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Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action

bignose1 said:
Not quite as pukesome as your 'should see the crew weve got now quote'
Prick
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Dearie dearie me. Shame you didn't have the confidence to leave your previous post up before deleting. We could have had a nice chat about that one.

Sometimes when I think back some 25 years ago when mad Roy had you by the neck........was I right to intervene? Ah well, just me being a prick eh?

For the wider audience, bignose remark above relates to when he found out where I drank and began stalking me. Pretending to be my long lost best friend ever....until I lost patience wondering what the fuck he wanted. He then told anyone who would listen to him that I had thrown him out of his local!!!

Not sure what your reference to the people I watch football with, has to do with anything, but, funnily enough some of them witnessed your shenanigans at the United legends night in Dublin.

Bumped into one of your crew recently when I met up with some activists in Manchester. Fellow by the name of Simon. Claimed he fell out with me 10 years ago. I told him I have never met him, do not recognise him and have certainly not fell out with him.’ I’m a mate of Steve Tilzey and Glen’ he said. 'And I had long hair then.'

What did we fall out about I enquired? About Dave Hann he said. I told him that was 15 years ago and he most certainly was not around or involved. End of conversation.

Another AFA veteran has had a similar experience with your friend Simon, to whom he claimed that he was in AFA circa 1996, and had been out on jobs with the well known and highly respected AFA veteran. The veteran said I’m sorry but I do not know you, are you sure? Yes yes AFA stuff years ago, I know Steve Tilzey was Simon’s response. Sorry I have never worked with you was the reply from the veteran.

Was this the same person you had in tow at Dessy’s funeral? If it was, then it was the first time both myself and the AFA veteran had ever seen him, and he certainly didn’t know us. So how he can claim to have already met and worked/fell out with us some years previous to this is pretty damn remarkable.

Perhaps you can shed some light on this.
 
Demu said:
Dearie dearie me. Shame you didn't have the confidence to leave your previous post up before deleting. We could have had a nice chat about that one.

Sometimes when I think back some 25 years ago when mad Roy had you by the neck........was I right to intervene? Ah well, just me being a prick eh?

For the wider audience, bignose remark above relates to when he found out where I drank and began stalking me. Pretending to be my long lost best friend ever....until I lost patience wondering what the fuck he wanted. He then told anyone who would listen to him that I had thrown him out of his local!!!

Not sure what your reference to the people I watch football with, has to do with anything, but, funnily enough some of them witnessed your shenanigans at the United legends night in Dublin.

Bumped into one of your crew recently when I met up with some activists in Manchester. Fellow by the name of Simon. Claimed he fell out with me 10 years ago. I told him I have never met him, do not recognise him and have certainly not fell out with him.’ I’m a mate of Steve Tilzey and Glen’ he said. 'And I had long hair then.'

What did we fall out about I enquired? About Dave Hann he said. I told him that was 15 years ago and he most certainly was not around or involved. End of conversation.

Another AFA veteran has had a similar experience with your friend Simon, to whom he claimed that he was in AFA circa 1996, and had been out on jobs with the well known and highly respected AFA veteran. The veteran said I’m sorry but I do not know you, are you sure? Yes yes AFA stuff years ago, I know Steve Tilzey was Simon’s response. Sorry I have never worked with you was the reply from the veteran.

Was this the same person you had in tow at Dessy’s funeral? If it was, then it was the first time both myself and the AFA veteran had ever seen him, and he certainly didn’t know us. So how he can claim to have already met and worked/fell out with us some years previous to this is pretty damn remarkable.

Perhaps you can shed some light on this.
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I found out where you drank...dont think so...one of your pals invited me over from a pub across the road..you were fine,,you gave me a hug. Dont forget Denis it is my local..I didnt even know you were back in Manchester. Stalking you..fucking hell do me a favour... Re Roy...who had a history of flying off the handle..cant remember for sure but was it when I was driving a van in Stockport after eddie whickers court case? and he twatted me from behind..class eh. For the record I remember you getting chased outside the Grants a few years back by a local pissed off by your shenanigans, round and round a car, quite funny at the time. Oh and what a hero you were picking on those two brothers..Raith..forget the other one. You tormented them constantly...often just punching them in the face for no reason. You hide behind gangs and veiled threats but Ive sussed you out. Youve no working class legacy..your record consists of a few punch ups here and there and fuck all else. And you slag me off for being washed up..fucked blah blah. Tell you what Cifford you dont half ramble. But then youve got a crew listening to you.
 
bignose1 said:
I found out where you drank...dont think so...one of your pals invited me over from a pub across the road..you were fine,,you gave me a hug. Dont forget Denis it is my local..I didnt even know you were back in Manchester. Stalking you..fucking hell do me a favour... Re Roy...who had a history of flying off the handle..cant remember for sure but was it when I was driving a van in Stockport after eddie whickers court case? and he twatted me from behind..class eh. For the record I remember you getting chased outside the Grants a few years back by a local pissed off by your shenanigans, round and round a car, quite funny at the time. Oh and what a hero you were picking on those two brothers..Raith..forget the other one. You tormented them constantly...often just punching them in the face for no reason. You hide behind gangs and veiled threats but Ive sussed you out. Youve no working class legacy..your record consists of a few punch ups here and there and fuck all else. And you slag me off for being washed up..fucked blah blah. Tell you what Cifford you dont half ramble. But then youve got a crew listening to you.
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And Simon?
 
Demu said:
And Simon?
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Re Dublin legends night...about 4 years ago with Paddy C, Gordon McQ and Boylie. Ive been to 3 since. Shenanigans...change of venue at short notice to a somewhat unfriendly part of the City. A bit like the reception I got last time I clapped eyes on you in yer "local"
Simon...what am I supposed to be responding to..what do you want me to admit to..what what what..here you go again..
 
For those in the dark - the mysterious "Simon" that Demu refers to in a post recently is currently lurking about with the MAFA group in Manchester. Pretending to have long time associations with old anti fascist activists , which turn out to be bogus, is of course usually the " performance art "of ****** (ed - phrase deleted for legal reasons) of some sort. As has been said many times before , anti fascists always need to keep their wits about them about possible agent provocateurs in their midst.

As some will recall (no doubt with amusement) a few of us in Manchester in the Squad in 1980 weren't always as wary as we should have been - and ended up doing time for our casualness about unchecked-out people hanging about around us - though we were generally pretty careful --- but one slip and they've got you, so be wary , be careful.

But Demu... Bignose... come on guys .... time to move on and let it all go. The new capitalist crisis is upon us, and it's time to face up to that.
 
Has he been checked properly? It seems a bit premature naming him on here unless he has been checked out.
 
ayatollah said:
Pretending to have long time associations with old anti fascist activists , which turn out to be bogus, is of course usually the " performance art "of ++++ of some sort.
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Not to disagree with your general point, but I've known several bods with this MO who I think, on reflection, were not state - the motivation in their case was to give it the big I am and be seen as being "in". Personal inadequates in other words. Of course, such types have to be kept at arm's length just as much as someone who is actually dodge, for the simple fact that anything they know will also be known to everyone else in fairly short order.
 
past caring said:
Not to disagree with your general point, but I've known several bods with this MO who I think, on reflection, were not state - the motivation in their case was to give it the big I am and be seen as being "in". Personal inadequates in other words. Of course, such types have to be kept at arm's length just as much as someone who is actually dodge, for the simple fact that anything they know will also be known to everyone else in fairly short order.
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This is exactly what I was thinking.
 
past caring said:
Not to disagree with your general point, but I've known several bods with this MO who I think, on reflection, were not state - the motivation in their case was to give it the big I am and be seen as being "in". Personal inadequates in other words. Of course, such types have to be kept at arm's length just as much as someone who is actually dodge, for the simple fact that anything they know will also be known to everyone else in fairly short order.
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You are probably quite right. From what Demu says about his rather surreal interaction with this bod he at least needs checking out.
 
bignose1 said:
Youve no working class legacy..your record consists of a few punch ups here and there and fuck all else.
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But then Steve, according to another good pal of yours, Glen P./Abu/?/none of us, have any 'real working class legacy' do we? At a public meeting in Belfast in July, accompanied by Hann's missus, he publicly denounced the contributors to BTF as nothing but 'armachair generals'.

Prior to that he had pointed the finger at another former AFA organiser as a 'tout'. This led to a formal investigation by the republican group Eirighi - at it should be said, the insistence of the victim of the smear.

After being interviewed by senior republicans, the investigation concluded that it was Glen P and not the target of the smear that was a tad dodgy.

He has duly been informed he is persona non grata.
 
past caring said:
Not to disagree with your general point, but I've known several bods with this MO who I think, on reflection, were not state - the motivation in their case was to give it the big I am and be seen as being "in". Personal inadequates in other words. Of course, such types have to be kept at arm's length just as much as someone who is actually dodge, for the simple fact that anything they know will also be known to everyone else in fairly short order.
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Not to disagree with your general point, but the problem is that it is often very difficult to tell them apart. Not only that, but if permitted they can wreak as much damage as any paid agent. They tend to spread lies, about themselves and everyone else; elevate gossip to fact, and are invariably found on the wrong side of every political discussion. Though they can manipulate they can also be effortlessy manipulated, and are thus utterly unreliable at best, and are generally devastatingly corrosive to morale. You should know.

Think of the branch meetings in south London AFA shortly before the end and tell me I'm wrong!

As I understand it, off the back of a no doubt swash-buckling CV, one of the aforementioned leading lights went on to enjoy a senior role in Antifa, leading inevitably to many an activist in the jail or facing it.

Finally if not malign, just merely inadequate, their eccentric behaviour can create the ideal environment for the genuine article to hide in plain sight. Anyone who surrounds himself with such creatures is himself a de facto if not de jure traitor to the movement.
 
Deareg said:
Has he been checked properly? It seems a bit premature naming him on here unless he has been checked out.
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Deareg, who are you expecting to check him out? Do you know this Simon fella?

Incidentally the other 2 activists who he claims to have met and worked with are both well known to you.
 
Demu said:
Deareg, who are you expecting to check him out? Do you know this Simon fella?

Incidentally the other 2 activists who he claims to have met and worked with are both well known to you.
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Demu said:
Deareg, who are you expecting to check him out? Do you know this Simon fella?

Incidentally the other 2 activists who he claims to have met and worked with are both well known to you.
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I don't know him at least I don't think so and I am not doubting your word either, I just think that it is wrong to label him publicly until some attempt has at least been made to verify his story, you are right to be wary and right to warn people privately, the only way that I can see he could be checked out is to ask as many old timers as possible, maybe with a photo, even if he was only a cling on, someone is bound to remember him, I was not having a go at you just felt that it was wrong of the Ayatollah to name him on here at the moment.
 
Deareg said:
I don't know him at least I don't think so and I am not doubting your word either, I just think that it is wrong to label him publicly until some attempt has at least been made to verify his story, you are right to be wary and right to warn people privately, the only way that I can see he could be checked out is to ask as many old timers as possible, maybe with a photo, even if he was only a cling on, someone is bound to remember him, I was not having a go at you just felt that it was wrong of the Ayatollah to name him on here at the moment.
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I don't really think mentioning a forename is quite a full "naming", except to those close associates who really DO need to check this guy out.
And anyway Demu has already identified him to his close associates in post 1442:

"Bumped into one of your crew recently when I met up with some activists in Manchester. Fellow by the name of Simon. Claimed he fell out with me 10 years ago. I told him I have never met him, do not recognise him and have certainly not fell out with him.’ I’m a mate of Steve Tilzey and Glen’ he said. 'And I had long hair then.'"

However, anyone creating a completely bogus long term CV and then having the brass cheek to claim long past association with Demu and others to his face is a dangerous guy, as Joe correctly says. If I recall correctly from my conversation with Demu a few months ago about this totally surreal encounter , what the person's surname is, I think you'd all start laughing... nah .... Demu must have been pulling my leg on that one , or I misheard him.

How I wish that in 1980 we who eventually did time after being led up the garden path by a manipulative fantasist/ and/or agent provocateur hanging around the SWP student group at Manchester Poly, had paid a bit more attention to her name... "Michelle MOLE" I kid you not ... big chuckles all round ! Sob.
 
Deareg said:
I don't know him at least I don't think so and I am not doubting your word either, I just think that it is wrong to label him publicly until some attempt has at least been made to verify his story, you are right to be wary and right to warn people privately, the only way that I can see he could be checked out is to ask as many old timers as possible, maybe with a photo, even if he was only a cling on, someone is bound to remember him, I was not having a go at you just felt that it was wrong of the Ayatollah to name him on here at the moment.
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I don’t believe he has been named. In fact the converse is true. This guy it would appear is naming activists he did not know or work with, and is placing them into a fabricated construct of his own political history. For what reason?

I can understand someone claiming to know people that perhaps on closer inspection, they don’t really know, but this is markedly different. This fella was adamant that I knew him and that we had been working in the same political arena (presumably AFA) prior to falling out over Dave Hann . He was beseeching me to recognise him, describing how his change in appearance could be playing tricks with my memory, naming Tilzey and Glen as his references. As he was clearly told, ‘long hair, short hair, no hair, I don’t know you and have never worked with you or fell out with you.’ A complete fabrication.

My only recollection of ever seeing him previously was at Dessy’s funeral.

My question to Tilzey , which over his two follow up posts of bluff, bluster and bullshit he studiously avoided, was whether this was the same person he had in tow at Dessys funeral. I am quite sure that it is.

In casting my mind back to Dessy's funeral, I do recall a somewhat revealing cameo which came into play on the day.

As the funeral cortege turned left down Maitland street, I noticed Steve and Simon on the pavement to my left and a Donal MacIntyre camera crew set further back on the right hand side of the road. As the cortege turned the corner, Steve and Simon entered the cortege and placed themselves immediately in front of the RA contingent. A manoeuvre which I could only presume was for the benefit of the attendant camera crew. This footage would certainly ‘place’ Simon in the company of some of the people that Simon now claims to have worked with some nine years previous to this.

This was noted at the time as being rather odd, but was seen as Mr T rather than Simon, playing to the cameras.
 
Demu said:
I don’t believe he has been named. In fact the converse is true. This guy it would appear is naming activists he did not know or work with, and is placing them into a fabricated construct of his own political history. For what reason?

I can understand someone claiming to know people that perhaps on closer inspection, they don’t really know, but this is markedly different. This fella was adamant that I knew him and that we had been working in the same political arena (presumably AFA) prior to falling out over Dave Hann . He was beseeching me to recognise him, describing how his change in appearance could be playing tricks with my memory, naming Tilzey and Glen as his references. As he was clearly told, ‘long hair, short hair, no hair, I don’t know you and have never worked with you or fell out with you.’ A complete fabrication.

My only recollection of ever seeing him previously was at Dessy’s funeral.

My question to Tilzey , which over his two follow up posts of bluff, bluster and bullshit he studiously avoided, was whether this was the same person he had in tow at Dessys funeral. I am quite sure that it is.

In casting my mind back to Dessy's funeral, I do recall a somewhat revealing cameo which came into play on the day.

As the funeral cortege turned left down Maitland street, I noticed Steve and Simon on the pavement to my left and a Donal MacIntyre camera crew set further back on the right hand side of the road. As the cortege turned the corner, Steve and Simon entered the cortege and placed themselves immediately in front of the RA contingent. A manoeuvre which I could only presume was for the benefit of the attendant camera crew. This footage would certainly ‘place’ Simon in the company of some of the people that Simon now claims to have worked with some nine years previous to this.

This was noted at the time as being rather odd, but was seen as Mr T rather than Simon, playing to the cameras.
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You really are a sad fucker Clifford...again your fantasising about me...ah it all fits now...blah...last week I had a shit in Sainsburys...must have been a rendesvous.
 
Demu said:
I don’t believe he has been named. In fact the converse is true. This guy it would appear is naming activists he did not know or work with, and is placing them into a fabricated construct of his own political history. For what reason?

I can understand someone claiming to know people that perhaps on closer inspection, they don’t really know, but this is markedly different. This fella was adamant that I knew him and that we had been working in the same political arena (presumably AFA) prior to falling out over Dave Hann . He was beseeching me to recognise him, describing how his change in appearance could be playing tricks with my memory, naming Tilzey and Glen as his references. As he was clearly told, ‘long hair, short hair, no hair, I don’t know you and have never worked with you or fell out with you.’ A complete fabrication.

My only recollection of ever seeing him previously was at Dessy’s funeral.

My question to Tilzey , which over his two follow up posts of bluff, bluster and bullshit he studiously avoided, was whether this was the same person he had in tow at Dessys funeral. I am quite sure that it is.

In casting my mind back to Dessy's funeral, I do recall a somewhat revealing cameo which came into play on the day.

As the funeral cortege turned left down Maitland street, I noticed Steve and Simon on the pavement to my left and a Donal MacIntyre camera crew set further back on the right hand side of the road. As the cortege turned the corner, Steve and Simon entered the cortege and placed themselves immediately in front of the RA contingent. A manoeuvre which I could only presume was for the benefit of the attendant camera crew. This footage would certainly ‘place’ Simon in the company of some of the people that Simon now claims to have worked with some nine years previous to this.

This was noted at the time as being rather odd, but was seen as Mr T rather than Simon, playing to the cameras.
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Demu, I have no idea about any of that, NR mentioned this fella to me when he was in Ireland a while back, all I was told is that he has approached a couple of people asking them if they remember him from 20 years ago, and neither did, and that you were wary of him, if that is all there is to it, then it seemed to me to be a bit extreme to label him a +++++++ of some sort, I am bowing out of this one now, good luck.
 
Deareg said:
Demu, I have no idea about any of that, NR mentioned this fella to me when he was in Ireland a while back, all I was told is that he has approached a couple of people asking them if they remember him from 20 years ago, and neither did, and that you were wary of him, if that is all there is to it, then it seemed to me to be a bit extreme to label him a ++++++t of some sort, I am bowing out of this one now, good luck.
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I haven't labelled him as anything. I do not know him. He has approached me unsolicited and insisted that he knows me.
 
Divisive Cotton said:
It's funny reading the fascist reviews of No Retreat on Amazon: http://www.amazon.co.uk/product-rev...?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=0&filterBy=addOneStar
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One of the curiosities is that as far as I am aware, apart from Joey Jones, (and that particular thread was first revised and then ended abruptly) no other fascists have offered a view one way of the other. Also on two seperate occassions a thread on Stormfront began and ended within minutes of being put up.

Is there any reason anyone can think of why the opposition, who were perfectly happy to discuss No Retreat - it was even reviewed by a prominent BNP member - have so far expressed no opinion on BTF?
 
Joe Reilly said:
One of the curiosities is that as far as I am aware, apart from Joey Jones, (and that particular thread was first revised and then ended abruptly) no other fascists have offered a view one way of the other. Also on two seperate occassions a thread on Stormfront began and ended within minutes of being put up.

Is there any reason anyone can think of why the opposition, who were perfectly happy to discuss No Retreat - it was even reviewed by a prominent BNP member - have so far expressed no opinion on BTF?
Click to expand...

I know of a fairly candid thread on a fash forum on BTF. One min

EDIT:

Mods note. ALWAYS break links such as that.
 
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