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Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action

SpineyNorman said:
Is this all really necessary? Can't it be sorted via PM or something?
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Spiney. I wish it could. But theyre obsessed...they cant move on or accept its not there time now. And apart from Oshea they are anonimous. Real internet warriors and faceless fuckers...
 
I think if people have some specific evidence that bignose has personally been collaborating with special branch then they should put their dicks on the table. I don't think involvement with searchlight is proof in itself, tbh. I'm not a fan of searchlight but that doesn't mean I think absolutely everyone who has ever been involved with them are ropey.
 
bignose1 said:
Spiney. I wish it could. But theyre obsessed...they cant move on or accept its not there time now.
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Come on now,the digs have been flying both ways every time this comes up.I don't think you wear "victim" well mate.Spineys right though,pms is a better way to go .As a matter of fact i came accross this forum while researching beating the facsists,the german one(i didn't know there was an afa one),after reading another forum about it where it all got really slanderous and messy...
 
bamalama said:
Come on now,the digs have been flying both ways every time this comes up.I don't think you wear "victim" well mate.Spineys right though,pms is a better way to go .As a matter of fact i came accross this forum while researching beating the facsists,the german one(i didn't know there was an afa one),after reading another forum about it where it all got really slanderous and messy...
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Bam it all started when we had the audacity to write a book recollecting some anti fascist activities we were involved in....see the Red Action forum site if you still can which went a long way towards how it is now.
 
bignose1 said:
Bam it all started when we had the audacity to write a book recollecting some anti fascist activities we were involved in....see the Red Action forum site if you still can which went a long way towards how it is now.
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Aye i know, i read both books shortly after their publication.I know from that what some of the arguements are about.All i'm saying is that i'd imagine you're all big and ugly enough to get it sorted,somehow,face to face or by pm...i don't see any victims here.By the way i think both books are well worth a read,and mainstream media exposure of one or the other can't be a bad thing imo
 
Are either books ever going to come out in electronic form? I've bought them both in paperback but they've now been lost or whatever as I'm here, there and everywhere and always lose books.
 
SpineyNorman said:
Is this all really necessary? Can't it be sorted via PM or something?
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I suppose what it comes down to is whether you regard No Retreat, penned by Dave Hann and Steve Tilzey as a more or less truthful political record of not insignificant political events, or a novel? It was suggested on here by former colleagues that the opening scene in the book, with regard to Tilzey getting on an NF coach instead of a Man Utd one by mistake, did not happen, or at least did not happen to Tilzey.

Which inevitably leads to all sorts of questions about the honesty of the authors and their political motivation for writing the book in the first place.

Historically there have been two types of anti-fascism. One seeks to protect the centre from the far-right, the other to displace the far-right the better to carry the fight against the political centre. One is represented by the Searchlight brand while AFA represents the latter. No Retreat manages to conflate the two and concludes (and tellingly in the author's promotion of the book) accuses radical anti-fascism of betraying the entire movement out of a mixture of narrow political gain and physical cowardice.

As I said, it just depends on whether this is ultimately resolved, and whether you consider it to be politically important or not?

In my view Bignose has been patrolling the thread for 18 months in order to ensure that it isn't resolved. Simple as that.
 
To be honest I always take books like that with a pinch of salt anyway. But some of the accusations on this thread appear to go a bit further than what you've outlined there - the criticisms in the above post could be directed at someone who's made a naive mistake and is now trying to save face, whereas some of the accusations would paint him as more sinister than that.

I just think you can make those political points without making it personal. I've got a lot of respect for what you - all of you - did back then and it's just a bit sad to see this 20 years later.
 
Joe Reilly said:
I suppose what it comes down to is whether you regard No Retreat, penned by Dave Hann and Steve Tilzey as a more or less truthful political record of not insignificant political events, or a novel? It was suggested on here by former colleagues that the opening scene in the book, with regard to Tilzey getting on an NF coach instead of a Man Utd one by mistake, did not happen, or at least did not happen to Tilzey.

Which inevitably leads to all sorts of questions about the honesty of the authors and their political motivation for writing the book in the first place.

Historically there have been two types of anti-fascism. One seeks to protect the centre from the far-right, the other to displace the far-right the better to carry the fight against the political centre. One is represented by the Searchlight brand while AFA represents the latter. No Retreat manages to conflate the two and concludes (and tellingly in the author's promotion of the book) accuses radical anti-fascism of betraying the entire movement out of a mixture of narrow political gain and physical cowardice.

As I said, it just depends on whether this is ultimately resolved, and whether you consider it to be politically important or not?

In my view Bignose has been patrolling the thread for 18 months in order to ensure that it isn't resolved. Simple as that.
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You talk utter shite.... but Im out of here for a while.....so you carry on Gary....xxxx
 
audiotech said:
I said in an earlier post that I enjoyed your talk posted elsewhere. No mention of a "Brown nosing extravanganza" then.

No need to take your spat out on me.
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Sorry audiotech....I sometimes forget stuff from previous and thought it was just another anti bignose day. Apologies your right.
 
bamalama said:
Come on now,the digs have been flying both ways every time this comes up.I don't think you wear "victim" well mate.Spineys right though,pms is a better way to go .As a matter of fact i came accross this forum while researching beating the facsists,the german one(i didn't know there was an afa one),after reading another forum about it where it all got really slanderous and messy...
Click to expand...
Well 'messy' is one way of looking at it. The indymedia thread was in fact part of a determined attempt by blackening the name of the author's ('pervert, rapist, paedo') to intimidate the Freedom Press collective in pulling out of the production. There were numerous phone calls, letters and emails along similar lines. Both Tilzey and Matthew Collins were known to be involved.

Had it been say any small apolitical publishing house they would have folded.In point of fact after months of the treatment FP actually nearly buckled themselves. The final vote to publish was won by just a single vote 5-4. People were told to bring their 'stab vests' for the launch and so forth. Needless to say no one showed up on the day. Immediately after publication FP/authors began to recieve threatning letters from libel lawyers Carter Ruck.

Just this week, for their temerity in defying Searchlight, FP have been forced to shell out a £4,000 to, yes, (the alternative would likely be bankruptcy) you guessed it a Searchlight photographer for using photographs FP picked from the AFA portfolio with a supporting letter from, yes, comrade Gerry Gable stating that even AFA were not authorised to use them. So this was used to prove an 'aggravating factor' meaning even more money from FP. And so it goes on.


You still think we are all on the same side really and it might all be settled by an exchange of pm's?
 
Joe Reilly said:
Well 'messy' is one way of looking at it. The indymedia thread was in fact part of a determined attempt by blackening the name of the author's ('pervert, rapist, paedo') to intimidate the Freedom Press collective in pulling out of the production. There were numerous phone calls, letters and emails along similar lines. Both Tilzey and Matthew Collins were known to be involved.

Had it been say any small apolitical publishing house they would have folded.In point of fact after months of the treatment FP actually nearly buckled themselves. The final vote to publish was won by just a single vote 5-4. People were told to bring their 'stab vests' for the launch and so forth. Needless to say no one showed up on the day. Immediately after publication FP/authors began to recieve threatning letters from libel lawyers Carter Ruck.

Just this week, for their temerity in defying Searchlight, FP have been forced to shell out a £4,000 to, yes, (the alternative would likely be bankruptcy) you guessed it a Searchlight photographer for using photographs FP picked from the AFA portfolio with a supporting letter from, yes, comrade Gerry Gable stating that even AFA were not authorised to use them. So this was used to prove an 'aggravating factor' meaning even more money from FP. And so it goes on.


You still think we are all on the same side really and it might all be settled by an exchange of pm's?
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I didn't want to mention the other forum because it was a fucking disgrace what was said about individuals there.Frankly if those things were said about me or those i care about i'd want blood...Not that what i think matters to the individuals concerned,no i don't think it could be settled by pms,but i don't think it's gonna get settled here either...I've never been a fan of searchlight, i remember that prick ray hill and his dodgy writings on the bloody sunday(i think) demos.
 
Joe Reilly said:
Well 'messy' is one way of looking at it. The indymedia thread was in fact part of a determined attempt by blackening the name of the author's ('pervert, rapist, paedo') to intimidate the Freedom Press collective in pulling out of the production. There were numerous phone calls, letters and emails along similar lines. Both Tilzey and Matthew Collins were known to be involved.

Had it been say any small apolitical publishing house they would have folded.In point of fact after months of the treatment FP actually nearly buckled themselves. The final vote to publish was won by just a single vote 5-4. People were told to bring their 'stab vests' for the launch and so forth. Needless to say no one showed up on the day. Immediately after publication FP/authors began to recieve threatning letters from libel lawyers Carter Ruck.

Just this week, for their temerity in defying Searchlight, FP have been forced to shell out a £4,000 to, yes, (the alternative would likely be bankruptcy) you guessed it a Searchlight photographer for using photographs FP picked from the AFA portfolio with a supporting letter from, yes, comrade Gerry Gable stating that even AFA were not authorised to use them. So this was used to prove an 'aggravating factor' meaning even more money from FP. And so it goes on.


You still think we are all on the same side really and it might all be settled by an exchange of pm's?
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IM back...so Gary evidence please ....put up or shut up. I think your grossly exaggerating infact making it all up. Do you think your behaviour leading up to and following NR publication was of the highest quality. Listen for the last fucking time you moron Ive nothing to do with what GG is doing nor HnH or FP... believe me I couldnt care about it your fucking book...good luck to you I think your problem is we beat you to it and your fucking ego cant take it. I do remember the death threats Dave recieved from your lot, very similar to how you used MCr gangland figures to intimidate opposition and I dont mean fash ie Leeds AFA. Your not listening when I say I left Searchlight in 94...you claimed NR was a Searchlight spoiler..you were wrong matey. As far as this shites going and I agree no PM ping pong will assist why dont we both fuck off and leave it up to who the fuck wants it. You chose to start the insults and lies and now you cant resist trying the sympathy vote. Boo fucking hoo.
 
Citizen66 said:
I'd happily pay for them in electronic format. I don't torrent stuff like books and apps by small devs and independent publishers. Seems a cunty thing to do.
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No Retreat is on Kindle and some bizzare fantasy called Dead Paki Walking. Also samples
Stuart Christie was talking on Facebook about putting Anarcho books online but I can't see Beating The Fascists being one of these.
However AFA/IWCA sell them at their socials for £5.00 so its hardly expensive!
http://www.amazon.co.uk/No-Retreat-...?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1338415581&sr=1-1

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dead-Paki-W...?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1338416007&sr=1-1

http://www.facebook.com/#!/skateraw
 
SpineyNorman said:
To be honest I always take books like that with a pinch of salt anyway. But some of the accusations on this thread appear to go a bit further than what you've outlined there - the criticisms in the above post could be directed at someone who's made a naive mistake and is now trying to save face, whereas some of the accusations would paint him as more sinister than that.

I just think you can make those political points without making it personal. I've got a lot of respect for what you - all of you - did back then and it's just a bit sad to see this 20 years later.
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Tilzey was never actually in AFA as such. He quit street work before AFA was set up. And naive he a'int. He is though both weak and viscious in about equal measure. And while for a time we might have had an enemy in common, we were, as should be fully evident, never really on the same side.
 
Nigel said:
No Retreat is on Kindle and some bizzare fantasy called Dead Paki Walking. Also samples
Stuart Christie was talking on Facebook about putting Anarcho books online but I can't see Beating The Fascists being one of these.
However AFA/IWCA sell them at their socials for £5.00 so its hardly expensive!
http://www.amazon.co.uk/No-Retreat-...?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1338415581&sr=1-1

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dead-Paki-W...?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1338416007&sr=1-1

http://www.facebook.com/#!/skateraw
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i got that dead paki walking but andi ali (iirc) who wrote it comes across as something of a loon. a very confused loon too, imo
 
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