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Hadley's reveal new stadium design

I think these Byzantine ownership issues show why we need a fan owned club. And as far as I can see, there's only one way we're going to get that in the foreseeable. Unless some benefactor with the club's interests at heart buys the current stadium. And I don't see that happening. What's Rio Ferdinand up to these days?
 
Greendale Property / Owners and Funders

Meadows Partners: 75% Shareholder
- Project lead by J Andrew McDaniel

Simon Benedict - Northfleet Ltd (Isle of Man) 25% Shareholder
- Previously 100% Owner of Champion Hill Stadium > Sold 75% to Meadows Partners late 2013.

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Hadley Property Group

  • Previously co-owned and led by Peter Bennison
  • Previous Development Managers from 2013
  • No longer involved in Champion Hill Stadium from early 2016
Meadows Residential (new company July 15)
  • Lead and owned by Peter Bennison and Meadows and Partners (J Andrew McDaniel)
  • Peter took Champion Hill and few other projects from Hadley early 2016
  • New Development Managers for Dulwich Hamlet
  • Responsible for Dulwich Hamlet FC Financial Operations - Keeley Birch
Healey Development Solutions (new company October 15)
  • Receives All Bar Income
  • Receives All Rent Income from various businesses at Dulwich
Dulwich Hamlet FC Ltd
- Owned by Nick McCormack, Run by Meadows.
- Receives all match day income, (except for the Bar income)
- Receives FA prize money and Transfer fees
- Receives all Sponsorship
 
So to summarise.

DHFC is owned by someone that presided over us nearly being put of business at least once.

The freehold to the ground is owned by a property company that have no obligation to grant us a new lease.

Without a lease we cannot play football at Champion Hill in the Isthmian league.

We are trying to influence an application for planning permission to Southwark council.

The two "friends" groups object to the application and argue that the case that there is no proof that the future of the club is in doubt.

I think the first two points display whether they care about what happens to DHFC more than adequately.

Dont worry lads. Stick to your principles!
 
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We do not own anything and have no power. Champion Hill belongs to them, and they can shut it down if and when they want.
How I see it, our only option is to work with the owners.

The restrictive covenant only safeguards the facility, not the Hamlet? or does it protect us?
 
latest
 
So to summarise.

DHFC is owned by someone that presided over us nearly being put of business at least once.

The freehold to the ground is owned by a property company that have no obligation to grant us a new lease.

Without a lease we cannot play football at Champion Hill in the Isthmian league.

We are trying to influence an application for planning permission to Southwark council.

The two "friends" groups object to the application and argue that the case that there is no proof that the future of the club is in doubt.

I think the first two points display whether they care about what happens to DHFC more than adequately.

Dont worry lads. Stick to your principles!
So what are you saying? Fans should support everything and anything that the developers propose because they say we'll get a (small) ground out of it, and therefore fans should cast any doubts to the wind and clap along enthusiastically to anything that is suggested.

Personally I think it's vital that this deal is examined in great detail, research undertaken and company structures investigated before agreeing to anything. The way the company is already morphing into a new one should already send alarm bells ringing,

Developers shit on people all the time, so I wouldn't rely on them giving a flying fuck whether Hamlet exist or not. In fact if they could find a way of getting rid of the ground and adding more luxury flats, they'd do it in a heartbeat.
 
We do not own anything and have no power. Champion Hill belongs to them, and they can shut it down if and when they want.
Do you know this for an absolute fact? How might closing the club down in a hissy fit sit with Southwark and their multimillion planning application?
 
I didn't say they were lovely. I said they were a "proper" construction company. They build millions and millions of pounds worth of construction every year. Not like Hadley or Meadows.

If they wanted to build us a ground it would be more likely to get done.
It won't be up to Muse whether we get a ground or not.
 
Do you know this for an absolute fact? How might closing the club down in a hissy fit sit with Southwark and their multimillion planning application?

We know it for a fact. If they closed down the club it would prevent them from using us a bargaining chip. But at the same time they could sell it to a company willing to wait until the covenant could be removed or they could wait themselves.
 
So what are you saying? Fans should support everything and anything that the developers propose because they say we'll get a (small) ground out of it, and therefore fans should cast any doubts to the wind and clap along enthusiastically to anything that is suggested.

Personally I think it's vital that this deal is examined in great detail, research undertaken and company structures investigated before agreeing to anything. The way the company is already morphing into a new one should already send alarm bells ringing,

Developers shit on people all the time, so I wouldn't rely on them giving a flying fuck whether Hamlet exist or not. In fact if they could find a way of getting rid of the ground and adding more luxury flats, they'd do it in a heartbeat.

All we can do is try and influence the development. If they do not get their way they have total control and power over us as a club.

Feel free to not engage with the facts.
 
We know it for a fact. If they closed down the club it would prevent them from using us a bargaining chip. But at the same time they could sell it to a company willing to wait until the covenant could be removed or they could wait themselves.
I don't think anyone knows the full story here, least of all you despite your bluster.

Sorry, but I don't blindly share your faith in the promises of morphing offshore property developers chasing multi million deals and won't be enthusiastically pledging my support just because I think, maybe, possibly, they'll stick to their word.

Offering such unquestioning, unilateral support inevitably ends up in getting royally shafted.

The way they're already trying to wriggle out of their social/affordable housing commitments should tell most people about their actual 'commitment' to the local community. I'm all for working with them, but not in the puppy dog we'll-do-anything-you-say-sir way you seem to be advocating.

And I fucking hope there's a Plan B to all of this.
 
Do you know this for an absolute fact? How might closing the club down in a hissy fit sit with Southwark and their multimillion planning application?
I don't have any faith in Southwark going out of the way to protect us. Whatever they say publicly, a load of shiny expensive flats is going to be a bigger source of income to them via ouncil tax, etc than 'affordable' social housing or a football club. It's why time and time again we see local councils failing to enforce quotas.
 
I don't have any faith in Southwark going out of the way to protect us. Whatever they say publicly, a load of shiny expensive flats is going to be a bigger source of income to them via ouncil tax, etc than 'affordable' social housing or a football club. It's why time and time again we see local councils failing to enforce quotas.
I have more faith in Southwark than whatever the mighty morphin' developers are currently called. Not much, mind, but definitely more. They did, after all, recently become the first council to protect over 120 pubs in their borough, and pubs are what developers are expert at destroying.
 
I don't think anyone knows the full story here, least of all you despite your bluster.

Sorry, but I don't blindly share your faith in the promises of morphing offshore property developers chasing multi million deals and won't be enthusiastically pledging my support just because I think, maybe, possibly, they'll stick to their word.

Offering such unquestioning, unilateral support inevitably ends up in getting royally shafted.

The way they're already trying to wriggle out of their social/affordable housing commitments should tell most people about their actual 'commitment' to the local community. I'm all for working with them, but not in the puppy dog we'll-do-anything-you-say-sir way you seem to be advocating.

And I fucking hope there's a Plan B to all of this.

Bluster? We are owned as a club by Nick McCormack. The freehold is owned by a property company. This is the full story except there was/is an option for a property company to buy the Football Club from Nick McCormack.

I'm not advocating a we will do anything they will say sir attitude. The fact you think I am makes me question your intelligence.

We have no actual control over our future. All we can do is seem to exert influence over the potential outcomes.

I don't care about anything other than a secure future for DHFC and as good a ground as we can get.

There certainly is no Plan A or Plan B as we HAVE NO CONTROL OR POWER.

As I said, stick to your theories and principles if you like, but we could be denied a new lease at the end of the term and no one could do anything...
 
I have more faith in Southwark than whatever the mighty morphin' developers are currently called. Not much, mind, but definitely more. They did, after all, recently become the first council to protect over 120 pubs in their borough, and pubs are what developers are expert at destroying.
I have little faith in any of the parties involved in all this,
I have more faith in Southwark than whatever the mighty morphin' developers are currently called. Not much, mind, but definitely more. They did, after all, recently become the first council to protect over 120 pubs in their borough, and pubs are what developers are expert at destroying.
Pretty sure that was Wandsworth, and all they've done is issue Article 4 Directives, which simply compels a formal planning application, which is needed in any case for change of use. So it's kinda something and nothing, I don't think it will put much in the way of the nauseating march of luxury flats. But by the by, the point B.I.G is making, and I agree with him, is that we really have no control over any aspect of this. We flatter ourselves that we have influence to bear and we will have a new stadium and we will fan own it and run it as we like, but the grim reality is we will get what we are given. And there will be a few more twists to come I suspect.
 
Did you advocate supporting the planning application?

I didn't advocate anything, the trust are doing the best they can trying to influence. James Masini is doing his best to advise on protecting the stadium. Al Crane is doing his best liaising with the the owners and freeholders. All the members of the trust board are doing their best.

The football committee are also doing their best.

I am advocating that everyone understands the situation we are in and have been ever since the lease became close to expiring, and ever since we were owned by anyone that nearly put us out of business.

All we can do is influence, you can influence more than many through your media presence. But don't ever think we can't be put out of business, because that's bullshit pedalled by these friends groups.
 
so the bar profits go to hadley development solutions . so all the hassle frustration and anger that i experience there helps the club not one jot . in fact , i'd do the club more good going to the cherry tree and trying to persuade them to sponsor the match ball now and again . ab-so-bloody-lutely marvellous
 
so the bar profits go to hadley development solutions . so all the hassle frustration and anger that i experience there helps the club not one jot . in fact , i'd do the club more good going to the cherry tree and trying to persuade them to sponsor the match ball now and again . ab-so-bloody-lutely marvellous

This is not necessarily true. Even under a supporters owned club, it would make sense for the bar to be owned by a different company, albeit with the same identical ownership structure.

I don't know how the two interact or whether more money goes to the club if more is spent there as that depends on the arrangement.
 
who knows what Southwark will do ? pretty much fucked the aylesbury/heygate up . they seem as labyrinthine as the developers . don't forget that sadiq khan may also want his twopen'orth ( cf. cray wanderers )
 
Just thought I'd pipe up and chuck in a few straighteners. I'm a local resident, a hamlet fan and a member of both Friends of Greendale and Friends of DKHwood. I'm amazed by your slow realisation of the shit that's coming on and sorry to hear you all turning on your neighbours who don't agree with you.

First, both friends groups have always been very clear they support the Hamlet and value it. This is a genuine support for a neighbour and because many of the members are Hamlet fans. They are however wildlife groups that were set up to support the open green spaces and so, naturally they object to a development plan that builds on Metropolitan Open Land and sticks a massive housing development next door, particularly when it's the same block of MOL that they both sit within. It's clearly something to do with them. It is true, they are not thinking Hamlet first though.

Second, neither group have been "spreading misinformation". In fact, if these groups had not found the latest planning application and told everyone about it, none of you would have known about the latest application to remove the covenants and it would have gone through without comment. I bet those of you who've been keeping up with all the developments probably actually use the FODKHW website, as it has a fantastic and easy to navigate collection of documents and links pertaining to the case. Take a look if you haven't. Do you not put a bit of spin on things yourselves? The Greendale is clearly well loved locally but you all keep slagging it as a dog shit scrap of derelict land.

So where are we now as fans? The MOU, which incidentally has virtually no legal merit, is signed by a made up wing of Hadley who have since handed over the whole project to a more aggressive and I'm assuming ironically named 'Meadows' development, who's first job was to sneak a planning application in making it possible to build on the pitch without blinking an eye. These people are property developers. They are interested in profit, not green spaces, not community and not the Hamlet. Yes, they bailed us out when we needed them but football clubs at our level do tend to run on empty most of the time as I see it, and just maybe they had ulterior motives?

I notice Mishi, you haven't written in supporting the latest application. They are all objections so far, even the DHST one. ..."100% behind it. I've supported this club man and boy, forty years of my life and I'm willing to risk the lot on some developer promises, 'cause they said we could have a new stadium." Well, as I see it, you're risking the whole bloody club for a new but smaller stadium with tiny terraces and no room behind the goals. Yes, we want fan ownership, but I think this can be achieved through a proper conversation with the council that explores the options rather than getting in bed with the devil. Who's the rimmer now?

I haven't written in because, simply I do not understand it legally. I personally believe that the developers are opening up a platform for mistrust, whether valid or not, by not talking to both the supporters & club officials about this first, out of what I would call 'common courtesy'.

Not sure who you're quoting in that last paragraph, seems like you're trying to twist my words to suit your argument...but there you go, people can read into that whatever they want.

And as I've said many a time before, firstly the Club would not be here today without the developers' input, be that Hadley or Meadows, so no I do not see it as 'putting the club at risk'...I want the Club to survive & prosper, which is why I support the new ground development, and believe that is the only way we will get supporter ownership.

I fail to understand how involving the council will get supporter ownership. They do not own the ground or the club.

And,sorry, you've totally lost me with your last comment: Who's the rimmer now?
 
Pretty sure that was Wandsworth, and all they've done is issue Article 4 Directives, which simply compels a formal planning application, which is needed in any case for change of use.
Yeah, you're right, damn. What happened at Heygate was criminal.
 
Didn't Kevin Rye tell us all "Football clubs are un-killable really"?
Like everyone else Kevin Rye has an opinion. He does not represent anyone connected to the Football Club, per se. He was acting a consultant, brought in by the Hadley group, because of his previous experience at Supporters' Direct.
 
We've been here before with "the Club will die if we don't accept the developers' scheme". Here's the Southwark News, Sept 23rd 1999 in response to the failed Homebase plan:
View attachment 96068
Yes...and your point is?
THE Club would have died if Hadley had not stepped in to stabilise and clear the bills. Therefore, as far as I am concerned, the worries back then were valid and proved.
 
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