Goldsmiths University Diversity officer facing sack

[DotCommunist]

Look like behave like a woman woman
Look like behave like a man man

Their maybe people who fall in the middle shouldnt really be too much of an issue

intersex/third sex?

 

[cesare]

Do you need to point it out even when I have acknowledged it and even though the debate is clearly not about these groups? What are you trying to establish?

You gave a nod to it earlier in the thread, but then proceeded to decide that the debate wasn't about these groups. It is about these groups as well.

 

[CNT36]

No idea who that is or why anyone here would be giving them a hard time tbh.

View attachment 71649

I looked but I am pretty shit at Twitter and couldn't see much going on especially considering the vileness people spout over shit like this. Also -

SilenceoftheSams @SamAmbreen · 18h18 hours ago
If it was possible to need more reason to #supportbaharmustafa then maybe this is it? http://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/goldsmiths-university-diversity-officer-facing-sack.335058/…

0 retweets0 favorites

And I think this means me for posting that dig of hers yesterday.

SilenceoftheSams @SamAmbreen · 18h18 hours ago
Of course I get a mention from my hate crush fanclub. Did I not say they stalk my TL? *buffs nails*

Assuming a TL is a twitter profile I'm not sure how I am stalking it. I rarely use twitter more than once a week and usually it is a monthly indulgence. I think yesterday I visited her after seeing she had posted on a hashtag. Maybe you're the stalker. Feel free to explain/comment Sam Ambreen

 

[Dowie]

I am not "justifying my position by referring to men and oppression carried out by them". I was criticising your facile description of women who object to trans women in women only space as being "hung up about sexual organs". I was pointing out that those sexual organs have a significant place in feminist critiques of women's oppression, therefore this is not just some little "hang up". That place revolves around trying to understand why so many men have ended up oppressing women so insistently for so long that it has become a normal part of most human cultures (over recent centuries). You can't simply wipe this context away or trivialise it

Have you now accepted this? You keep ignoring it.

I've not ignored it, I've replied several times pointing out that transwomen aren't men. Pointing out that transwomen were raised as men and were born as men then banging on about oppression of women by men really isn't relevant. Some transwomen still have male sexual organs, so what... are they OK then if they've had surgery?

 

[TopCat]

Sam won't post here. It's not a safe space. People challenge stuff, use logic and that.

 

[Dowie]

Would you accept a non-trans person describing a trans person's desire to transition as "just having a hang up about sexual organs"? That is equivalent trivialisation (I'd argue it might be less so) - another question you haven't answered.

I wouldn't say that is the equivalent no. In that case someone is making a decision about their own body and how it conforms to their identity, in the other scenario someone else is making a judgement about another person's body that may not be relevant to that person's identity.

 

[8ball]

Sam won't post here. It's not a safe space. People challenge stuff, use logic and that.

"Safe space" seems to have a wide semantic range.

 

[CNT36]

Sam won't post here. It's not a safe space. People challenge stuff, use logic and that.

I probably wouldn't be to keen either to be fair especially after the banned users started calling her out on twitter.

 

[Athos]

I've not ignored it, I've replied several times pointing out that transwomen aren't men. Pointing out that transwomen were raised as men and were born as men then banging on about oppression of women by men really isn't relevant. Some transwomen still have male sexual organs, so what... are they OK then if they've had surgery?

You seem genuinely baffled that people haven't accepted your bold assertions notwithstanding that you've "pointed out" things "several times".

 

[killer b]

I looked but I am pretty shit at Twitter and couldn't see much going on especially considering the vileness people spout over shit like this. Also -


And I think this means me for posting that dig of hers yesterday.

Assuming a TL is a twitter profile I'm not sure how I am stalking it. I rarely use twitter more than once a week and usually it is a monthly indulgence. I think yesterday I visited her after seeing she had posted on a hashtag. Maybe you're the stalker. Feel free to explain/comment Sam Ambreen

Just ignore her. Seriously, why give her the satisfaction?

 

[Dowie]

You seem genuinely baffled that people haven't accepted your bold assertions notwithstanding that you've "pointed out" things "several times".

I'm not baffled that the other poster hasn't accepted it, I'm baffled by the claim I've not answered the question, seemingly because I've not accepted the point made by the other posted. I've answered the question several times...

 

[dynamicbaddog]

I'm a student at Goldsmiths and Bahar has my unconditional solidarity. She is an excellent Welfare and Diversity officer, and this is reflected in the fact that she has been elected to that post twice in a row. As things stand there are all sorts of cutbacks looming for students, for instance all the dyslexia tutors are being forced to re apply for their jobs, one to one mentoring might not exist next academic year plus there is the threat of cuts to the allowances granted to disabled students. Bahar has been extremely vocal in opposing all of this - no wonder management hate her and have aided the media shitstorm that has been whipped up.

 

[Dowie]

But the media shit storm hasn't had anything to do with her being vocal about cuts, granted management might not like her but do you not think the media attention is partly her own fault given what was posted even after she first gained attention in the press?

 

[cesare]

I'm a student at Goldsmiths and Bahar has my unconditional solidarity. She is an excellent Welfare and Diversity officer, and this is reflected in the fact that she has been elected to that post twice in a row. As things stand there are all sorts of cutbacks looming for students, for instance all the dyslexia tutors are being forced to re apply for their jobs, one to one mentoring might not exist next academic year plus there is the threat of cuts to the allowances granted to disabled students. Bahar has been extremely vocal in opposing all of this - no wonder management hate her and have aided the media shitstorm that has been whipped up.

Has she explained why she uses racist and classist language in the course of her role?

 

[Athos]

I'm a student at Goldsmiths and Bahar has my unconditional solidarity. She is an excellent Welfare and Diversity officer, and this is reflected in the fact that she has been elected to that post twice in a row. As things stand there are all sorts of cutbacks looming for students, for instance all the dyslexia tutors are being forced to re apply for their jobs, one to one mentoring might not exist next academic year plus there is the threat of cuts to the allowances granted to disabled students. Bahar has been extremely vocal in opposing all of this - no wonder management hate her and have aided the media shitstorm that has been whipped up.

If she is doing the good work you say (which I have no reason to doubt), it's all the more disappointing that she seems to have played into the hands of those interested in ousting her by posting such daft nonsense.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Not all trans* people are born as men or women. There are other biological combinations.

True. In general, however, we are mostly socialised as either male or female, however arbitrary or misguided the categorisation is. The problem that this creates is that that socialisation can have "knock-on" effects for both trans and cis people. Gender roles are so normalised (still! ) that even if/when a person educates themselves out of binarism, there's still the problem of educating every other person to do so too.

 

[Pickman's model]

"Safe space" seems to have a wide semantic range.

safe space is where i keep my contraband

 

[DotCommunist]

iirc from the other thread on this her rival for the election was umbraged at losing so went through her TL for dirt and found it. That don't make what she tweeted right or anything but worth remembering theres other egos involved here

 

[killer b]

iirc from the other thread on this her rival for the election was umbraged at losing so went through her TL for dirt and found it. That don't make what she tweeted right or anything but worth remembering theres other egos involved here

that was someone else.

 

[Pickman's model]

I'm a student at Goldsmiths and Bahar has my unconditional solidarity. She is an excellent Welfare and Diversity officer, and this is reflected in the fact that she has been elected to that post twice in a row. As things stand there are all sorts of cutbacks looming for students, for instance all the dyslexia tutors are being forced to re apply for their jobs, one to one mentoring might not exist next academic year plus there is the threat of cuts to the allowances granted to disabled students. Bahar has been extremely vocal in opposing all of this - no wonder management hate her and have aided the media shitstorm that has been whipped up.

when i was a student i was elected to all sorts of things, from the ulu executive to the nus london area as well as my own college. i think i won something like 50 elections all told which by your criterion must mean i was some sort of demi-god.

i wouldn't argue my repeated election was on its own proof i was doing a good job though.

oh: and i would just like to remind you that the people who froth most about things are generally the ones who get the least done.

 

[DotCommunist]

that was someone else.

oh. I get confused. a lot.

carry on

 

[killer b]

oh. I get confused. a lot.

carry on

it's an easy mistake to make - it's baffling that there's two separate threads for two different gobshite officers at a minor London university...

 

[phildwyer]

let me put it this way, for the hard of thinking. if trans women have brain activity patterns which are similar to those of 'born women' then it would be reasonable to assume there is some commonality.

Any such presumptive commonality begins and ends with brain imaging. There is zero basis for extrapolating such observations into social behavior.

 

[Pickman's model]

Any such presumptive commonality begins and ends with brain imaging. There is zero basis for extrapolating such observations into social behavior.

and you base this on your research into usury i suppose.

 

[phildwyer]

Look like behave like a woman woman
Look like behave like a man man

Up to a point. But what about: looks like a woman, behaves like a woman, considers self to be a man?

That's the salient case imo.

 

[phildwyer]

which is why i made no such extrapolation.

Then what is the point of remarking on the commonality?

 

[Pickman's model]

blah blah blah

 

[phildwyer]

The idea that brain structures determine behaviour is quite outdated. Behaviour can change brain structures. It's the relationship between the two that's important. Dialectical, if you like.

My God, Blagsta has got this one right. Did someone steal his computer?

 

[likesfish]

She's an idiot while the first incident was stupid and blown out of proportion she decided to double down on the stupidity with the #killallwhitemen which really doesnt look cool and radical in your not in the " in crowd"
Just looks stupid and student lefty politics to a tee
Made epically more because she may identify as a strong black woman.


Everyone else see s a pretensious lefty student doing a non job badly

 

[cesare]

True. In general, however, we are mostly socialised as either male or female, however arbitrary or misguided the categorisation is. The problem that this creates is that that socialisation can have "knock-on" effects for both trans and cis people. Gender roles are so normalised (still! ) that even if/when a person educates themselves out of binarism, there's still the problem of educating every other person to do so too.

Yes. And this is one of the things that I find odd about the 80s style feminist trans-exclusionary discourse at the moment - it rejects the notion of biology as destiny but then builds and reinforces an account of patriarchal traditional genders based on biology which leads to the same end and allows no room for those resisting, or for those who differ.