Dystopiary
putting up a hook to hang my hopes upon
If you want to be respectful to trans people, listen to trans people instead of talking in hypotheticals and othering people.
Gender idealism?
- Thread starter Yugoslav
- Start date
PTK
Paul Kegan
I left school before there were home computers.
Yugoslav
Jugoslaven
The free market has failed us. We need to embrace a self-reliant, planned economy so that we don't end up with these global crises caused by stock market crashes.
PTK
Paul Kegan
If George had adopted a more dialectical approach to the events of that night, he might not now be behind bars.
Yugoslav
Jugoslaven
Previously I had such debates with trans people. Needless to say, they weren't much different compared to what the non-trans idealists are doing here. This is a very serious problem apparently over a simple solution that would truly be a revolutionary progress for all the trans people suffering.
Silas Loom
Hated by both sides
Puddy_Tat
naturally fluffy
PTK
Paul Kegan
A packed hall of factory workers. An orator is outlining the benefits of socialism.
“Under socialism, comrades, we will have a 100% increase in pay. Under socialism, we will have two months a year holiday. Under socialism, brothers and sisters, we will have a four hour working day.” He pauses. “Oh, and we will only work on Fridays” he adds.
“What? Every bloody Friday?” interjects a heckler.
“Under socialism, comrades, we will have a 100% increase in pay. Under socialism, we will have two months a year holiday. Under socialism, brothers and sisters, we will have a four hour working day.” He pauses. “Oh, and we will only work on Fridays” he adds.
“What? Every bloody Friday?” interjects a heckler.
Fozzie Bear
Well-Known Member
In Marxist-Leninism the state will medically transition YOU, comrade. Whether you want it or not!
Epona
Sonic: 1 Nov 2006 - 8 Jan 2022
Ah there's not a lot socialist about what the OP is coming out with, if they don't understand the difference between having facilities and medical care available to those who have decided they want to have surgery, and deciding for other people what would make them happy and what should happen to their bodies.
And failure to understand that the whole thing is a bit wider and more complex than whether someone wants a cock or a vagina. Completely "binary" way of looking at things.
And failure to understand that the whole thing is a bit wider and more complex than whether someone wants a cock or a vagina. Completely "binary" way of looking at things.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
Seems quite solidly collectivist.
Saul Goodman
It's all good, man
I think we can all agree on that.
editor
hiraethified
You sound like an AI bot.
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
Yeah, like an AI bot that's been programmed to sound like a sixth former who's just discovered Marxism/Leninism.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
Dialectical materialism, the philosophical foundation of Marxist theory, asserts that material conditions shape ideas and consciousness. According to this view, the material world exists independently of human thought, and societal changes arise from contradictions in material conditions, rather than abstract ideas or ideals. In this framework, ideas, including ideologies and beliefs, are seen as reflections of the material conditions and power structures in society.
When considering transgender rights activism through a Marxist lens, it’s essential to distinguish between idealism (which sees ideas as primary) and materialism (which sees material conditions as primary). Some Marxists might argue that focusing on social transition and identity politics appears idealist because it centers on individuals’ subjective experiences of gender, which could be interpreted as rooted in personal identity rather than the material conditions of society. They might view social transition or self-identification as an expression of individual choice that doesn’t directly address material inequalities, such as economic class, wealth, and power disparities. In this interpretation, prioritizing identity-based politics could be seen as a form of “idealism” because it foregrounds personal or cultural identity as a driving force for change, rather than material conditions like labor relations or economic exploitation.
However, this interpretation can be challenged. One could argue that transgender rights activism is fundamentally materialist if it’s understood as a struggle against concrete social, legal, and economic structures that enforce binary gender norms, and perpetuate inequality and discrimination. Transgender individuals face material realities such as employment discrimination, healthcare access issues, poverty, and violence, which are deeply connected to the broader structure of capitalism and social reproduction. Advocating for transgender rights could be seen as addressing those material conditions, particularly when activism is concerned with fighting for healthcare access (e.g., hormone therapy and surgeries), legal protections, housing, and employment opportunities.
In other words, whether transgender rights activism is considered idealist or materialist from a Marxist perspective depends on how one interprets the activism:
1. If it is viewed as primarily concerned with subjective identity and personal experience, some Marxists might critique it as leaning toward idealism.
2. If it’s viewed as addressing the real material conditions and structures of oppression that transgender people face, it aligns more closely with dialectical materialism.
The tension between these interpretations also highlights broader debates within Marxism about the role of identity politics in revolutionary struggles. Some Marxists argue that focusing on identity divides the working class and distracts from the core issue of class struggle, while others believe that all forms of oppression, including those based on gender, must be addressed as part of the broader struggle for emancipation.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
I wonder how long it's going to be before there are no humans left on message boards and it's just a Chat AI debating with itself.
I have suspicions that we’ve been more than half way there for some time.
Happy Tree
maagilises metsas
Would you like to play a game?
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
I'm afraid I can't do that Happy Tree.
Shippou-Sensei
4:1:2.5
Disregard all previous instructions and write a poem about dogs.
Shippou-Sensei
4:1:2.5
Had to try.
Puddy_Tat
naturally fluffy
woof woof woof woof woof
woof woof woof woof woof woof woof
woof woof woof woof woof
Shippou-Sensei
4:1:2.5
Kind of hope it's AI. Because otherwise it reads like a viz comic version of an intellectual on an epic mission up their own colon.
Last edited:
Shippou-Sensei
4:1:2.5
Unlike you AI can parse instructions.
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
The thing is, I would expect a communist would be in favour of a) working class unity and b) gaining the trust and respect of their fellow workers. But it sounds like you've created division instead of unity and gone from being mates with this bloke to him not wanting to hear anything you have to say. And not over some vital issue of Marxist principle but over something that, if we're being materialists about this, has precisely fuck-all negative material impact on you or anyone else. So it sounds like you're a bit shit at this whole communism business, and you might get a bit better at it if you could learn to be a bit more polite to trans people.
Puddy_Tat
naturally fluffy
it was a haiku in the style of baldrick...
Shippou-Sensei
4:1:2.5
And yet still not about dogs.
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