Donald Trump, the road that might not lead to the White House!

[Johnny Canuck3]

History continues to be made, as it always has.

But world events are like driving a car: it is of course necessary and desirable to look regularly in the rear-view mirror; but if one focuses there and neglects to look out the windscreen, pretty soon the car will be in the ditch.

 

[butchersapron]

History continues to be made, as it always has.

But world events are like driving a car: it is of course necessary and desirable to look regularly in the rear-view mirror; but if one focuses there and neglects to look out the windscreen, pretty soon the car will be in the ditch.

What a load of wank

 

[J Ed]

History continues to be made, as it always has.

But world events are like driving a car: it is of course necessary and desirable to look regularly in the rear-view mirror; but if one focuses there and neglects to look out the windscreen, pretty soon the car will be in the ditch.

The South China Sea dispute started with Trump!

 

[butchersapron]

You make a temporal claim stuck to a person, then clear that person because it is in the past.

 

[Miss Caphat]

Guess the Chinese mean business:



China's Navy seizes American underwater drone in South China Sea


Aren't we lucky that Clinton didn't win the election?

can someone explain what this likely means? is it just meant to be a threat, basically?

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

can someone explain what this likely means? is it just meant to be a threat, basically?

It's a message intended for the President-elect.

 

[Miss Caphat]

It's a message intended for the President-elect.

couldn't it just be that there shouldn't be drones in that area and therefore they seized it?

 

[Miss Caphat]

I'm not doubting you, it's just that the reporting is very vague at this point

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

can someone explain what this likely means? is it just meant to be a threat, basically?

Its' either a message for the next President, or they're going to reverse engineer it and sell in the States next Christmas.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

I'm not doubting you, it's just that the reporting is very vague at this point

Doesn't seem all that vague:

In the latest encounter in international waters in the South China Sea region, the USNS Bowditch was sailing about 100 miles off the port at Subic Bay when the incident occurred, according to the official.
Bowditch had stopped in the water to pick up two underwater drones. At that point a Chinese naval ship that had been shadowing the Bowditch put a small boat into the water. That small boat came up alongside and the Chinese crew took one of the drones.

US Defense Official: Chinese warship stole US underwater drone - CNNPolitics.com

 

[Miss Caphat]

oh god. imagine the US going to war with China and having to listen to Trump say "Jyhnna" all day long

 

[FridgeMagnet]

This is standard stuff over the last few decades surely.

"Look at the Americans constantly spying on us, they've gone too far, we have taken action to defend our sovereign rights."
"Look at the Chinese attacking our perfectly legitimate behaviour, disgraceful interference, they can't get away with this."

 

[littlebabyjesus]

can someone explain what this likely means? is it just meant to be a threat, basically?

Which side threatening whom? From a Chinese perspective the us is the threat, and an asymmetric one at that. You don't see Chinese warships off the coast of california.

 

[hot air baboon]

.....strange that over several hundred pages & the cacophony of nuclear war & Russkies-hacked-my-election hysteria that this thread returns precisely :

one hit for Kris Kobach

No one has done more to stir up fears about the manufactured threat of voter fraud than Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach, a top adviser in the Bush Justice Department who has become a rising star in the GOP. "We need a Kris Kobach in every state," declared Michelle Malkin, the conservative pundit.

Kobach might be the gop's most outspoken crusader working to prevent citizens from voting, but he's far from the only one. "Voting rights are under attack in America," Rep. John Lewis, who was brutally beaten in Alabama while marching during the civil rights movement in the 1960s, observed....


and no hits for ALEC American Legislative Exchange Council

Prior to 2012, legislation based on ALEC model bills was introduced in many states to mandate or strengthen requirements that voters produce state-issued photographic identification. The bills were passed and signed into law in six states.[8] Voter identification bills introduced in 34 states would have made voting more difficult for students, the elderly, and the poor.


The GOP War on Voting

 

[camouflage]

I'm upset because the United States has elected a narcissistic, ill-informed, would-be demagogue as their President.

Yeah, when they could have instead chosen... erm... chosen.... um.... ah.

 

[J Ed]

This is standard stuff over the last few decades surely.

"Look at the Americans constantly spying on us, they've gone too far, we have taken action to defend our sovereign rights."
"Look at the Chinese attacking our perfectly legitimate behaviour, disgraceful interference, they can't get away with this."

No, everything is new now. History is boring, in fact thinking about anything in the past is counterproductive and... low energy!

 

[CRI]

Putin is Hitler now is he? I've tried to be patient with you in exchanges in the past but at some point you have to call it as you see it. You're an hysterical moron. And now, like many liberals seem to be, you're going full cinspiraloon on this whole Russian hacking Putin is going to take over Europe (which he'd have to to make your Chamberlain comparison valid).

Take a look at yourself, it's embarrassing.

Who are you? Why should I care what you think of me? Jerk.

 

[teqniq]

heh

Now you can fact-check Trump’s tweets — in the tweets themselves

 

[bluescreen]

heh

Now you can fact-check Trump’s tweets — in the tweets themselves

This is an interesting take:

Both Trump and Putin use language primarily to communicate not facts or opinions but power: it’s not what the words mean that matters but who says them and when.

http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/12/13/putin-paradigm-how-trump-will-rule/

 

[J Ed]

This is an interesting take: http://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/12/13/putin-paradigm-how-trump-will-rule/

How does this differ from British Prime Ministers or other prominent Western politicians?

 

[seventh bullet]

What a shit article.

 

[bluescreen]

How does this differ from British Prime Ministers or other prominent Western politicians?

Lol. At least most of them have the grace to be embarrassed when they are caught out by contradictions quoted back at them. The article is worth a read. It suggests that Trump and Putin are using language in a different way, even more cynical.

 

[bluescreen]

What a shit article.

Why?

 

[redsquirrel]

Lol. At least most of them have the grace to be embarrassed when they are caught out by contradictions quoted back at them.

I think you must be living in a different dimension to the rest of us. This happens all the time and they simply bat it back - see Loach and Stamer on QT for just one recent example.

Or any of those that backed the war in Iraq, at the time only about WMD, now all about removing the tyrant Saddam.

Or Owen Smith's leadership challenge campaign, more backflips than a circus.

Or any of the MPs that attacked a Leave vote as racist while now arguing that "people's concerns must be listened to" and attacking immigrants.

You could go on for pages.

 

[CRI]

heh

Now you can fact-check Trump’s tweets — in the tweets themselves

Almost as good as the kitten one.

 

[JimW]

A serious international incident, first of its kind in recent times, and he can't stop talking about the DNC.

It's not really though, there's been the Hainan Incident Hainan Island incident - Wikipedia and numerous naval run-ins e.g. Face Off: China's Navy Stalks U.S. Ship in South China Sea

 

[bluescreen]

I think you must be living in a different dimension to the rest of us. This happens all the time and they simply bat it back - see Loach and Stamer on QT for just one recent example.

Or any of those that backed the war in Iraq, at the time only about WMD, now all about removing the tyrant Saddam.

Or Owen Smith's leadership challenge campaign, more backflips than a circus.

Or any of the MPs that attacked a Leave vote as racist while now arguing that "people's concerns must be listened to" and attacking immigrants.

You could go on for pages.

That's all true. You haven't read the article, have you. I didn't summarise it well. Trump doesn't even try.

ETA. Trump is not just more of the usual. He is a step change that the press (such as remain) can't begin to engage with.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

It's not really though, there's been the Hainan Incident Hainan Island incident - Wikipedia and numerous naval run-ins e.g. Face Off: China's Navy Stalks U.S. Ship in South China Sea

The Hainan Incident was a mid-air collision; i.e. an accident, not an intentional act.

Military 'stalking' is a common practice amongst the worlds military powers.

The seizure of US military property by a foreign military in the Pacific hasn't happened for a long time. I could very well be wrong, but the last such incident I can recall in the Pacific, was the Pueblo Incident.

It's true that the US and China have been in dispute in the South China Sea for a long time; but this seizure of military property by China, constitutes an escalation of the dispute.

The fact that this unusual escalation comes a week or so after the President-elect has called the One China policy into question might just be a coincidence: anything's possible.

 

[JimW]

The Hainan Incident was a mid-air collision; i.e. an accident, not an intentional act.

Military 'stalking' is a common practice amongst the worlds military powers.

The seizure of US military property by a foreign military in the Pacific hasn't happened for a long time. I could very well be wrong, but the last such incident I can recall in the Pacific, was the Pueblo Incident.

It's true that the US and China have been in dispute in the South China Sea for a long time; but this seizure of military property by China, constitutes an escalation of the dispute.

The fact that this unusual escalation comes a week or so after the President-elect has called the One China policy into question might just be a coincidence: anything's possible.

It was a mid-air collision because a spy plane was being shadowed in Chinese airspace, the plane was impounded and the crew detained. Not just a random prang.
So while this latest thing is definitely noteworthy it's not without precedent and part of a long trajectory where China is becoming more assertive about what are from its point of view US incursions.

ETA Fair point to note the timing, might well be testing the waters after that Taiwan call. But still within the parameters of business as usual imo

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

It was a mid-air collision because a spy plane was being shadowed in Chinese airspace,

The midair collision was an accident, not an intentional act.