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Afghanistan: Mission Accomplished

This footage more than the footage of the diplomats being airlifted out on chinooks should define this massive fuck up. Imagine being one of those people down there, knowing absolutely full well you're not getting on one of those planes but trying anyway. I am so fucking sad. All the coverage today has been the most heartbreaking things i've seen in a very long time. Where is our government, where the fuck is Biden?

 
His reasoning is sound. It comes from what the fuck was the US doing there in the first place and carries on with what good would happen if it stayed there. He has the balls to call it, I say fair play to that.
I thought it was Biden at his best - eloquently and unambiguously justifying a reasonable stance

The interviewer asking any detailed or nuanced or logical hypothetical question on whatever subject or angle of the war is a fairly nonsense exercise itself - when the foundation of the original sin of going there in the first place (with such fail execution, at every step, and for 20 years) was devoid of any relationship to logic or reasoning.
 
Oh yeah, the 'taliban' isn't a solid thing, its a system of systems, at least as much about guarding local power and patronage as it is about a specific policy framework.

For the moment it will probably be fairly solid, with its energy directed towards its enemies, but in time it will turn in on itself.
Corruption, ancient family and tribal feuds mixed with drug money and religion.
 
Seen a few people on Twitter claiming to be old Afghanistan hands who were downplaying the embassy evacuation by saying it had been routine for years for embassy staff to be transferred to the airport by helicopter - says it all really, the airport's apparently only 5km away straight down a road directly in front of the embassy and they weren't even confident in that journey.
 
At its most basic, 9/11 level, for 20 years it was pretty much impossible for groups to base themselves in Afghanistan and to use it as a jumping off point for attacks on other countries/societies.
What's your evidence for this claim?
You're saying the invasion, occupation, flooding with weapons, mass murdering and endless drone bombing was good for global "security "?
 
I thought it was Biden at his best - eloquently and unambiguously justifying a reasonable stance

The interviewer asking any detailed or nuanced or logical hypothetical question on whatever subject or angle of the war is a fairly nonsense exercise itself - when the foundation of the original sin of going there in the first place (with such fail execution, at every step, and for 20 years) was devoid of any relationship to logic or reasoning.
Team America: World Police
 
Darwin award contendor if he dies

'He claims he told them he was from Wales rather than say he was British in hopes they would not realise it is in the UK, and they let him go.'
 
What is the idiot-proof simplified explanation for how come the men in the nominal Afghan army didn't even try to stop this happening? Is it just that they were not at all motivated to do so? The US should have spent all their money and time training an army of women instead.
 
What is the idiot-proof simplified explanation for how come the men in the nominal Afghan army didn't even try to stop this happening? Is it just that they were not at all motivated to do so? The US should have spent all their money and time training an army of women instead.
Who would be motivated to die resisting the inevitable on behalf of the corrupt and fickle?
 
What is the idiot-proof simplified explanation for how come the men in the nominal Afghan army didn't even try to stop this happening? Is it just that they were not at all motivated to do so? The US should have spent all their money and time training an army of women instead.

They apparently weren't being paid or even fed properly.

After weeks of fighting, one cardboard box full of slimy potatoes was supposed to pass as a police unit’s daily rations. They hadn’t received anything other than spuds in various forms in several days, and their hunger and fatigue were wearing them down.

 
They apparently weren't being paid or even fed properly.



yes just read similar logistical explanations.
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yes just read similar logistical explanations.
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The level of incompetence and corruption from the Afghan government seems staggering - how did any Western country ever think that propping up a government like that had any chance of ending well?
 
The level of incompetence and corruption from the Afghan government seems staggering - how did any Western country ever think that propping up a government like that had any chance of ending well?
The lesson should have been learned following the efforts of Western nations attempting to prop up the inept and corrupt governments of South Vietnam from 1954 to 1975 and beyond. But when there are armament companies wanting to make money it’s surprising how quickly service personnel and equipment are sacrificed for profits.
 
What is the idiot-proof simplified explanation for how come the men in the nominal Afghan army didn't even try to stop this happening? Is it just that they were not at all motivated to do so? The US should have spent all their money and time training an army of women instead.

I don't know about simple, but there's a confluence of reasons/circumstances that have provided the Taliban with an adversary it could overcome.

Strong tribal/local identities and loyalties,
which are far more important than national or professional ones, corruption and theft of ammunition, food, fuel, weapons etc.. at a national, regional, province and district level, the use of the ANA as a way of syphoning money (local tribal leader is recruited into a senior role in local ANA, he then recruits 10 young lads, takes their salaries, 7 of them go home, 3 of them get paid and continue to serve - so the local ANA is 70% undermanned, and probably doesn't have any ammunition because it's been sold, or never arrived).

Huge culture of 'doing a deal' - the local tribal loyalties again, and very limited acceptance of Kabul, or any other non-local based government, having any great legitimacy.

On a tactical level, the ANA is an org used to fighting with air support - the ANA has helicopters and aircraft to do that, but they are maintained by US contractors, and as soon as Biden announced the departure they legged it as fast as their legs would carry them: they, after all, had a pretty shrewd idea of the ANA's capabilities as well as a good understanding of how quickly an ANA leader can also be a militia leader who does a deal with the Taliban to save his own skin and to preserve his clan/tribal position.

The US/NATO has been trying since about 2010 to improve the ANA's ability to function without support, but with very little success. Amusingly, RAF Cosford, the UK's Defence Aerospace Engineering School, has the unofficial, and unwanted, motto of 'Training Tomorrow's Taliban, Today'... because of its efforts in this area.
 
Young men go first because they're (rightly or wrongly) seen as having the best chance of finding work and making money. They send it back or use it to get others out. Here might also be a lot of gov workers and the like, prime targets for attack.
How does that fit with this though? (80% of internally displaced people recently fled from their homes are women)
 
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