British IS schoolgirl 'wants to return home'

[pardon]

What exactly constitutes culpable deniability though?

In this case the covert Eastern European arms
shipments that various front companies provably ordered under us military export licenses were for the moderate rebels. So why didn't you supply them with US made arms then? Is it because you didn't want to be seen to be arming Al-Qaeda while covertly arming Al-Qaeda, I think so, but regardless of what I think if you dump arms into a warzone and they end up in Al-Qaeda and ISIS's arms caches then you remain accountable.

Consecutive Tory administrations have used jihadis to fight their proxy wars since Thatcher, they are warmongerers, evil.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

What bollocks. She's 19 and unrepentent about fucking off to join a terrorist "state" who enslaved, raped, and murdered thousands of other women and who would do the same to you in a heartbeat. She seems to have happily engaged with what the scum were doing. She says she escaped because she saw no future for the caliphate, not because she thought they were cunts.

Pretty disgusting what you're doing here. Trying to crowbar in your agenda laden misogyny angle. The only difference between her and a male who'd done the same is that she's pregnant.

Absolutely nothing should be afforded her by the government. If she does manage to make it back here somehow her child should be removed and adopted whilst she is imprisoned until a) she shows some remorse, and b) she has been 'deradicalised' (if that's possible).

So basically you don't care about the children of Muslim sectarian bigots, but you do care about the children of Jewish sectarian bigots.

Why take sides between different sets of fundamentalists? Giving one set completely different preferential treatment? A definite inconsistency there.

You've tried to disguise it in the Batley Gramar school thread but you reek of blatant islamophobic bigotry and for some reason it is tolerated on this forum, as is the islamophobic racism of Likesfish.

 

[Spymaster]

So basically you don't care about the children of Muslim sectarian bigots, but you do care about the children of jewish sectarian bigots.

Why take sides between different types of fundamentalists? Giving one set preferential treatment?

You reek of blatant islamophobic bigotry and for some reason it is tolerated on this forum, as is the anti-arab racism of Likesfish.

Fuck off Nazi boy. You won't win this. You've had your arse kicked today. Own it like an adult.

 

[bimble]

jesus. He really thinks that all Orthodox Jews are the same as people who decided to join ISIS, which is actually a bit scary.
He probably feels it's his moral duty as a good upstanding citizen to stare menacingly & disapprovingly at them whenever he spots one.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

He probably feels it's his moral duty as a good upstanding citizen to stare menacingly & disapprovingly at them whenever he spots one.

No I don't. What a bizarre post.

 

[bimble]

No I don't. What a bizarre post.

Love how you clipped off the first bit of my post, which presumably you didn't have a problem with.
Just stop obsessing about jews, that would be great.

 

[Pickman's model]

So basically you don't care about the children of Muslim sectarian bigots, but you do care about the children of Jewish sectarian bigots.

Why take sides between different types of fundamentalists? Giving one set preferential treatment? A definite inconsistency there.

You reek of blatant islamophobic bigotry and for some reason it is tolerated on this forum, as is the islamophobic racism of Likesfish.

Quit digging

 

[8ball]

Quit digging

Have to agree here. Maybe time to chill away from the keyboard for a bit.

 

[Pickman's model]

Have to agree here. Maybe time to chill away from the keyboard for a bit.

If by a bit you mean six months or so then yeh

 

[krtek a houby]

No I don't. What a bizarre post.

Don't be a count

 

[bellaozzydog]

remind me where we are in this

I’m working the “we can look at this objectively and look at root causes for it and look to improve society”

I’m presuming most other posters are Of the string her high, school of thought

 

[not-bono-ever]

Bring her home

 

[FridgeMagnet]

remind me where we are in this

Page 154, so really, say what you want.

 

[Shechemite]

remind me where we are in this

I’m working the “we can look at this objectively and look at root causes for it and look to improve society”

I’m presuming most other posters are Of the string her high, school of thought

what do you think are the root causes? Joining a genocidal proto-state isn’t something many people do.

 

[bellaozzydog]

what do you think are the root causes? Joining a genocidal proto-state isn’t something many people do.

Get your definition of root cause analysis brushed up and we can discuss

 

[8ball]

Bring her home

I guess that silence must mean the Caliphate is considering your request.

 

[Spymaster]

Get your definition of root cause analysis brushed up and we can discuss

Have you got something to say?

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

what do you think are the root causes? Joining a genocidal proto-state isn’t something many people do.

They were groomed, indoctrinated, and radicalised.
People who have been convinced to do bad things don't have to be evil on the inside.
Plus they were not even being radicalised to do something violent (at least to start with).
They were convinced to start a new life that would have less pressure on them to succeed and would be able to start a family.
Something that probably feel like a good option for someone facing huge pressure to do well in A-levels and go on to have a 'good' job.
And one you are in, separated from your family and surrounded by this new cult they are only going to pull you in deeper.

It can be really easy to say 'don't drink the kool-aid' but lots of people are vulnerable to the tactics used to indoctrinate people.
Teens are probably* some of the most vulnerable to this given their lack of experience and still being in the process of gaining an adult identity.

Running away from home and getting in with a crowd who don't have your best interest at heart is something that a fair number of teens have probably done and a lot of those weren't even targeted by someone actively trying to indoctrinate them.



*I can't recall any specific data to support this at the moment so i'm adding the probably

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

Joining a genocidal proto-state isn’t something many people do.

Isn't that how the US started?

 

[Athos]

They were groomed, indoctrinated, and radicalised.
People who have been convinced to do bad things don't have to be evil on the inside.
Plus they were not even being radicalised to do something violent (at least to start with).
They were convinced to start a new life that would have less pressure on them to succeed and would be able to start a family.
Something that probably feel like a good option for someone facing huge pressure to do well in A-levels and go on to have a 'good' job.
And one you are in, separated from your family and surrounded by this new cult they are only going to pull you in deeper.

It can be really easy to say 'don't drink the kool-aid' but lots of people are vulnerable to the tactics used to indoctrinate people.
Teens are probably* some of the most vulnerable to this given their lack of experience and still being in the process of gaining an adult identity.

Running away from home and getting in with a crowd who don't have your best interest at heart is something that a fair number of teens have probably done and a lot of those weren't even targeted by someone actively trying to indoctrinate them.



*I can't recall any specific data to support this at the moment so i'm adding the probably

This narrative is something you've invented; you've no idea whether or not any of that's true. For all we know, she could have been ideologically committed to islamofascism before she actively sought out contact with people who could help her get to Syria, where she hoped to behead some infidels. And still hold those views, only hoping to come to the UK in order to commit atrocities here. Both scenarios are pure speculation, since we're not party to any intelligence.

 

[Athos]

remind me where we are in this

I’m working the “we can look at this objectively and look at root causes for it and look to improve society”

I’m presuming most other posters are Of the string her high, school of thought

I'm not in the "string her up" camp, particularly (though I have limited sympathy for her). And don't like the law the Home Secretary has used, or how it was done. But, whilst your root cause analysis might bear fruit in time, it's no solution to the immediate problem of what to do with her, now.

 

[maomao]

This narrative is something you've invented; you've no idea whether or not any of that's true. For all we know, she could have been ideologically committed to islamofascism before she actively sought out contact with people who could help her get to Syria, where she hoped to behead some infidels. And still hold those views, only hoping to come to the UK in order to commit atrocities here. Both scenarios are pure speculation, since we're not party to any intelligence.

We know she was a child when she went and there was purposefully coercive adult involvement in persuading her to go. If she'd been trafficked into a Dutch brothel and spent six years in the sex industry would you be telling us perhaps she wanted to be a prostitute all along?

 

[Athos]

We know she was a child when she went and there was purposefully coercive adult involvement in persuading her to go.

Do we know there was "purposefully coercive adult involvement in persuading her"? What evidence do you have of that?

 

[maomao]

Do we know there was "purposefully coercive adult involvement in persuading her"? What evidence do you have of that?

We know she was in touch with Isis recruiters. We have evidence of how Isis recruiters work. How would you describe them?

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

I though some of the stuff i said was mentioned in the program I watched on it for work as part of doing safeguarding and prevent.
I may be misremembering some of this as that was about two years ago but this really was the impression I walked away with.

I'm not really actually trying to claim this narrative as being the truth I just wanted push back on what seems like an idea that someone has to be inclined to do bad things to end up in this situation. I think that idea is dangerous as it means you think it can't happen to certain people who they are in fact still vulnerable to this.

 

[Athos]

We know she was in touch with Isis recruiters. We have evidence of how Isis recruiters work. How would you describe them?

Do we know she was in touch with Isis "recruiters" specifically? What's to say she didn't initiate contact with 'fixers' to get there, having already decided to go (such that she needed no persuasion)?

The truth is, we've no idea what happened in this case, so we shouldn't try to portray a particular narrative as established fact.

 

[Athos]

I though some of the stuff i said was mentioned in the program I watched on it for work as part of doing safeguarding and prevent.
I may be misremembering some of this as that was about two years ago but this really was the impression I walked away with.

I'm not really actually trying to claim this narrative as being the truth I just wanted push back on what seems like an idea that someone has to be inclined to do bad things to end up in this situation. I think that idea is dangerous as it means you think it can't happen to certain people who they are in fact still vulnerable to this.

That's fair enough, and all true in principle.

 

[maomao]

Do we know she was in touch with Isis "recruiters" specifically? What's to say she didn't initiate contact with 'fixers' to get there, having already decided to go (such that she needed no persuasion)?

The truth is, we've no idea what happened in this case, so we shouldn't try to portray a particular narrative as established fact.

Her family are pretty sure she was targeted by the Sisters Forum. What evidence do you have that they are mistaken or lying?

 

[TopCat]

Is she still moaning?

 

[maomao]

Is she still moaning?

I think Athos is a bloke.