I only have the news reports to go on, but all of them account for the delays at Dover - which their gear and 'countless other trucks' were caught up in - to a variety of factors - P&O, holiday traffic, existing custom hold ups and now this IT meltdown. As I said, Brexit is in the mix, but to blame it solely on Brexit when there's so many other things putting pressure on the crossings is pretty silly.
Brexit - impact on musicians, touring and the music/events industry
- Thread starter beesonthewhatnow
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littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
You're not there. How do you know? It could be that all those other problems would have been just about ok for them without the Brexit IT meltdown, which is what ultimately caused their gear to be detained. And that they know this for sure. Meanwhile, you don't know. You're calling them out as dishonest with zero evidence, which is pretty silly.
editor
hiraethified
You've literally no idea what this band's particular circumstances were, yet here you are still insisting that their official band account (or as you cluelessly put it, "some guys in a band,") wilfully posted up misinformation and lies. It's not a good look.
TopCat
Putin fanboy
Probably easier to give the band a two syllable explanation, easily understood (Brexit), and send them ahead of the truck.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
editor
hiraethified
You'll invent any old nonsense in defence of the ongoing disaster for musicians that is Brexit, won't you?
Meanwhile, here's some words from people who know what they're talking about:
White Lies forced to cancel Paris show after equipment detained over Brexit legislation
White Lies have been forced to cancel a show in Paris after their equipment was detained by Brexit legislation.
www.nme.com
Rock band White Lies forced to cancel Paris show ‘due to Brexit-related delays’
London-formed trio are the latest act to be hurt by Brexit red tape
www.independent.co.uk
editor
hiraethified
And your evidence for this is...?
TopCat
Putin fanboy
You have included two reports of the white lies gig being canx and it's not, their gear showed up?You'll invent any old nonsense in defence of the ongoing disaster for musicians that is Brexit, won't you?
Meanwhile, here's some words from people who know what they're talking about:
White Lies forced to cancel Paris show after equipment detained over Brexit legislation
White Lies have been forced to cancel a show in Paris after their equipment was detained by Brexit legislation.
Rock band White Lies forced to cancel Paris show ‘due to Brexit-related delays’
London-formed trio are the latest act to be hurt by Brexit red tape
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Well if it was down to Brexit, this won't be the last time it happens this year, so we'll see. Accusations of dishonesty/being really thick will become increasingly silly.
What’s your evidence that they had no inaccurate assumptions?
You don’t need to be thick to have inaccurate assumptions. Everybody has them
beesonthewhatnow
going deaf for a living
While I’m sure it’s not the done thing to call people thick, if you think brexit has so far been anything other than a disaster for bands/live music, then sorry, but you’re fucking thick.
editor
hiraethified
LOL. You're the one claiming that they're peddling misinformation and/or a bit thick, so perhaps you should back that up?
And they're not some little indie band travelling in the back of a transit van: they're undertaking a major tour two-month across multiple countries which would be hard to put together if their tour management/agents/managers were full of "inaccurate assumptions."
editor
hiraethified
What? Their gear turned up a day late because of Brexit shit, so they had to cancel their Paris show.
I dunno, somehow lots of people seem to have diametrically opposing views on Brexit related matters without being dishonest or stupid - such is Brexit's deeply divisive nature. So generally I try not to take people making grand claims in one direction or the other at face value. I don't think that's unreasonable.
ska invita
back on the other side
i'd expect if you were booked to do a gig in another country and you get there and your gear hasn't and you've got a massive stressful fuck up on your hands you would find out in quite some detail from the truck driver what has gone wrong as you desperately try and sort it out
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Why is that a 'grand claim'? It's a quite small claim, I would have thought, in the grand scheme of things.
That's what the Brexit fuckup looks like to a great extent. Lots and lots and lots and lots of relatively small problems.
Steel Icarus
ersatz maven
That's completely not what kabbes said - you've put words in his mouth and added some fictional emotive flavouring besides. You'd think after eleventy billion posts on here you'd have a handle on how to construct a fallacy-free argument but it seems not.
spitfire
Walty McWaltface
And the promoter won’t be put off with dog ate my homework excuses. That would have cost them a lot of money.
Supine
Newt Member
This. Death by a thousand cuts.
Regardless of peoples views on the rights and wrongs of brexit it seems crass to not consider musicians and how they are feeling about their new reality.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
when they say that their equipment held up due to brexit with countless other trucks, are they referring to the clusterfuck that is p&o? they're saying brexit but i thought the current difficulty in kent due in no small measure to p&o's bosses sacking their workforce as here Chaos as 23 Miles of Motorway Shut Outside London probably not helped by customs meltdown Customs IT meltdown adds to long delays at Channel crossings
editor
hiraethified
You see, if the band had published a long rant against Brexit full of wild misinformation you might possible have a point. But they didn't. What did happen is that they simply explained to their disappointed fans why they had to cancel their show.
Steel Icarus
ersatz maven
Is live music evolving and changing as much as people's consumption of recorded music? I've not seen anything either way, I just wondered if live music was getting less popular due to a combination of how music is now and the knock on effects of Covid
editor
hiraethified
Oh look. personal shit.
So what evidence do you have that their road crew's 'inaccurate assumptions' were to blame rather than Brexit?
editor
hiraethified
No, it's not, but Brexit has unequivocally made it very difficult for smaller bands to tour Europe.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
i think it's more p&o and the customs computers to blame, brexit just a handy whipping boy in this case
Steel Icarus
ersatz maven
Why should I have any evidence? I didn't make the claim. And neither did kabbes, as far as I can see, he merely suggested it as a possibility.
I think 'our gear has been detained along with countless other trucks by brexit legislation' is a grand claim, yeah. especially as it's happened during a week where there's a load of other delays happening.
ftr, I know that Brexit has been a disaster for touring musicians. I've argued as much on this thread multiple times. But I don't think it helps to blame every problem with moving stuff across the channel purely on Brexit - when these guys planned their tour, the brexit-related delays were a known quantity which they presumably will have planned for. What they didn't plan for - couldn't plan for - was the absolute clusterfuck caused this week by P&O sacking half their staff.
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