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campaign against welfare cuts and poverty

Frances Lengel said:
I know it's not relevant to what's being talked about here.

I don't think you'll find a single soul who disagrees with your point about decent wages being a requirement. But you did use a phrase ("the less well off") that could be construed as offensive and, when it was pointed out why it could be taken as offensive, instead of responding with good grace, you chose to get all prickly.

And the way you seemed to equate working with self respect well, taken to it's conclusion that train of thought's sooner or later going to pull in at the terminus where people who can't work aren't afforded any respect. TBF, I don't think that is what you meant but I'd like to think you can see why it could've been read that way.
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It's not my problem how you decide to interpret postings.

Getting wound up about anonymous cyber personalities seems weird to me. Why should black writing on a screen matter so much?
 
Greebo said:
Sweetie, I suggest you go and buy yourself some manners at any shop which remains open. Saying "people ...." instead of "the ...." isn't political correctness, it's recognising that all of us are human beings first and whatever else second.

I could explain why in further detail, but it would be taking advantage of your apparent social ineptitude. And derailing the thread.
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Bye then. C ya.
 
cyprusclean said:
<snip> Why should black writing on a screen matter so much?
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I'll try to make this simple for you. Those words are typed by a flesh and blood human being, who breathes, defecates, pisses, and bleeds, just as you do.

Edited to add: Even if this version of you is merely one persona, think about how many different masks you wear in real life; each one of those can at times be merely a persona.
 
cyprusclean said:
It's not my problem how you decide to interpret postings.

Getting wound up about anonymous cyber personalities seems weird to me. on Why should black writing a screen matter so much?
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No, it's not your problem how people interpret your posts - But, if you don't want your posts to be misconstrued then it might be an idea to at least consider expressing yourself better. Why should writing on a screen matter? It doesn't matter a jot. Except we all choose to post here so it must matter at least somewhat or we wouldn't fucking waste our time doing it would we? FWIW, I wasn't trying to give you a hard time but, TBH, now you're coming across as nothing so much as one of those thick as shit types who's only response to (even legitimate and constructive criticism) is to get all defensive and then choose to employ attack as the favoured form of defence. A bit like a crustacean.

Take your ball home. All the way back to Cyprus if needs be. And I hope it pops.
 
cyprusclean said:
It's not my problem how you decide to interpret postings.

Getting wound up about anonymous cyber personalities seems weird to me. Why should black writing on a screen matter so much?
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I think you're new here.

Please take this as a word to the wise, but in picking a fight (don't argue: that's EXACTLY what it looks like) with Greebo, you are tilting at the wrong windmills.

Also, just so you know, everybody on Urban ducks and covers their eyes when she calls another poster "sweetie" - it does not bode well. :) HTH
 
cyprusclean said:
He misread that subjectively. There are soul destroying jobs, no doubt about it.
I don't know if UK benefits are higher than wages/salaries, the free bus pass being a good thing for pensioners, ("well off" included?).

But in a country like Germany for instance, benefits equate with living on the bread line.
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No, they don't, unless you exceed the period of coverage that your prior contributions buy you, and even after reform then it's still more than here. :)
 
cyprusclean said:
Still living in the dark ages as far as a decent living wage is concerned. No political party has manged to crack that one yet.
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No political party in the last 30 years has wanted to "crack that one". It doesn't fit to neoliberal capitalism's requirement for a large pool of excess labour. Gestures get made, such as the so-called "national minimum wage" (actually a national minimum hourly rate), but that's all they are.

I'd say most people don't want to be on benefits, preferring instead to control their own destinies, in as much as that is possible.
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Better benefits than an unclear alternative where the only control you may have over your destiny is whether you thieve or starve.
 
Frances Lengel said:
She.

But I think it's you that's misreading things on purpose TBH. And then slavering a load of irrelevent bollocks about Germany.
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Fair point about irrelevancy. The Hartz reforms, and the German social security system per se, is different enough from ours that they're not immediately comparable. They, for example, pay your "dole" at a percentage of your previous salary if you've made enough contributions. Here it's a low flat rate from start to finish.

Sometimes in the UK, people can be better off on benefits than in work but only coz wages are so woefully low. Not coz benefits are generous, far from it. And the amount of people who are on in work rather than out of work benefits bears witness to that. But that's not even the point, all Greebo was saying (if I've got it right) is that being on benefits isn't a thing that should automatically erode a persons self esteem. Nor should being in work automatically boost a persons self esteem. Work does not necessarily equate to independance/self respect etc much as being on benefit doesn't necessarily equate to passivity/dependence etc.
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Quite. That some people feel that others should have less self-esteem because they're "on benefits" is merely a result of an adherence to a "Protestant work ethic" that went out-of-date around the same time as putative full employment did, and a result of buying into defining oneself through what one does, not through who one is.
 
Benefits and Work is reporting new info that people on ESA are going to be forced to see DWP doctors for health advice,


really going back in time..
 
Universal Credit is only going to 10 JCPs in October, and still only for single people on JSA... but the Claimant Commitment (30 or 35hrs/week of jobsearch crap) is rolling out everywhere, and pilots for in work conditionality will start - workfare for workers begins.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/universal-credit-roll-out-from-october-2013

I wonder if they'll give up UC before 2015, or if Labour will drop it after? I doubt it really but how much more can it take? The more and more that it gets delayed and downgraded the more likely it is to be dropped completely surely? Or maybe I'm just too sensible for politics.
 
We were going to take a family friend on holiday with us in a few weeks but she probably can't come now because all her benefits have been stopped and she'll have to be available for atos almost certainly while we were going to be away. Because ill people shouldn't have anything nice happen to them. :mad:
 
Report Calls For Expansion Of Residential Workfare For
Unemployed and Disabled People
... Posted on July 31, 2013 by johnny void | 95 Comments

An independent report, commissioned by the DWP, has called for greater use of Residential Training for disabled people and an extension of the scheme to include long term unemployed non-disabled people.

The report also accepts that this kind of training, which can involve periods of workfare away from home, should be opened up to the market. This process may begin with a open tender exercise next year.

http://johnnyvoid.wordpress.com/
This is very worrying indeed, though it would be prohibitively expensive unless the clients did work for the private company which ran them.:mad:
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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk-most-unequal-country-in-the-west-1329614.html

This link is old but it's doing the rounds on FB etc, seemed pertinent to this thread

UK most unequal country in the West

Huge gap between rich and poor in Britain is the same as Nigeria and worse than Ethiopia, UN report reveals


Britain is now the most unequal country in the Western world, an authoritative new United Nations report reveals. The gap between rich and poor is as great as in Nigeria.

Detailed statistics in the Human Development Report published last week also demonstrate that inequality has grown sharply during Conservative rule and that the poor in Britain now have to live on much the same incomes as their equivalents in Hungary and Korea.


While growing inequality might once have been a cause for congratulation - Margaret Thatcher called on us to "glory" in it - the consensus among experts in such bodies as the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development, the rich nations' club, and even the World Bank is now moving against
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Cloo said:
We were going to take a family friend on holiday with us in a few weeks but she probably can't come now because all her benefits have been stopped and she'll have to be available for atos almost certainly while we were going to be away. Because ill people shouldn't have anything nice happen to them. :mad:
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Good news is that our friend won appeal against dropping of benefits, but she still might be called back suddenly for sundry compulsory crap; at any rate, she has travelled out with my parents now (we're joining them next week) and a neighbour is keeping an eye on her post in case any summons arrive, in which case my parents will sort out sending her back home in time. But hopefully there's such a backlog to clear, she'll get a few weeks to recuperate.
 
The-Merseyside-Peoples-As-008.jpg


http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/aug/21/atos-centre-pilgrimage-miracles


Miracles happen, raising the dead/curing the sick, fantastic protest at Liverpool ATOS Centre
 
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