Commie Bastards have one more success in Nepal!

[DrRingDing]

Just for the records like, what would be your solution to Nepal problems?

*ahem*

revol68?

 

[Jessiedog]

Gibberish.


And Jessiedogs' greatest nugget of advice for the people of Nepal is to give up their arms and let the king take back his country.

Another conservative!

This thread has attracted them like flies.

I'm a conservative.



Surely we've known each other longer than that?



Woof

 

[Jessiedog]

I asked you why do you think things would get worse. A lot depends on how the US, India and China respond to developments. If things did get worse would you say the maoists would be mostly responsible? If both sides are as bad as each other, surely that could not be the case.

Read the thread. There's no indication that things would improve under the Maoists.

None of the countries you cite will support the Maoists. They have explicitly stated thus.

Both sides are revolting .

Neither represent "the people".

(Edit: 'Cos I left off my signature)

fish? I'm trying to listen to you, please try and listen to me too.



Woof

 

[Jessiedog]

...and you will find that is you look further than the mass media you will find widespread grassroots support for the maoists.

Source please.

The vast majority of reports, as well as anecdotal evidence, suggest otherwise.

There is no credible evidence of any "widespread grassroots support for the maoists".

Your previous sources were very shaky.

Show us please.



Woof

 

[Jessiedog]

fish and DoUs,

Do you know many people from Nepal?

I mean, do many Nepalese live in the town/city that you live in? Do you mix with them?

I live among a community of 30,000 people from Nepal. They are "expatriats".

Oh!

I mean that they are refugees actually.

They're poor.



Woof

 

[fishfingerer]

Read the thread. There's no indication that things would improve under the Maoists.

Attention peasants, accept your lot.

None of the countries you cite will support the Maoists. They have explicitly stated thus.

Ehh I know that. The US and India are backing the king with military aid are they not.

 

[Jessiedog]

Attention peasants, accept your lot.

Just post your sources fish.

Ehh I know that. The US and India are backing the king with military aid are they not.

Yes.



Woof

 

[DrRingDing]

Source please.

The vast majority of reports, as well as anecdotal evidence, suggest otherwise.

There is no credible evidence of any "widespread grassroots support for the maoists".

Your previous sources were very shaky.

Show us please.



Woof

Right tory boy if I produce these sources then I would like to to also produce independent credible sources for these magical demons that control vast swathes of this country.

1. "The Path to Jan Sarkar in Dolakha District" Dr Sara Shneiderman and Dr Mark Turin. (2003)

Both are well respected and peer reviewed anthropologists.

Now where is your next credible link?

 

[DrRingDing]

2. "Ethnic Demands Within Maoism", Dr Marie Lecomte-Tilouine

Another peer reviewed and well respected social anthropologist highlights the connections between the culture of local ethnic groups and the aims of the maoists.

So then JD where's yer references?

 

[DrRingDing]

*ahem*

revol68?

Come on revol yer can't you can't just sit there like this pair of old nay sayers and not give constructive advice on a solution to the problem.

Unless, that is,you too are a conservative advocating a continuation of the status quo.

 

[revol68]

im not so arrogant as to think i can put forward a solution for the nepalese working class.

What i would say is that any programme for change has to begin with the nepalese working class themselves. There are no doubts hundreds of acts of resistance being carried out all over Nepal that I would support. Until I know more about the actual situation on the ground forgive me for not putting my weight behind a bunch of jumped up intellectuals playing chess with peoples lives.

 

[Jessiedog]

DoUs,

Tory boy? Moi?

Tory?

Boy?

Moi?

Hehehehehe.

You're having fun, no?

I'm having trouble findingn the actual articles (well, then first one anyway - gave up after that).

Could you provide a direct link (to something,) that I can read and digest.

Thanks.



Woof

 

[Macabre]

Just popign in to post a few RECENT publications.

http://www.nyuhr.org/docs/Missing Piece of the Puzzle.pdf
Probably gives the best overall account of the situation to this year. I found some more that I will post after people read this one as its the best out of them.


That Jan Sakar source you posted DUAF is interesting but its only a chapter in a much bigger book, plus it was published in 2003 and a lot has happened in the past few years. From those pages, I dont see what it has to do with this topic. It seems to be an account of how and why the Maoist started, no one on this thread has said Nepal wasnt in need of change but that the Maoists are turning out to be as bad as the King (as my link above shows). It also says that many joined the Maoists just for revenge against the police or out of fear for not joining and judging from the chapter titles for other parts of the book I dont think its going to paint a rosie picture of Nepals future. Cant find the other one.

 

[DrRingDing]

Could you provide a direct link (to something,) that I can read and digest.

First I'm told websites are 'very shaky' sources of information so I deliver peer reviewed papers by respected academics and yet that isn't good enough.

It's so much easier to rely on tired old stereotypes isn't it?

 

[DrRingDing]

im not so arrogant as to think i can put forward a solution for the nepalese working class.

But you're arrogant enough to say the working class of Nepal that they are wrong to challenge the last hindu kingdom on the planet!

 

[Macabre]

First I'm told websites are 'very shaky' sources of information so I deliver peer reviewed papers by respected academics and yet that isn't good enough.

It's so much easier to rely on tired old stereotypes isn't it?

Dont suppose you've read my link yet DUAF. And as I pointed out the first source you've named doesnt back up your position, its a chapter (which could be taken out of context given the titles given for the other chapters)from a book that gives an account of how and why the Maoists started up and is two years out of date, which isnt ideal given what has happened in the past two years. It doesnt defend, justify, or back the Maoists position.

E2A: The second source you've named is the next chapter of the same book and I cant find it online, but again its out of date and judging form the title not relivant to this topic. No one at any point here has said there wasnt a need for a revolution, but that the Maoists are just a case of meet the new boss same as the old boss as my up to dat esource points out.

 

[DrRingDing]

That Jan Sakar source you posted DUAF is interesting but its only a chapter in a much bigger book, plus it was published in 2003 and a lot has happened in the past few years. From those pages, I dont see what it has to do with this topic.

You dimwits professed that the maoist have no grassroots support, I contradict that with the above rock solid, peer reviewed papers that clearly state in detail the grassroots support for the maoist movement because if there was no grassroots support the movement would simply not exist.

If you would like to know the many different reasons that people take up the fight on different levels then let us discuss that but it is patronising as fuck to say they fight only to get revenge on the police. Or worse still cos the maoists forced a gun in their hands

Just like some of the locals that had heard scare stories of the maoists not really being people but demonic spirits that roamed the forests you bunch of conservatives (a precise use of the term) carry over the same state propaganda just in a western form.

Maoism ain't my cup of tea but the working class of Nepal deserve support in their method of social justice.

 

[Jessiedog]

I don't want to fight.

i want to learn.

I've been a bit nasty on this thread.

Sorry.



I'm doing some reading.

I'll be back.

Let's debate?

Love you all.

Blessings



Woof

 

[Macabre]

You dimwits professed that the maoist have no grassroots support, I contradict that with the above rock solid, peer reviewed papers that clearly state in detail the grassroots support for the maoist movement because if there was no grassroots support the movement would simply not exist.

I said no such thing.

If you would like to know the many different reasons that people take up the fight on different levels then let us discuss that but it is patronising as fuck to say they fight only to get revenge on the police. Or worse still cos the maoists forced a gun in their hands

Your own source says that many joined just to get revenge on the police or because they were scared not to on page 92-93.

Maoism ain't my cup of tea but the working class of Nepal deserve support in their method of social justice.

Since when? You've done nothing but cheerleaded for them or have you actually read my link and are scutling back from your whole hearted support.

 

[DrRingDing]

Since when? You've done nothing but cheerleaded for them or have you actually read my link and are scutling back from your whole hearted support.

Why don't you just admit your politics. Be a man.

 

[Jessiedog]

Why don't you just admit your politics. Be a man.

I think this does sum up where the debate is headed.

Surely DUAF we should not be driven solely by our ideologies, but rather allow reality to filter through said beliefs, to balance our ideologiy, to ground our thinking in practicalities and thus facilitate our grasp of the situation to reflect the realities "on the ground"?

Even were I a rabid, pbman-type, right-wing, gun nut, I hope I'd have the wherewithal to stick the metaphorical boot into any right wing group I felt were behaving badly - no matter their opponents were closer to my political camp.

I'm still reasearching.

I'll be back.

Play nice kids.



Woof

 

[Jessiedog]

From Macabre's link above, Post # 283 ........


The three main leaders of the Maoist-CPN (including the military leader are all high caste, two of them Brahmins and apparently, in 2001, only two members of the 37 member Maoist Central Committee are from the Dalit caste they purport to represent.

The Dalits merely serve as cannon fodder for the elites to use in the front lines..

Schools are shut, students kidnapped and children recruited into the "movement". This is a useful tactic when fewer and fewer adults are prepared to join

Abuse based on caste is not uncommon among the Maoists.

The civil war is having a devestating effect on Dalits who are, of course, suffering most. Their situation has been deteriorating more and more rapidly.

The Maoists are hurting most, those very same people they assert they represent.

Not untypical in these kind of situations tho, is i?.

Still, it's not the Maoist leadership who are suffering as they perpetrate this unwinnable war which is tearing the country apart, killing thousands and WORSENING the situation of the poorest and most vunerable, is it? So who gives a shit?


It's an interesting piece of research, well balanced and very well referenced.

It is utterly scathing about the government and security forces.

May I particularly refer peeps to pages 40 through 45 for an analysis of the Maoists impact upon Nepal's Dalit community.



Woof

 

[Macabre]

Why don't you just admit your politics. Be a man.

I'll take that as you admitting defeat and accpet your appology for being an abusive wanker through out the thread. My politics are irrlevant to the thread.

 

[DrRingDing]

My politics are irrlevant to the thread.

LOL! Your dodgy politics have everything to do with yer contribution to this thread my old chestnut.

Anyhoo I thought you flounced from this discussion?

 

[Macabre]

LOL! Your dodgy politics have everything to do with yer contribution to this thread my old chestnut.

Anyhoo I thought you flounced from this discussion?

My politics are nothing to do with thread because we're discussing the Maoists politcs, not mine. I stopped posting because you and fishbreath just trolled without ocntributing anything, i came back when you posted another (out-dated) source which doesnt back your stance and in parts backs ours.

Your attempts to dodge questions challenging your position by calling us Royalists, torys, conservatives,, etc are monotonous and just prove our point that you dont understand the situation in Nepal and have to resort to being abusive without contributing anything.

You either havent bothered reading my link or you have and wont comment on it because it would mean you admitting your wrong, which couldnt possibly be the case , although it would explain your sudden attempts to distance yourself from the Maoists and to change your argument to Maoist grassroot support.

Have you bothered reading my source? What are your opinions on the the Maoist council being run by high caste nepalis? What about their use of the Dalits as cannon fodder, the gang rapes of women, the closing of schools, the abductions, the child soliders, the increased poverty and perpetuation of the caste system within the Maoist ranks?

No doubt you'll just further dodge these questions by personal attacks again, followed by trying to change your argument and claiming it was the point you were arguing all along.

 

[DrRingDing]

My politics are nothing to do with thread because we're discussing the Maoists politcs, not mine.

You suggested the best thing Nepal could do is let India invade!

You're politics have everything to do with your crackpot ideas of what Nepal should and should do.

 

[DrRingDing]

i came back when you posted another (out-dated) source which doesnt back your stance and in parts backs ours.

Just because the source is 2 years old does not mean it is invalid

People do not change that quickly, if at all in 2 years.

 

[DrRingDing]

Your attempts to dodge questions challenging your position by calling us Royalists, torys, conservatives,, etc are monotonous

I am saying this to highlight to your good selves the ridiculous ideas you are spouting.

 

[DrRingDing]

You either havent bothered reading my link or you have and wont comment.

I do not have an internet connection at home so I'm unable to spend the time reading a journal online, I do have more important things to do than spend my time bickering with a snotty nosed imperialist on t'internet.

 

[DrRingDing]

although it would explain your sudden attempts to distance yourself from the Maoists and to change your argument to Maoist grassroot support.

You loonspuds clearly stated that the maoists have no grassroot support.

That was clearly utter tripe I have proved that with solid evidence by peer reviewed respected and well known academics.

If you have paid attention to the boards you would see that I am a libertarian socialist, and I support the working class struggle against the king, this doesn't mean I have to embrace 100%, the politcal niche of the banner that they fight under, does it?