Gun nut fruitloop Alex Jones goes completely bananas at Piers Morgan on TV

[weltweit]

I don't think he actually believes his own shit either. It's all about the money. Some of these guys get daily rides to work in a limo as part of their contract.

Hmmpfh .... I heard that Phil Jupitus off Never Mind The Buzzcocks has a BBC driver ...

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

I think he broadly believes it, but that his schtick is also consciously a performance. I certainly think if he 'found some research' that was damning to his show's sponsors then it would be curiously deprioritised.

I'd buy that. Also, if he had to argue with only logic and facts, he'd lose.

 

[elbows]

Its all theatre ladies and gentlemen.

 

[8ball]

Its all theatre ladies and gentlemen.

I don't accept that, I really think he believes it's theatre in the interests of pursuing a noble goal.

 

[butchersapron]

I don't accept that, I really think he believes it's theatre in the interests of pursuing a noble goal.

Do you also think the PG chimps fucking loved that shit?

 

[8ball]

Do you also think the PG chimps fucking loved that shit?

It's easy to believe someone is just some kind of shill when they come out with complete bollocks but some people are just deluded.

 

[butchersapron]

It's easy to believe someone is just some kind of shill when they come out with complete bollocks but some people are just deluded.

Indeed. I don't think this is the case here. It's a commercial model operation.

 

[8ball]

Indeed. I don't think this is the case here. It's a commercial model operation.

Do you have any evidence for this?

Genuinely interested.

 

[butchersapron]

Do you have any evidence for this?

Genuinely interested.

Beyond his performance looking hammy as anything and the massive commercial operation built on the back of it - no. What's convinced you that he is genuine?

 

[8ball]

Beyond his performance looking hammy as anything and the massive commercial operation built on the back of it - no.

So nothing, then.

 

[danny la rouge]

Are you saying that it's ok for people to laugh and makes jokes about fatal events in which they did not directly suffer a connection to loss of life?

No.

 

[frogwoman]

Yep. and all the more repellent for that.

 

[butchersapron]

So nothing, then.

Apart from the things that i mentioned. Hammy performances like his to me don't indicate great belief, they suggest playing to an already captured audience and their expectations. The sort of pre-sale modelling of what the consumer you want to appeal to that commercial undertakings do everyday. I think i've at least offered an argument (might not be great but unless we're finding plans detailing anything else it's all we can have) by analogy and experience. Whereas you just ignored the question of what leads you to think that he's genuine.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

Indeed. I don't think this is the case here. It's a commercial model operation.

I always remember a book Palladin Press used to carry. It was a how-to book on how to fake being a psychic and make money scamming off it.

 

[camouflage]

Yeah, its all a put on for the camera. That apoplectic rage isn't real. It seems to be one of the styles that's popular on right ring radio. If you listen to Michael Savage, for instance, he goes off on rages that have little to do with sanity and everything to do with ratings too.

 

[8ball]

Apart from the things that i mentioned. Hammy performances like his to me don't indicate great belief, they suggest playing to an already captured audience and their expectations. The sort of pre-sale modelling of what the consumer you want to appeal to that commercial undertakings do everyday. I think i've at least offered an argument (might not be great but unless we're finding plans detailing anything else it's all we can have) by analogy and experience. Whereas you just ignored the question of what leads you to think that he's genuine.

I ignored the question until you answered mine.

Happy to answer yours - I'd relate it to my personal experience and also research into people who consider themselves 'psychics'.

Many of them will do things like:
i) Crassly link their sites to affiliated products they haven't really checked out.
ii) 'Cheat' (even to their own definition) when it suits them.
iii) Ham up their performance in all manner of barmy ways.
iv) Use both cold-reading and hot-reading techniques, both consciously and unconsciously.

Nevertheless, most of these people genuinely believe they have 'a gift', genuinely believe they are helping people and are basically sincere.

Sure, there's going to be a bit of cognitive dissonance going on, but the points you have made do not in themselves suggest to me that anything different is going on with Alex Jones. His 'gift' is his ability to see through the bullshit and bring the truth to the sheeple.

I could, of course, be completely wrong and he could be a 100% cynical shyster - I was wondering whether you had anything on him beyond 'this all smells a bit rum', though.

 

[frogwoman]

I ignored the question until you answered mine.

Happy to answer yours - I'd relate it to my personal experience and also research into people who consider themselves 'psychics'.

Many of them will do things like:
i) Crassly link their sites to affiliated products they haven't really checked out.
ii) 'Cheat' (even to their own definition) when it suits them.
iii) Ham up their performance in all manner of barmy ways.
iv) Use both cold-reading and hot-reading techniques, both consciously and unconsciously.

Nevertheless, most of these people genuinely believe they have 'a gift', genuinely believe they are helping people and are basically sincere.

Sure, there's going to be a bit of cognitive dissonance going on, but the points you have made do not in themselves suggest to me that anything different is going on with Alex Jones. His 'gift' is his ability to see through the bullshit and bring the truth to the sheeple.

I could, of course, be completely wrong and he could be a 100% cynical shyster - I was wondering whether you had anything on him beyond 'this all smells a bit rum', though.

so he believes his own bullshit and he's doing it for the money. the two are not mutually exclusive.

 

[Citizen66]

I don't accept that, I really think he believes it's theatre in the interests of pursuing a noble goal.

The noble goal being: lining his pockets.

 

[Remus Harbank]

Apart from the things that i mentioned. Hammy performances like his to me don't indicate great belief, they suggest playing to an already captured audience and their expectations. The sort of pre-sale modelling of what the consumer you want to appeal to that commercial undertakings do everyday. I think i've at least offered an argument (might not be great but unless we're finding plans detailing anything else it's all we can have) by analogy and experience. Whereas you just ignored the question of what leads you to think that he's genuine.

Jones is a lightning conductor.

 

[frogwoman]

spreading anti-semitic filth and paranoia about vaccines etc in pursuit of lining his pockets. and so what if he does believe it? Like that changes anything.

 

[8ball]

so he believes his own bullshit and he's doing it for the money. the two are not mutually exclusive.

Damn straight.

 

[butchersapron]

so he believes his own bullshit and he's doing it for the money. the two are not mutually exclusive.

That's exactly what 8ball is saying. And he's right that there is no reason why they should be.I just think he isn't real. And the real question is not about his fakeness but what his popularity represents socially (and what it re/produces - the paranoia style of politics).

 

[frogwoman]

yep.

 

[elbows]

'He's a great actor':



Alex back in the 90's:

 

[butchersapron]

'He's a great actor':

is there a reference in that first vid to the utterly crap story linked to on the savile thread last week? The tutu stuff?

 

[elbows]

is there a reference in that first vid to the utterly crap story linked to on the savile thread last week? The tutu stuff?

Yeah I think so, or if not its exactly the same sort of thing. Insert Nixon tape comment about faggy stuff at the grove here.

 

[8ball]

That's exactly what 8ball is saying. And he's right that there is no reason why they should be.I just think he isn't real. And the real question is not about his fakeness but what his popularity represents socially (and what it re/produces - the paranoia style of politics).

Fair enough if your instinct is that he's not 'for real' (or rather, that he's 'completely not for real' in the L. Ron Hubbard mould).

I think his popularity is just down to the normal social forces that nudge some people towards conspiraloonery and cults of various other kinds, including religious cults. Not that I've really examined and thought about him specifically - I'm just talking about him as part of that general mileu.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

I really hate it when I hear radio freaks telling people not to vaccinate their kids. It may make them money, but there's a cost:

The number of babies who have died in the biggest outbreak of whooping cough for 20 years has increased to 10, health officials said.


There were 1,322 confirmed cases in England and Wales in September alone, 200 more than the total figure for 2011 when there were 1,118 cases, the Health Protection Agency (HPA) said.

There were 6,121 confirmed cases between January and September this year, the HPA said.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...ping-cough-outbreak-for-20-years-8225987.html

 

[8ball]

I really hate it when I hear radio freaks telling people not to vaccinate their kids. It may make them money, but there's a cost.

I believe that's what an economist would call 'an externality'.

 

[elbows]

One of the things that may sometimes be missing from a UK appreciation of this sort of thing is the history of late night talk radio in America. I'm not going to go on about it too much now, but I will say that Art Bell and Coast to Coast AM is perhaps the classic example.

Of particular note is the way this stuff evolved both in terms of entertainment/ratings and also to avoid political heat. Check this example from his wikipedia page for an example that could not be clearer:

Bell abandoned conventional political talk in favor of topics such as gun control and conspiracy theories, leading to a significant bump in his overnight ratings. The show's focus again shifted significantly after the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995. Many in the media did not want to be blamed for inciting anti-government or militia actions like the bombing. Subsequently, Bell discussed off-beat topics like the paranormal, the occult, UFOs, protoscience and pseudo-science.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_Bell