BrewDog: yet another hip company using 'rebel' language to sell its stuff

[Spymaster]

Agreed. I was just interested why we've ended up with this cultural norm of tipping some low-paid hospitality workers and not others.

Culturally, we've also become conditioned to tip for table service, which involves more work on the part of the servers, rather than at bars, which are semi-self service.

 

[Orang Utan]

Eh?

2 beer round = say £9 = 90p tip

You can’t buy a drink for 90p!

 

[brogdale]

You can’t buy a drink for 90p!

But you could tip 90p, but we're not culturally accustomed to do so; that was my question, really.

 

[brogdale]

Culturally, we've also become conditioned to tip for table service, which involves more work on the part of the servers, rather than at bars, which are semi-self service.

But in 'spoons a great deal of trade is table service.

 

[ElizabethofYork]

But in 'spoons a great deal of trade is table service.

Yes, the whole culture around tipping is quite weird. I've never understood why pub staff don't usually get tips but restaurant staff do. And if you have a meal in a pub, the server gets tipped, but if you just have a drink, they don't.

 

[Spymaster]

But in 'spoons a great deal of trade is table service.

Isn't that paid for via an app that you can add a tip to though?

 

[brogdale]

There's also some reports of customers not liking it when pubs do add service charges:

Outrage as London pub 'adds 90p service charge' to price of £6.60 pint

 

[brogdale]

Isn't that paid for via an app that you can add a tip to though?

Literally no idea; cash only here.

 

[brogdale]

Though a quick search suggests not at Wetherspoons:

 

[editor]

Interesting article:

Released at the start of 2022, ‘The Truth About BrewDog’ accused the brewery (among other transgressions) of misleading marketing stunts, unfair crowdfunding practices and unpleasant working conditions for staff. In response, its co-founder James Watt threatened to sue.

It was a departure from BrewDog’s long-cultivated reputation as a company that revelled in cocking a snook at regulators, what Watt describes as ‘global beer mega corporations’ and anyone else getting in its way. While Watt eventually downgraded the mooted lawsuit to a mere Ofcom complaint, the decision to employ libel specialists Carter-Ruck confirmed his membership in the UK’s business establishment.

Alas, even Carter-Ruck could not persuade Ofcom that BrewDog had been unfairly treated by the BBC, as outlined in its decision this week. The broadcasting regulator also ruled that the intrusion on Watt’s privacy was justified by the public interest. All BrewDog has won from the complaint is another round of negative publicity, and presumably a hefty legal bill.

The irony that the company’s marketing strategy remains predicated on depicting itself as a rulebreaker surely won’t be lost on Watt, nor his business partner and brewing mastermind Martin Dickie.

Punk has died at Brewdog

When punk rock emerged in the 1970s, its adherents courted scorn from the authorities at every opportunity. They certainly weren’t the types to run to teacher at the first sign of trouble. So perhaps BrewDog will soon need to rename its flagship beer, Punk IPA. Over the past two years, the...

capx.co

 

[ElizabethofYork]

Though a quick search suggests not at Wetherspoons:

View attachment 418669

That's right, you can't add a tip on the app. You have to give the staff a cash tip when they bring your drinks to your table.

 

[brogdale]

I suppose the argument about tipping merely subsidising the profits of low-wage employers has been worked through on here many times?

 

[xenon]

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

I suppose the argument about tipping merely subsidising the profits of low-wage employers has been worked through on here many times?

Maybe there's been a major breakthrough since the last time though.

 

[equationgirl]

With so many people not taking cash out with them now, it's a real concern whether staff actually get the tips that customers add to their card payment.

I always try to remember to take cash out with me for tips because I just don't trust restaurants and bars to pass the tips to the people they were meant for.

Same. I always tip in cash, and give directly to whoever served me.

 

[souljacker]

In Manchester, most pubs have an 'add a tip' question on the card machine when they hand you it to pay. Some bar staff say no to the question before handing it over but some don't. I've never seen this anywhere else. Either way, I don't tip bar staff. If I'm in a pub for the evening I will usually offer the barman a drink on my first round. Unless its the landlady of my local who is mental and seems to hate everybody so I never tip her.

 

[Spymaster]

I suppose the argument about tipping merely subsidising the profits of low-wage employers has been worked through on here many times?

The upcoming change in the law is noteworthy though. This weird explanation that restaurants like Ping Pong are using, that it'll raise prices, is just an admission that they've been ripping-off their staff and using the service charge as additional revenue. What should happen of course, is that service charges should be banned completely and customers made to tip in cash. If restaurants raise prices because of that, punters will vote with their feet. That won't happen though because the government would lose shit loads of income tax revenue.

 

[brogdale]

The upcoming change in the law is noteworthy though. This weird explanation that restaurants like Ping Pong are using, that it'll raise prices, is just an admission that they've been ripping-off their staff and using the service charge as additional revenue. What should happen of course, is that service charges should be banned completely and customers made to tip in cash. If restaurants raise prices because of that, punters will vote with their feet. That won't happen though because the government would lose shit loads of income tax revenue.

Given the general acceptance on the cash thread that, for many, cashless is the future, I can't see compulsion to tip in cash being at all popular or practical. Wouldn't it be better if there were no service charge or tipping and employers had to pay a living wage? After all, if a business can't afford to pay its workers properly, they aren't really a business.

 

[Orang Utan]

But you could tip 90p, but we're not culturally accustomed to do so; that was my question, really.

Not if you want the bar person to have a drink

 

[brogdale]

Not if you want the bar person to have a drink

we were talking about tipping, not specifically buying someone a drink

 

[Orang Utan]

we were talking about tipping, not specifically buying someone a drink

But in the UK, that’s what you do if you tip the bar staff

 

[brogdale]

But in the UK, that’s what you do if you tip the bar staff

Culturally, yes, but that's not tipping in the conventional sense that is seen in the restaurant trade.

 

[Spymaster]

Wouldn't it be better if there were no service charge or tipping and employers had to pay a living wage? After all, if a business can't afford to pay its workers properly, they are really a business.

Well that should happen anyway. Tips should be in addition to a fair wage and considered an agreeable addition for good service, but that's pretty much never been the case in the shitty UK hospitality sector. It's a different argument though.

 

[Orang Utan]

Culturally, yes, but that's not tipping in the conventional sense that is seen in the restaurant trade.

Yes, but if you’re getting your server a drink, 10% means you’d need to be buying 10 drinks of fhe same value

 

[brogdale]

Yes, but if you’re getting your server a drink, 10% means you’d need to be buying 10 drinks of fhe same value

Tipping, not drinks.

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

TBH I'd only get the bar person a drink if they were someone I actually knew well enough to chat to when I went there - at the moment that's really only one place, the nearest bar to home where we go regularly. I wouldn't do it for someone who's spent thirty seconds pouring me a pint.

 

[brogdale]

Well that should happen anyway. Tips should be in addition to a fair wage and considered an agreeable addition for good service, but that's pretty much never been the case in the shitty UK hospitality sector. It's a different argument though.

Yes, that's true. Too often tipping is used by employers to maintain low wages and, in some cases, to actually reduce wage rates paid by the business supplemented with shares of global tipping. When tipping there's an element of complicity with that business model.

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

Yes, that's true. Too often tipping is used by employers to maintain low wages and, in some cases, to actually reduce wage rates paid by the business supplemented with shares of global tipping. When tipping there's an element of complicity with that business model.

I think in (at least some parts of) the US that's actually a formal legal position - staff barely get paid on the basis that tips take their income over minimum wage.

 

[Orang Utan]

Tipping, not drinks.

But the tip is a drink!

 

[editor]

I rarely tip bar workers - mainly because I rarely have cash on me - but I regularly buy them drinks, and always give them free shots when I'm DJing.