And next, Syria?

[Knotted]

Qaradawi is shit stirring.

Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi, an Egyptian Islamist based in Qatar, told a rally in Doha that every Sunni capable of fighting should support the rebels.
He also claimed Iran and the Lebanese Shia group Hezbollah, Mr Assad's main allies, wanted to exterminate Sunnis.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22741588

[Also notice how the BBC is relying on unconfirmed claims of "activists" for it's reports on what is going on in Qusair - a part from anything what type of "activists" do you get in the middle of a battle?}

 

[Knotted]

With the eruption in Istanbul one thing that is particularly amusing is the heralded role of Erdogan in the talks in Geneva last week.

Ex-Islamist lunatic and now pro-American lunatic Ed Husain:

On Thursday, Turkey's prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, will visit President Barack Obama in Washington. This is an ideal opportunity to throw American weight behind greater Turkish leadership in resolving the Syrian conflict -- and declare as much from the White House. The conflict is spreading fast outside of Syria, and unless regional powers such as Turkey, Israel and Saudi Arabia are empowered to act militarily, and swiftly, many more lives will be lost and the Middle East further destabilized.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/05/16/opinion/husain-syria-turkey/

 

[Poo Flakes]

The Western intelligentsia actually believe that Saudi Arabian, Israeli and Turkish involvement in a conflict involving Sunni extremists, a massive Syrian-Lebanese Shia community, and a fledgling Kurdish state will save lives? That prospect makes old fashioned Russian vs American proxy wars seem positively benign.

The situation is getting totally sick. I am not sure there is any long-term strategy any more. We seem to fighting the government we set up in Iraq, encouraging the Saudis to fund the same militant groups we are illegally attacking in Pakistan and Yemen, turning a blind eye to Israel creeping into another conflict in Lebanon and bankrolling the Turkish repression of the Kurds in Syria (at the same time as refusing them entry into the EU for repressing Kurds in Turkey).

 

[thriller]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22744286

Russia earlier blocked a UN "declaration of alarm" on Qusair.

A diplomat said Russia blocked the draft text because the UN had failed to speak out when Qusair was seized by rebels

Good point by the Russians. You can't condemn Peter and not Paul.

 

[sihhi]

With the eruption in Istanbul one thing that is particularly amusing is the heralded role of Erdogan in the talks in Geneva last week.

Ex-Islamist lunatic and now pro-American lunatic Ed Husain:

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/05/16/opinion/husain-syria-turkey/

Wow that really is something hard to take it seriously - lunacy as you say.

 

[Knotted]

Wow that really is something hard to take it seriously - lunacy as you say.

Oh Ed Husain is quite a delight when it comes to nuttiness. A little while ago he took a trip round the Gulf States and the only criticism he had of the various Royal Families (including on Bahrain) was their opposition to Bashshar Assad. He's changed his tune on the last one though.

 

[frogwoman]

unless regional powers such as Turkey, Israel and Saudi Arabia are empowered to act militarily, and swiftly, many more lives will be lost and the Middle East further destabilized

When I think of stability, I think of Turkey, Israel, and Saudi Arabia acting militarily. Yeah, coz that'll work.

 

[Casually Red]

Some ideas for helping the refugees here. Create some no fly zones around the refugee camps.



http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/may/31/intervention-strategy-syria-help-refugees

what a pile of uber imperialist wank

and you can forget about no fly zones after that stunt was pulled in libya simply as a means of western imperialism waging a war of aggression under the guise of protecting civilians from things that werent even happening . And you can also forget about them due to the fact Syria now has a greatly enhanced capability to shoot attacking aircraft out of the sky .

 

[Casually Red]

Any ideas for helping the refugees then? One and a half million at the latest count.

An absolutely off the wall idea I admit but..you could actually try not aiding, abetting, encouraging, arming and funding a massive band of international jihadists with cannibalistic tendencies and whove been caught out using chemical weapons , which would result in a lot less violence in Syria . And presumably less refugees . And since the syrian army has been steadily regaining control of large swathes of Syria theres now reports of some refugees leaving the camps and returning home . So encouraging a process were security is restored to syrian civilians seems a pretty straightforward solution .

you however have repeatedly made it clear you want a jihadist cannibal victory so it appears your concern for refugees is as deep and genuine as mekon head Hagues.

 

[Casually Red]

the syrian army are claiming to have seized a cache of chemical weapons, namely the Sarin nerve agent, from a jihadist weapons cache near Hama .

http://rt.com/news/syria-sarin-qusayr-siege-124/

Meanwhile theres been a large number of casualties in Lebanon after what appears to have been the first face to face clash on Lebanese soil between Hezbollah and the Syrian jihadists . The reports indicate the HB fighters encountered a rebel unit preparing to bombard shia districts . At least one HB fighter killed along with an estimated 14 rebels killed.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2013/06/201362124623327523.html

And the Lebanese govt are lodging a complaint at the UN following repeated Israeli air incursions, where the Israeli air force carried out repeated mock bombing exercises of shia districts and repeatedly breaking the sonic boom in their attempts to terrorise the same shia districts the rebels are launching artillery into . Total coincidence of course , as with all instances of Israeli aggression against those who support the Syrian govt .

 

[goldenecitrone]

An absolutely off the wall idea I admit but..you could actually try not aiding, abetting, encouraging, arming and funding a massive band of international jihadists with cannibalistic tendencies and whove been caught out using chemical weapons , which would result in a lot less violence in Syria . And presumably less refugees . And since the syrian army has been steadily regaining control of large swathes of Syria theres now reports of some refugees leaving the camps and returning home . So encouraging a process were security is restored to syrian civilians seems a pretty straightforward solution .

you however have repeatedly made it clear you want a jihadist cannibal victory so it appears your concern for refugees is as deep and genuine as mekon head Hagues.

Shouldn't you be on the Gezi Park thread cheering on Erdogan and his security forces.

 

[Casually Red]

Shouldn't you be on the Gezi Park thread cheering on Erdogan and his security forces.

what a bizarre statement . Erdogans staunch support for the rebels seems to be an inflammatory factor in the protests against him , reinforcing the protestors belief he intends to enforce a conservative brand of islam upon them along with his public kissing bans and alcohol restrictions. I cant imagine why youd suggest id support him . Except as an exercise in further dishonesty on your part.

 

[Casually Red]

Qaradawi is shit stirring.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22741588

[Also notice how the BBC is relying on unconfirmed claims of "activists" for it's reports on what is going on in Qusair - a part from anything what type of "activists" do you get in the middle of a battle?}

thats precisely what they did when whipping up hysteria to justify whipping up a frenzy of hysteria , and ultimately war, about Libya. Except then the BBC relied on activists in London repeating the claims of fellow activists in Libya. Which were a pile of bollocks of course .

 

[teqniq]

Patrick Cockburn has some fairly realistic analysis in this independent article:

Just who has the most to gain if the killing in Syria goes on?

 

[Casually Red]

Lebanon still getting sucked further into this . Twin assassination attempts on 2 senior Lebanese Sunni clerics who are aligned to Hezbollah . Definitely in the pattern of the deliberate targetting of sunni leaders who refuse to play the sectarian game and backed the government in Syria . Thankfully both survived but were badly injured .

 

[Fuchs66]

Lebanon still getting sucked further into this . Twin assassination attempts on 2 senior Lebanese Sunni clerics who are aligned to Hezbollah . Definitely in the pattern of the deliberate targetting of sunni leaders who refuse to play the sectarian game and backed the government in Syria . Thankfully both survived but were badly injured .

agree, add to that the Hezbollah mercenaries actually getting involved in the shooting war within Syria and you've got all the possibilities of this spreading.

 

[Casually Red]

agree, add to that the Hezbollah mercenaries actually getting involved in the shooting war within Syria and you've got all the possibilities of this spreading.

i dont agree with your definition of mercenary at all in this one . The syrian border towns and villages theyre active in are places were most people have Lebanese passports, as well as other very pressing reasons for their involvement . If Syria were to fall the spectre of outright civil war in Lebanon would be a certainty . Its motivations for getting involved there are multi faceted but the motivations definitely not mercenary .
Unlike the situation among the opposition with foreign fighters often getting paid thanks to the oil sheikhs.

 

[Knotted]

thats precisely what they did when whipping up hysteria to justify whipping up a frenzy of hysteria , and ultimately war, about Libya. Except then the BBC relied on activists in London repeating the claims of fellow activists in Libya. Which were a pile of bollocks of course .

To be fair to the BBC they seem to be implicitly and sometimes explicitly acknowledging the bias of their sources. Just today they described the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights as a "British-based pro-opposition watchdog". I don't think this is being heavily spun, at least not any more. Further the Red Cross, who are pretty damn good at being neutral, are expressing concerns about the situation in Qusair. It's difficult to get any reliable information on the latest news.

 

[Fuchs66]

i dont agree with your definition of mercenary at all in this one . The syrian border towns and villages theyre active in are places were most people have Lebanese passports, as well as other very pressing reasons for their involvement . If Syria were to fall the spectre of outright civil war in Lebanon would be a certainty . Its motivations for getting involved there are multi faceted but the motivations definitely not mercenary .
Unlike the situation among the opposition with foreign fighters often getting paid thanks to the oil sheikhs.

They are still fighting for a foreign government no matter what the situation and I class them exactly as I and you class foreign fighters with the opposition.
Just because they are fighting for the side that you seem to be supporting, doesn't mean their status is any different.

E2A Both sets of foreign fighters are pushing their own particular agendas at the cost of the Syrian people (as are many countries involved in the conflict, again on both sides).

 

[DotCommunist]

is it me or does 'no fly zone' now replace the term 'Ariel bombardment?' when convenient for spin?

 

[Fuchs66]

is it me or does 'no fly zone' now replace the term 'Ariel bombardment?' when convenient for spin?

"No Fly Zone" can mean many things and I get the feeling that the intention is to make it a flexible situation. I'd like to hope any such "zone" would be controlled by a strict mandate, not holding my breath though.

 

[elbows]

is it me or does 'no fly zone' now replace the term 'Ariel bombardment?' when convenient for spin?

Well at the very minimum 'no fly zone' = 'we fly zone' = destruction of any target which may be deemed a threat to our aircraft. This has been the case since the term was first brought into use, but I agree that if anything the meaning of the term is being further expanded these days. In Libya they certainly went well beyond attacking targets that were related to air defence.

 

[goldenecitrone]

what a bizarre statement . Erdogans staunch support for the rebels seems to be an inflammatory factor in the protests against him , reinforcing the protestors belief he intends to enforce a conservative brand of islam upon them along with his public kissing bans and alcohol restrictions. I cant imagine why youd suggest id support him . Except as an exercise in further dishonesty on your part.

Nothing bizarre about it. You're well known for supporting violent, repressive regimes. Still, not enough blood on his hands yet to get you frothing with excitement.

 

[Casually Red]

is it me or does 'no fly zone' now replace the term 'Ariel bombardment?' when convenient for spin?

thats exactly what it is now

 

[Casually Red]

Well at the very minimum 'no fly zone' = 'we fly zone' = destruction of any target which may be deemed a threat to our aircraft. This has been the case since the term was first brought into use, but I agree that if anything the meaning of the term is being further expanded these days. In Libya they certainly went well beyond attacking targets that were related to air defence.

in libya it was a green light to repeatedly attempt over 9 months to assassinate a sovereign head of state they werent at war with and who wasnt engaged in any aggression against them . Amongst other things .
Last time I checked Nuremberg defined that type of aggression as a war crime .

 

[Casually Red]

They are still fighting for a foreign government no matter what the situation and I class them exactly as I and you class foreign fighters with the opposition.
Just because they are fighting for the side that you seem to be supporting, doesn't mean their status is any different.

E2A Both sets of foreign fighters are pushing their own particular agendas at the cost of the Syrian people (as are many countries involved in the conflict, again on both sides).

theyre fighting alongside a close political and military ally . Unlike the jihadists they arent attempting to enforce a particular brand of islam on anyone . The internal stability of Lebanon as well as the ability of the Lebanese people to resist zionist aggression and invasion hinges on the survival of their military ally . The people theyre fighting against have been attempting to cleanse those border districts of all infidels, often Hezbollahs own kith and kin. They were intimidating Lebanese on both sides of the border before Hezbollah went anywhere near .
If Syria falls Lebanon implodes and the zionists invade them yet again, with the resistance facing a sectarian onslaught on one front, a zionist onslaught on the other and a much reduced capacity to be supplied with weapons to counter invasion . Thats the reality , the zionists have repeatedly invaded and have vowed to return. Thats no empty threat.
Necessity dicates Hezbollahs involvement, making it very different from the attempts by jihadi fanatics and sunni chauvinists to conquer both Lebanon and Syria.

eta, i dont seem to be supporting anyone . Ive obviously not made it clear I wholeheartedly support both Hezbollah and the Syrian armed forces in this particular conflict .

 

[Casually Red]

Nothing bizarre about it. You're well known for supporting violent, repressive regimes. Still, not enough blood on his hands yet to get you frothing with excitement.

hes one of the main backers of those cannibals youve been cheering on for almost 2 years now. And as regards blood on hands I doubt hell get as much on his hands as your own regimes.

 

[goldenecitrone]

hes one of the main backers of those cannibals youve been cheering on for almost 2 years now. And as regards blood on hands I doubt hell get as much on his hands as your own regimes.

What is it about Assad that turns you on so much?

 

[Casually Red]

What is it about Assad that turns you on so much?

I love the smell of defeat in the morning

 

[goldenecitrone]

I love the smell of defeat in the morning

Change your socks more than once a month, then.