Assange seeks asylum in Ecuador embassy, London

[London_Calling]

Last time I checked the UK didn't exactly have a favourable and balanced extradition treaty with the USA, why does he need to be in Sweden before the USA make their move?

The USA will obv. have made its own judgment. The fact the Sweden process is/was almost complete may have had some weight. Extradition to the USA is already a live issue in the UK anyway (Gary Mckinnon and several others). Who knows...

Whatever, he's not lurking in the Ecuadorian Embassy to avoid Swedish justice.

 

[DownwardDog]

Embassy vehicle is moving sovereign territory.

If it were, he's still got to get out of it to get on an aircraft. Even if the Ecuadorans leased a rendition special Gulfstream V and drove onto the airport to meet it he'd still be subject to UK law while the aircraft was on the ground.

I predict that faking some sort of medical condition will be his next move.

 

[redsquirrel]

Whats been shown to be weak here is some peoples ability to keep their principals intact rather than sacrifice the moral high ground for the sake of protecting a personality who hides behind stuff in a manner that utterly undermines the cause he claims to fight for.

Selective accountability, disgusting. Playing the pseudo-martyr in a manner that undermines the cause rather than draws attention to the methods and injustices of the enemy, idiotic. Undermining the institution you tried to create, pathetic. Inverting the role of victim and perpetrator to save your own neck, indefensible. Drawing attention away from the substance of the leaks, or the plight of Bradley Manning, perverse.

Spot on, elbows.

 

[smmudge]

Completing the process that was set in motion when he did things that caused two women to ask the police if its possible to require him to get a HIV test.

He didn't avoid that in the first instance; he avoided it when his rights became threatened. Why are you only selectively reading?

 

[goldenecitrone]

I mean for fucks sake, comments about prostitution and suchlike have pissed me off, but even if I put that to one side for a moment and suppose that he may was snared in a honeytrap, that still leaves him open to criticism in my book.

If you've decided to mess with one of the most powerful forces in the world in a very dramatic and high-profile manner, do not put your genitals anywhere near anybody that is not a well known and trusted part of your life, and especially not at the moment where the heat on you is fresh and near a peak.

Wise words. I'm sure Mordechai Vanunu would wholeheartedly agree with you.

The Israeli government decided to capture Vanunu, but determined to avoid harming its good relationship with Prime MinisterMargaret Thatcher, and not wanting to risk confrontation with British intelligence, determined Vanunu should be persuaded to leave British territory under his own volition. Through constant surveillance, the Mossad found that Vanunu had become lonely and eager for female companionship. Masquerading as an American tourist called "Cindy", Israeli Mossad agent Cheryl Bentovbefriended Vanunu, and on 30 September persuaded him to fly to Rome with her on a holiday.[23] This relation has been perceived as a classic honey trap operation whereby an intelligence agent employs seduction to gain the target's trust—a practice which has been officially sanctioned in Israel.

 

[danny la rouge]

Worked for Umaro Diko

That was the reference, yes.

 

[Jon-of-arc]

He didn't avoid that in the first instance; he avoided it when his rights became threatened. Why are you only selectively reading?

How were his rights threatened?

 

[smmudge]

How were his rights threatened?

It became clear that if he went to Sweden he would be extradited to the US, most likely with no consideration of his legal rights, and most likely to end up in solitary confinement for the rest of his natural born.

 

[Combustible]

It became clear that if he went to Sweden he would be extradited to the US, most likely with no consideration of his legal rights, and most likely to end up in solitary confinement for the rest of his natural born.

How did that become clear? Why couldn't the US extradite him from the UK?

 

[London_Calling]

Because the USA has decided on a diff strategy, poss for reasons not known to the Internet people but which might include developments elsewhere (Manning), the already fragile extradition relationship (McKinnon, et al) and the fact the Swedish case is so far advanced.

 

[Jon-of-arc]

It became clear that if he went to Sweden he would be extradited to the US, most likely with no consideration of his legal rights, and most likely to end up in solitary confinement for the rest of his natural born.

The text you posted doesnt say that.

 

[temper_tantrum]

It became clear that if he went to Sweden he would be extradited to the US, most likely with no consideration of his legal rights, and most likely to end up in solitary confinement for the rest of his natural born.

I don't understand the 'scared of extradition from Sweden to US' argument. The UK surely is far more likely to extradite him to the US? We have an extremely pro-US extradition system. What's the rationale behind this argument, have I missed something?

^^^ Explanation please.

 

[ViolentPanda]

If it were, he's still got to get out of it to get on an aircraft. Even if the Ecuadorans leased a rendition special Gulfstream V and drove onto the airport to meet it he'd still be subject to UK law while the aircraft was on the ground.

I predict that faking some sort of medical condition will be his next move.

Enough unprotected sex with women he doesn't know, and he's bound to have a few STDs fermenting away inside him.

 

[Streathamite]

I may have used some inappropriate words. Would have been on safer ground if I'd said generalisation rather than truism for a start.

In this specific case people can go on about whatever general well-founded views they like about individual enemies of a state being picked off by fair means or foul, it doesn't mean Assange should be free of responsibility for his actions.

Best way to turn this train-wreck into a positive is if the lesson people learnt from it was this:

Don't be deterred from whistle blowing, be deterred from disrespecting the parameters that others set out when they let you sleep with them.

Ok yes, I totally agree with this post

 

[London_Calling]

I was curious as to why prosecutors in Sweden were so reluctant to charge him on the consent issue .. anyway:

The article suggests both complainants boasted of their Assange 'conquest' by text message after the event and didn't think they'd been sexual molested until a later date - if that stands up in evidence ... well, a jury isn't going to accept an ex-post facto state of mind.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/12/06/assange-rape-accuser-cia-ties/

 

[Random]

I was curious as to why prosecutors in Sweden were so reluctant to charge him on the consent issue .. anyway:

The article suggests both complainants boasted of their Assange 'conquest' by text message after the event and didn't think they'd been sexual molested until a later date - if that stands up in evidence ... well, a jury isn't going to accept an ex-post facto state of mind.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/12/06/assange-rape-accuser-cia-ties/

Have I missed the bit where you apologised for using racial abuse?

 

[smmudge]

The text you posted doesnt say that.

Not about the solitary confinement bit, no (the other parts, yes it does). That has been speculated elsewhere. Maybe America wants him extradited over there to give him a medal and a ticker tape parade.

^^^ Explanation please.

I wouldn't say it was more likely that anyone could be extradited from the UK than from Sweden - they both have very cushy relationships with the US. But the US expected Assange to be/stay in Sweden, and started the process while he was there. It sounds like they are pretty much poised and ready to take him as soon as/if he returns.

 

[temper_tantrum]

'it sounds like' - source?

 

[butchersapron]

Not about the solitary confinement bit, no (the other parts, yes it does). That has been speculated elsewhere. Maybe America wants him extradited over there to give him a medal and a ticker tape parade.



I wouldn't say it was more likely that anyone could be extradited from the UK than from Sweden - they both have very cushy relationships with the US. But the US expected Assange to be/stay in Sweden, and started the process while he was there. It sounds like they are pretty much poised and ready to take him as soon as/if he returns.

No it doesn't.It sounds like some Assange supporters have been muugged/mugged themselves into believing this is the case, then solely concentrating on this rather than any other aspect of the issue. Shameful.

 

[smmudge]

'it sounds like' - source?

It's all outlined in the Pilger article.

 

[butchersapron]

No it's not. Is this the only article that you've read on this? Anything over the last 18 months opposed to this telling? Assange was allowed to go to the UK on the understanding that he would return to Sweden btw.

 

[temper_tantrum]

It's all outlined in the Pilger article.

Sadly lacking in facts, full of wild leaps, over-exaggeration, mis-representation and clearly biased. The assertions re: Sweden and extradition come from, erm, Assange's lawyer. So, 'it sounds like' in Pilger's view. But actual evidence is still lacking.
So, again - where is this evidence that it is easier for the US to extradite from Sweden than from the UK?

 

[Dan U]

re: arresting him.

if what i read in the today is correct, even if they give him a diplomatic passport, his inclusion on the list of people with 'immunity' has to be pre-approved by the FCO, not likely to happen one would think.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/jun/20/julian-assange-asylum-questions-answers

If Assange steps out of the embassy, he is liable to be arrested. Were he to be given a diplomatic passport, that would not alter the situation: immunity from arrest is only conferred on diplomats accredited to the Court of St James's by the Foreign Office.
Any attempt by the Ecuadoreans to have him accredited would be rebuffed by UK authorities. Were Assange to accept an Ecuadorean diplomatic passport, some suggest, he would become an Ecuadorean national – and therefore be unable to seek asylum in what would now be his own country's embassy. Diplomacy is a cunning profession – dangerously double-edged.

 

[butchersapron]

This special extradition relationship Sweden has with the US - the one they put on their offical site 18 months ago:

Due to general agreements in the European Arrest Warrant Act, Sweden cannot extradite a person who has been surrendered to Sweden from another country without certain considerations. Concerning surrender to another country within the European Union, the Act states that the executing country under certain circumstances must approve a further surrender.​

​

On the other hand, if the extradition concerns a country outside the European Union the authorities in the executing country (the country that surrendered the person) must consent such extradition. Sweden cannot, without such consent extradite a person, for example to the U.S.A.​

So the same conditions apply to extradition to the US from Sweden as apply to extradition from the UK. He just doesn't face rape charges over here.

 

[London_Calling]

Fuck me, Urban's awash in extradition experts.

 

[gosub]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ed-regardless-of-Ecuador-asylum-decision.html

 

[Treacle Toes]

Someone just tried to bambuser a statement outside the embassy : http://bambuser.com/v/2768923
Can't hear much so will have to wait for the msm.

 

[smmudge]

Assange was allowed to go to the UK on the understanding that he would return to Sweden btw.

If it was understood that he was going to return to Sweden, why was a European arrest warrant issued?

 

[butchersapron]

If it was understood that he was going to return to Sweden, why was a European arrest warrant issued?

Because he didn't return for his agreed interview then refused to. Do you know anything about this beyond that Pilger 'article'?

 

[smmudge]

Because he didn't return for his agreed interview then refused to. Do you know anything about this beyond that Pilger 'article'?

Everyone only knows anything about this through the media. I trust Pilger over the mainstream any day.