Will you vote for independence?

[gosub]

The email or Lyddon's work? Have you read the latter? On page 19 is a very interesting observation, which gives a clue as to why Salmond wishes to keep the British pound:



And he goes on to extend this to the Euro.

But really, as I've said upthread, I really would prefer an independent Scotland to have its own currency, in which case Lyddon's objection goes away.



Sorry but I've got to disagree. He's free to express his opinions in whatever form he chooses. It's not bullying: it's going to be a secret ballot so he won't know how his employees vote.

Lyddon's work seems a little out of date now. rUK as I understand it has said it will continue to honour ALL the debt regardless, and has even subsequently issued new debts as well as creating an instrument for Scot's debt. Looked a bit seat of the pants, as was day of first subsequent gilt auction and Reuter's had put out a briefing prepare to hedge, but they avoided a potential vacuum on a risk Reuters had as of last month as about as likely as Salmond rolling a double six. So that's covered and so far gilts behaving normally. If, as we closer, yes looks more like winning, interest rates WILL rise, if only because the London property bubble will be proportionately larger part of the rUK economy. Institutions are happily buying this debt on which guarantees that Salmond doesn't have his name on the UK chequebook, even Soros has warned about a currency union. Salmond with his bluff and bluster line that he will walk away from the debt and the markets will crash, merely creates a danger for Scots that the interest payable on their personal debts (which are lower than England's) will be serviceable, his line to Holyrood coincidently on the day of the first gilt auction after the currency union crystallized was that Osbourne would but be giving everybody in Scotland £25k was mis-selling as no Scot would see a penny from the treasury and would, if it shoulder sloped find it harder to borrow in the international markets contrary to his claim in the same speech that small countries have good credit ratings- not if they walk away from debt they don't. I was worried that Scot's not being able to service their loans and mortgages could endanger Britain's banks, but the deputy of BofE has outlined that UK's banks have capital holding 1.5 the size of Scottish personal borrowing, so might bend a bit but not break.
Concetrating on Salmond (a) Cos he theortetically leads negotiations, (2) his position salts earth for credible seperation



So good other stuff in there about the EU though, but that would be a while away (probable treaty in 2019 they will want out of the way first)

 

[gosub]

I work for a co-operative that has shops on both sides of the border. We had a company progress report meeting tonight and there was some preliminary chat from the Board representatives about what happens after we vote for independence. And it was framed very much in those terms. 'After', not 'if'. I thought that was interesting.

As a matter of interest did anyone disagree, and would there be concequences?

 

[DairyQueen]

Sounds like the staff at Barrhead Travel will not be in a job for long . I doubt that has anything to do with the referendum result.

 

[DairyQueen]

Lyddon's work seems a little out of date now.

Who the fuck is Lyddon anyway? What has the SNP got to do with economic forecasting? That report is clearly utter garbage. There has been no effort to even pretend it is independent.

 

[gosub]

Sounds like the staff at Barrhead Travel will not be in a job for long . I doubt that has anything to do with the referendum result.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/business/company-news/barrhead-travel-cruising-to-200m.22280929

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...boycott-over-SNP-independence-lies-claim.html

 

[weepiper]

As a matter of interest did anyone disagree, and would there be concequences?

not at the time, we've got a thread on independence on the work forum now though and it's split about 50-50 either side with firmly entrenched views either way. No I don't think there'd have been consequences - worth pointing out that bar a manager from Manchester it was only Scottish staff at that particular meeting

 

[Sue]

The owner of Barrhead Travel (which employs 800 people across 45 branches) has been trying to influence how his (chiefly minimum wage) employees vote with thinly veiled threats to their jobs. Isn't that illegal?

View attachment 51276

And the 'I've been asked by many staff' bit. Really?

 

[Quartz]

This will kill the independence bid for sure.

 

[DexterTCN]

HMRC have separated Scots-based business from those in Eng/Wales/NI. It's never been mentioned, I don't think. It happened quietly a while back. Any business with a Scots address was moved to a new 'management unit'. The rest of the UK all have the same units.

 

[danny la rouge]

Sorry but I've got to disagree. He's free to express his opinions in whatever form he chooses. It's not bullying: it's going to be a secret ballot so he won't know how his employees vote.

He is entitled to his opinion, and to express it. But a memo to all staff is a strange way to express political opinions. It will come across as intimidating to staff members.

Had he written to the Herald, or the Record, then his staff would know his views, and wouldn't feel threatened.

 

[Quartz]

I had a good laugh at the Salmond Sterling, but such is his ego I really wouldn't put it past him to do it for real.

 

[Quartz]

Had he written to the Herald, or the Record, then his staff would know his views, and wouldn't feel threatened.

If he'd written to them, he likely would not have been published.

 

[butchersapron]

If he'd written to them, he likely would not have been published.

So what? Do you think the companies employees will now enjoy free right to reply in the same way to all other employees outlining why this buffoon is wrong?

 

[danny la rouge]

If he'd written to them, he likely would not have been published.

Since the Scottish press is Unionist and would be delighted with the letter, it would have made a front page story.

But even had it not, you must see the power imbalance between a Director emailing 800 staff with ill-informed scare stories and the member of staff on minimum wages receiving the email memo (on the work system, with company logos etc).

How would it go if the employee clicked "reply to all"?

 

[Quartz]

But even had it not, you must see the power imbalance between a Director emailing 800 staff with ill-informed scare stories

Are they ill-informed scare stories? I've yet to read the whole thing, but the detail seems reasonable, even if I disagree with some of the conclusions.

and the member of staff on minimum wages receiving the email memo (on the work system, with company logos etc).

Yes, but that doesn't make it bullying.

 

[butchersapron]

Did you like this detail Quartz? Scottish companies will not be allowed to trade in England for three years post-independence? You've managed to read the whole of the email surely?

And yes, using your power in the company to give yourself a platform from which to lie to those with less power in order to further your own agenda does equal bullying - what do you think a bully pulpit actually is?

 

[butchersapron]

I wonder, was the fact that much of the material cherry picked from the report was out of date - and the issues it highlighted already dealt with - sent around to all employees at a later date? Or any other corrections of factual inaccuracies?

 

[danny la rouge]

Are they ill-informed scare stories? I've yet to read the whole thing, but the detail seems reasonable, even if I disagree with some of the conclusions.

April 1st. Travel agent says he'd be unable to do business in a foreign country. And it isn't a joke.

 

[danny la rouge]

What's shocking in all of this is the Labour Party spokespeople (Jim Murphy et al) on my radio saying it is the people complaining who are the ones doing the intimidating. Saying it's absolutely fine for a boss to email 800 employees a political opinion (containing implied threats of lay-offs, based on nonsense) with no right of reply. Anyone wanting to reply is a bully damaging democracy.

The Labour Party.

They make me sick.

 

[geminisnake]

They've made me sick for a long time danny

 

[butchersapron]

I'm not sure it new for danny either. Why have no unions jumped on that for workplace stuff - or is it hands off stuff?

 

[Quartz]

Saying it's absolutely fine for a boss to email 800 employees a political opinion (containing implied threats of lay-offs, based on nonsense) with no right of reply.

Free speech is hard to stomach when someone says something you don't like in a way you don't like, but it must be suffered.

 

[Frankie Jack]

Where's a headdesk giff when you need one.

 

[weepiper]

I'm not sure it new for danny either. Why have no unions jumped on that for workplace stuff - or is it hands off stuff?

Doubt the employees of Barrhead Travel are unionised but even if they were it'd be USDAW who are 20% of fuck all use and pro-union anyway

 

[danny la rouge]

Free speech is hard to stomach when someone says something you don't like in a way you don't like, but it must be suffered.

I'm a free speech fundamentalist. This isn't a free speech issue, it's a power imbalance issue. Had he said something I agreed with I'd still think he was abusing his power. I'm surprised you can't see the distinction.

 

[weepiper]

My MP's been making up cybernat attacks (*gasp*):



This is the front door of his constituency office today:

just who are these mysterious Yes-supporting vandals who leave no legible trace of their political leanings in their graffitti?

As a pal of mine put it, 'Mr Murray was too busy putting himself first and stabbing his poorer constituents in Gilmerton in the back by voting for Tory benefit caps to comment.'

 

[Quartz]

How does he know it was Yes supporters?

 

[weepiper]

He doesn't. He's so familiar with his constituency after 4 years of representing us that he doesn't even recognise it as a local tag.

 

[Frankie Jack]

Wings over Scotlands take on the grafitti

http://wingsoverscotland.com/the-smear-wars/

If you do a bit of contextual Googling (say, “OE edinburgh graffiti”) you quickly come up with this Scotsman article from a few years ago:

“11 held as police wipe out graffiti

Eleven teenagers have been detained in a police operation aimed at wiping out one of the city’s most notorious graffiti ‘tags’.

The distinctive signature OE – thought to stand for Owning Edinburgh – has been spray-painted across buildings, billboards and signs across the Capital in recent months.”

Probe a little further and you’ll find this in the same paper:

“You’ll have had your graffiti say well-to-do vandals

Graffiti gangs of middle-class children are being blamed by police for disfiguring hundreds of buildings and signs across the Capital.

Police said the respectable backgrounds of many of the worst culprits was making it difficult to trace and prosecute them.

One of the two main gangs working in the city is based in Morningside and Merchiston and often uses a signature “tag” of DKM. The other, known as OE, mainly operates in Niddrie and the city centre.

The work of OE and DKM can both be seen around the city centre, with Niddrie Mains Road particularly badly hit by the OE gang. OE take their name from Own Edinburgh, a name derived from a computer game in which the objective is to decorate urban settings with as much graffiti as possible.”
​

 

[Quartz]

I'm a free speech fundamentalist. This isn't a free speech issue, it's a power imbalance issue. Had he said something I agreed with I'd still think he was abusing his power. I'm surprised you can't see the distinction.

I can see the distinction you are trying to make. I just do not think it applies here. This isn't the Britain of 250 years ago with its rotten boroughs or people being evicted for not voting the 'right way'.