Andy Coulson arrested [now charged]

[TheHoodedClaw]

What's the difference between being "arrested" and being "detained"? Latter was what's the BBC kept using.

In Scotland you can be detained for questioning for up to 12 hours*, after which you are either arrested or released.

*A high-ranking officer can extend this for another 12 hours

Here's an article about it:

http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.c...-police-a-quick-guide-to-detention/#more-1213

the article says that travel time is included in the 12 hours, so an extension is likely.

 

[youngian]

Seven policemen to arrest one sleepy person? Mob handed or what?

They are in no mood to use kid gloves and need to show who is in charge.

News International have been shaking down police officers with inducements, jobs and bribes, and I doubt if we know the half of what strokes the NoTW and the Sun have been pulling.

 

[Streathamite]

They are in no mood to use kid gloves and need to show who is in charge.

News International have been shaking down police officers with inducements, jobs and bribes, and I doubt if we know the half of what strokes the NoTW and the Sun have been pulling.

precisely - given the shit the Met are in over the NoTW, their brethren can't afford to look like they're playing it soft

 

[Gingerman]

Oh for the day when the headline is 'Rupert Murdoch arrested'

 

[marty21]

what does this mean for the Sheridan perjury conviction? If Coulson is fouind guilty of perjury in his evidence against Sheridan - does that mean Tommy has a chance of an appeal?

 

[Kippa]

Isn't Rupert Murdoch technically a US citizen? And if he is do you really think the US would deport him to the UK?

 

[geminisnake]

There must be a pigsty they could use somewhere betweeen Dulwich and Glasgow? Seems like a massive faff and waste of cash.

Not sure but maybe because it is a scottish case and scots law has differences to english law they have to bring him up here to interview him.

Marty, I think Tommy told his own lies in his case so the perjury thing would still stand. I didn't pay much attention at the time, too disappointed in Tommy turning bad

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

what does this mean for the Sheridan perjury conviction? If Coulson is fouind guilty of perjury in his evidence against Sheridan - does that mean Tommy has a chance of an appeal?

What geminisnake said. Also, Coulson was one of Tommy's defence witnesses, so I can't see any appeal going anywhere.

 

[ViolentPanda]

What's the difference between being "arrested" and being "detained"? Latter was what's the BBC kept using.

Detained = held for questioning, charges not yet laid. They're (auntie Beeb) being scrupulous, so as not to possibly incur a writ from Coulson if he miraculously escapes his coming immersion in shit.

 

[ViolentPanda]

In Scotland you can be detained for questioning for up to 12 hours*, after which you are either arrested or released.

*A high-ranking officer can extend this for another 12 hours

Here's an article about it:

http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.c...-police-a-quick-guide-to-detention/#more-1213

the article says that travel time is included in the 12 hours, so an extension is likely.

They will charge him, though. They wouldn't have put on the circus, otherwise.

 

[Streathamite]

Isn't Rupert Murdoch technically a US citizen? And if he is do you really think the US would deport him to the UK?

given his extensive US interests, I'm hopeful something equally serious and shameful comes to light there

 

[ViolentPanda]

what does this mean for the Sheridan perjury conviction? If Coulson is fouind guilty of perjury in his evidence against Sheridan - does that mean Tommy has a chance of an appeal?

He might be given leave to appeal the conviction, but he might not want to. He's got to be worrying about what sort of shit Coulson's friends in the media and government might throw at him.

 

[equationgirl]

Imagine being a Strathclyde copper...You'd jump at any opportunity for a bit of a holiday with London glamour what with the weather and all. You can imagine them drawing lots in the nick.

Why else do you think we're still sniffing round "I though nothing of it at the time...Though I did wonder why she wasn't allowed to talk and looked petrified" Portuguese cabbie driver types 5 or so years on

You're kidding?! It's been boiling hot up here until today.

I'm liking the fact he'll get some lovely local hospitality though

 

[where to]

TS is very bright. him summoning AC way back then was always with this moment in mind. this also explains his subsequent silence, and his pause before his inevitable appeal against the perjury conviction.

AC was trapped that day in court and TS may just, just have secured his get out with that manoeuvre. he's served his time but he wants his credibility back and incorrectly believes winning in court can achieve that. (it won't though.)

the irony is, this is not good news for the Scottish left. It provides further reason to believe that the never ending Sheridan saga and consequential open wound in the Scottish left will remain so for another few years yet. at best.

 

[stavros]

Never understand why they do this, why drag him all the way to Scotland, surely they could interview him in his own front room?

I know. They could give his mobile a call, because he of all people is unlikely to leave it on voicemail.

 

[equationgirl]

Never understand why they do this, why drag him all the way to Scotland, surely they could interview him in his own front room?

It's to do with cross-border powers of arrest under the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994 (specifically s137(7) ), which states that the individual must be taken to the nearest convenient designated police station in Scotland, in this case one of the Glasgow stations.

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

It's to do with cross-border powers of arrest under the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994 (specifically s137(7) ), which states that the individual must be taken to the nearest convenient designated police station in Scotland, in this case one of the Glasgow stations.

Yes, and contrary to what I posted earlier, it seems that because it falls under the cross-border provisions, the 12-hr period starts when the detainee is presented at the designated police station. It'll be a long night for Mr Coulson...

 

[equationgirl]

Yes, and contrary to what I posted earlier, it seems that because it falls under the cross-border provisions, the 12-hr period starts when the detainee is presented at the designated police station. It'll be a long night for Mr Coulson...

Plus, the police can apply for a 12-hour extension

 

[DexterTCN]

...the irony is, this is not good news for the Scottish left. It provides further reason to believe that the never ending Sheridan saga and consequential open wound in the Scottish left will remain so for another few years yet. at best.

That's a good thing, because they showed themselves to be a nasty bunch - as reflected by what happened to their vote. And of course, the were all pro newscorp in that trial.

 

[trevhagl]

what exactly did he lie about?

he was a NOTW gaffer , so...EVERYTHING is my guess!

 

[where to]

To DexterTCN:

TS and his supporters are also part of the Scottish left.

the Scottish left - all of it - has been decimated electorally by events post 2004.

please clarify if you have any constructive point to make other than the inane sectarian angle i suspect you're coming from though.

 

[DexterTCN]

To where to:

I don't need to clarify that I thought they were all a nasty bunch, the facts at the time attest to it in my opinion.

As to accusing me of sectarianism, report my post for it or fuck off, cunt. I'm an atheist, I don't go church, don't give a fuck about celtic or rangers, I don't stay in the west of scotland.

You can live in fucking Scotland, have a fucking opinion and not be fucking sectarian, you no-brained prick.

 

[Harold Shand]

This is the company Gove was praising yesterday?

 

[where to]

To where to:

I don't need to clarify that I thought they were all a nasty bunch, the facts at the time attest to it in my opinion.

As to accusing me of sectarianism, report my post for it or fuck off, cunt. I'm an atheist, I don't go church, don't give a fuck about celtic or rangers, I don't stay in the west of scotland.

You can live in fucking Scotland, have a fucking opinion and not be fucking sectarian, you no-brained prick.

politically sectarian. lol

 

[TheHoodedClaw]

From Strathclyde Police Facebook page:

OPERATION RUBICON ENQUIRY – MAN ARRESTED

A 44 year old man has been arrested in connection with alleged perjury before the High Court. A report will be submitted to the Procurator Fiscal.

https://www.facebook.com/StrathclydePolice

The PF will now prosecute him (or not, I guess, but that's unlikely now, surely). Scottish journos and legal types on twitter are saying he has been released. Hope he's got his fare back to London...

 

[Divisive Cotton]

I've heard he has now been charged with perjury

 

[jakethesnake]

No maximum sentence for perjury in Scotland (according to BBC)...

 

[butchersapron]

Worth pointing out that in scotland being charged as Coulson has been is not the same as being prosecuted - the procurator fiscal has now to decide if this is to happen.

 

[dennisr]

I've heard he has now been charged with perjury

Which means he is accused of lies pertinent to the outcome of the earlier trial- the conviction - in which those lies were part of the case against. Which would give TS good grounds for an appeal if Coulson is prosecuted.

From the TS site:

There have been those who are still pushing the view that whether Andy Coulson committed perjury or not, that his evidence was not pertinent to the charges that Tommy was convicted of. Therefore Tommy has no grounds for appeal.

It is worth noting that the offence of perjury has a very high bar. To be charged with this offence means that the lies told under oath must be seen as being pertinent to the outcome of the case, otherwise any lies told in court would simply attract ‘contempt of court’ charges, not perjury. Given that Strathclyde Police have arrested Coulson for perjury not contempt of court, must surely mean that Tommy now has substantial grounds to appeal his conviction.

 

[Fedayn]

Which means he is accused of lies pertinent to the outcome of the earlier trial- the conviction - in which those lies were part of the case against. Which would give TS good grounds for an appeal if Coulson is prosecuted.

From the TS site:

There have been those who are still pushing the view that whether Andy Coulson committed perjury or not, that his evidence was not pertinent to the charges that Tommy was convicted of. Therefore Tommy has no grounds for appeal.

It is worth noting that the offence of perjury has a very high bar. To be charged with this offence means that the lies told under oath must be seen as being pertinent to the outcome of the case, otherwise any lies told in court would simply attract ‘contempt of court’ charges, not perjury. Given that Strathclyde Police have arrested Coulson for perjury not contempt of court, must surely mean that Tommy now has substantial grounds to appeal his conviction.

In short it depends, it's not an either or if you get me?! They are waiting on outcomes re the investigations underway and to see whether thay have a material effect on the outcome. The original defamation win is still in place but that could change dependent on cases under investigation. Also worth noting that Coulson was a defence witness in the perjury trial and whilst of course all evidence is 'pertinent' as it is all heard in the case, a defence witness perjuring him/herself does not de facto make the conviction unsafe.
Sheridan as yet has no 'extra' grounds as the PF has yet to decide whether the case is to be sent to trial (the law is different up here) and, of course, whether Coulson is actually found guilty. If Coulson is found guilty then yes that would certainly make an appeal more likely, whether it is more likely to succeed is dependent on a whole number of issues, some that will inevitably be raised during the Coulson trial. Under Scots law the case has to begin within 12 months iirc.