/sports-personality/25357425