Greek elections

[trabant]

..and for how for ties in with (allows? demands? is consistent with?) a form of national democracy:

The neoliberal revolution left almost nothing of this. Its objective was to trim the states of postwar capitalism as much as possible, reducing them to providing for the functioning and expansion of markets and making them institutionally incapable of corrective intervention in the self-regulating enforcement of market justice. Its full triumph, however, came only with the internationalization of the European political economy and the conversion of the European system of states into a multilevel regime with nationally confined democracy and multinationally organized financial markets and supervisory authorities – a configuration that has long proved an ideal vehicle for the neutralization of political pressure from below while expanding the realm of private contractual freedom vis-à-vis the state. The latest phase of this development is the ongoing transition from the national debt state to the international consolidation state. With it the Hayekian blueprint of a liberalized capitalist market economy immune from political pressure finally comes close to full realization.3

Thanks for the link to that book btw. Im about to start the last chapter and its joined a lot of different ideas in my mind into something coherent..

 

[butchersapron]

Thanks for the link to that book btw. Im about to start the last chapter and its joined a lot of different ideas in my mind into something coherent..

It's description of what is taking place is really powerful and presented in simple no messing language.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

How/Why?

Are you actually reading any of this thread...and then thinking about what you've read?

Louis MacNeice

 

[Diamond]

Are you actually reading any of this thread...and then thinking about what you've read?

Louis MacNeice

I want to know why the elected finance ministers of the Eurogroup are undemocratic.

 

[Santino]

I want to know why the elected finance ministers of the Eurogroup are undemocratic.

Either stop this or I will hound you out.

 

[Diamond]

Either stop this or I will hound you out.

Very perspicacious and on point.

 

[Athos]

 

[belboid]

'Moral hazard' - the twat

 

[belboid]

And now he's just making things up - 'no reforms'?? Bollocks

 

[Louis MacNeice]

I want to know why the elected finance ministers of the Eurogroup are undemocratic.

Okay I get it...so either you haven't been reading the thread, or you've deliberately chosen to ignoire what you've read. I'll leave you to it.

Louis MacNeice

 

[Athos]

Okay I get it...so either you haven't been reading the thread, or you've deliberately chosen to ignoire what you've read. I'll leave you to it.

Louis MacNeice

There's a third (and, in my opinion, more likely) explanation: he read it, but, rather than deliberately ignoring it, simply doesn't understand it. Either way, you've come the the same intention as most serious contributors to this thread.

 

[Diamond]

Okay I get it...so either you haven't been reading the thread, or you've deliberately chosen to ignoire what you've read. I'll leave you to it.

Louis MacNeice

Can you explain in one sentence why the elected finance ministers of 19 European countries are undemocratic?

 

[Diamond]

There's a third (and, in my opinion, more likely) explanation: he read it, but, rather than deliberately ignoring it, simply doesn't understand it. Either way, you've come the the same intention as most serious contributors to this thread.

"Serious contributors" - back with your tiresome pomposity again, I see.

 

[maomao]

Can you explain in one sentence why the elected finance ministers of 19 European countries are undemocratic?

Why should anyone bother trying to distil several pages of discussion into one sentence for someone who can neither be arsed to read it nor knows enough about the subject to know that there aren't 19 countries with elected finance ministers in the Eurozone.

 

[killer b]

Yeah, but he asked a valid question, got some replies and now appears to have accepted the reality of the situation. His mind is being blown....

see?

 

[brogdale]

I want to know why the elected finance ministers of the Eurogroup are undemocratic.

You have been told already. If you don't agree, fine. Otherwise stop the fucking whinging.

 

[brogdale]

see?

yeah....I know.

 

[belboid]

Can you explain in one sentence why the elected finance ministers of 19 European countries are undemocratic?

maybe something to do with how the rules are set out, which are anti-democratic. And the fact that Germany (and France_ both break the 'rules' regularly, but face no penalties because they're....well, because they're the boss

 

[Diamond]

Why should anyone bother trying to distil several pages of discussion into one sentence for someone who can neither be arsed to read it nor knows enough about the subject to know that there aren't 19 countries with elected finance ministers in the Eurozone.

So how many elected finance ministers are in the eurogroup of the eurozone?

 

[Diamond]

You have been told already. If you don't agree, fine. Otherwise stop the fucking whinging.

Is this the normal way that you approach debate?

 

[Diamond]

maybe something to do with how the rules are set out, which are anti-democratic. And the fact that Germany (and France_ both break the 'rules' regularly, but face no penalties because they're....well, because they're the boss

How are the rules anti-democratic?

Which rules, specifically are anti-democratic and why?

 

[belboid]

How are the rules anti-democratic?

Which rules, specifically are anti-democratic and why?

The ones we've been talking about for the last 118 pages.

I note you've no reply to the fact that the rules only apply to the poorer countries (which is, by definition, undemocratic)

 

[Athos]

Is this the normal way that you approach debate?

Demonstrably, it's not - look at his contributions to discussions with others. I suspect he's another example of someone who treats you as a 'special case'.

Please stop shitting on this otherwise excellent thread.

 

[Diamond]

The ones we've been talking about for the last 118 pages.

I note you've no reply to the fact that the rules only apply to the poorer countries (which is, by definition, undemocratic)

Structurally the currency union is unsound, I certainly agree with that for all the obvious reasons around a lack of fiscal and, more largely, political union but saying it is undemocratic is simply wrong.

The Euro is the direct construct of democracies.

Every single member of the eurogroup is a democratically elected politician.

 

[Diamond]

Demonstrably, it's not - look at his contributions to discussions with others. I suspect he's another example of someone who treats you as a 'special case'.

Please stop shitting on this otherwise excellent thread.

By "shitting on" do you mean disagreeing with people you like?

 

[Santino]

Before posting - STOP.

Think once, think twice - is it Diamond?

 

[Athos]

By "shitting on" do you mean disagreeing with people you like?

No, I mean dragging the debate down to sub-A-level politics nonsense.

Seriously, haven't you got any work to do? I know you've been shuffled out of harm's way, but someone there must have something they could trust you with?

 

[Diamond]

No, I mean dragging the debate down to sub-A-level politics nonsense.

Seriously, haven't you got any work to do? I know you've been shuffled out of harm's way, but someone there must have something they could trust you with?

Pomposity reigns free again.

Two of the most self-regarding posters on this forum or probably any other fora take off and reach for the skies...

 

[belboid]

Structurally the currency union is unsound, I certainly agree with that for all the obvious reasons around a lack of fiscal and, more largely, political union but saying it is undemocratic is simply wrong.

The Euro is the direct construct of democracies.

Every single member of the eurogroup is a democratically elected politician.

So anything that democracies do is de facto democratic?

Godwin is seriously due an appearance

 

[brogdale]

Is this the normal way that you approach debate?

'Debate', if that's what you want, involves both sides of an argument being proposed. I've put mine; you've just spouted some sub sixth-form questions. By all means explain to us how the bodies and institutions of the EU are 'democratic'.

Otherwise do consider SingTFU.