who is responsible for the London attacks?
- Thread starter mears
- Start date
DrRingDing
'anti-human wanker'
wot matt sed
There are rumours about Al-Qaeda or associated groups claiming repsonsibility, but they use Al-Qaeda - an organisaiton as much myth as reality - as a convenient peg to hang any occurrence on, so treat with grave scepticism.
The IRA have been on ceasefire for several years now. As for 'anarchists,' what have you been taking?
The IRA have been on ceasefire for several years now. As for 'anarchists,' what have you been taking?
mattkidd12 said:
Islamic radicals are not responsible for their own actions? Getting rid of the Taliban And Saddam means suicide bombers?
Funny, there is western intervention in poor places like Africa and Central America but those people don't blow up trains in London and Madrid. Their religious leaders don't participate in brainwashing suicide bombers.
They are poor and many think they suffer from imperialist influences from the west.
But they don't kill western civilians.
Maybe they should start?
Donna Ferentes
jubliado
I often feel that the most important and informed analyses of major incidents take place in arguments on internet bulletin boards, within a couple of hours of the incidents, by people with next to no information about what's actually happened.
mears said:
I think the point MattKidd12 is heading towards - albeit badly - is that Islamic fundamentalism is a fairly recent thing, and, like all religious fundamentalisms, is a retreat to base in the face of real or perceived outside interference or threat.
Think about the rise of Christian fundamentalism in your part of the world and how that is partly a reaction to secularisation and a generally more liberal society - for example, how greater acceptance of homosexuals has given rise to viciously anti-gay religious groups. Much the same process has occurred in the Islamic world as well, as a reaction to western interference, imperialism and so on.
Moreover, the rise of both Christian and Islamic fundamentalisms has been aided by politcians acting for their own secular motives. The GOP mobilised the previously non-voting religious right during the 1970s and 1980s: now they have some political influence they're not scared to use it. Similarly, Islamic fundamentalists - then small and insignificant bodies - were supported by NATO countries in the hope of kicking the Soviets out of Afghanistan, and they've gone from strength to strength since then.
That's before we get into the injustices and iniquities of the global economy.
Of course western intervention isn't directly resposnible for today's London bombings, or 9/11 or the Madrid attacks. But it has been the prime mover in creating the political climate in which these things happen, and in creating circumstances that lead people to support terrorism and religious extremism.
right here we go...mears said:
you are one seriously misguided fuckwit. we said all along that your policy of regime change both in afghanistan and iraq had fuck all to do with al qeada. Bush said he'd hunt down the bin ladens yet let the family fly out on privatly chartered planes the day after september 11. Not that theres a connection between the bushes and bin laden families...
with regard to the taliban, they still roam at large in afghanistan even their leader escaped from capture. Iraqis are now suffering aswell as american and british troops all because we the public were lied to now this lie is killing us on tube trains. Just like the spanish people were killed on their trains because the weasal words of aznar support for this war on terror so bliars weasel words come to haunt the british transport system.
and you mears, even in the overwhelming evidence of the stench of innocents death here. you still parrot the weasel words of the good old imperialists who created this mess in the first place...
sit comfortably in your office never having to feel the pain of your presidents short term gains while we die for it, motherfucker.
You could check the UK forum.
From the MO it looks like a Jihadi job. Some Jihadi sites have claimed it apparently. Vaguely similar to Madrid. Well timed on G8 opening morning. Main target probably economic rather than mass casualty suggests they they are learning. FTSE in painful nose dive.
Now the question is can this cell run a sustained UK campaign like PIRA could or are they just amateurs with lousy tradecraft like the 9-11/11-9 teams?
From the MO it looks like a Jihadi job. Some Jihadi sites have claimed it apparently. Vaguely similar to Madrid. Well timed on G8 opening morning. Main target probably economic rather than mass casualty suggests they they are learning. FTSE in painful nose dive.
Now the question is can this cell run a sustained UK campaign like PIRA could or are they just amateurs with lousy tradecraft like the 9-11/11-9 teams?
Donna Ferentes
jubliado
God, three or four hours on and everybody's already an expert.oi2002 said:
Bob_the_lost
Elsewhere
AQ were there and active before Iraq, however i'm sure it's done it's fair share in increasing recruitment etc. and that it's played it's part in causing this.
I dislike the idea that we alone caused this and the terrorists are merely responding as anyone would, they chose thier targets.
I dislike the idea that we alone caused this and the terrorists are merely responding as anyone would, they chose thier targets.
mears said:
from googled so far:
al Qaeda-trained terrorists
al Qaeda-type attrocities
groups sympathetic to al-Qaeda
groups affiliated to the al-Qaeda network
groups with links to al-Qaeda
members of the al-Qaeda terrorist network
Al Qaeda-linked
The attack looks to have all the "hallmarks" of Emmanuel Goldstein's AL-CIADA terrorist group to me.
Could it be that we're being prepped for the upcoming liberation of Iranian women and the country's oil reserves?
Even if AQ exist and have a coordinated presence in London, why would they deem tube stations and buses to be their prime targets, when the city has the largest concentration of economic terrorists (stock market traders) in Western Europe? As usual, it's ordinary working class people who have suffered, which makes me wonder if the attackers were genuine or if the event has been stage-managed by the intelligence services so that Bush, Blair, Brown, Bonio, and Bob can quickly move on to the next phase of the great 21st century oil grab.
Anybody willing to hazard a guess at how long we will have to wait before the words 'Terrorist', 'Iran' and 'Al Qaeda' are uttered in the same sentance?
Even if AQ exist and have a coordinated presence in London, why would they deem tube stations and buses to be their prime targets, when the city has the largest concentration of economic terrorists (stock market traders) in Western Europe? As usual, it's ordinary working class people who have suffered, which makes me wonder if the attackers were genuine or if the event has been stage-managed by the intelligence services so that Bush, Blair, Brown, Bonio, and Bob can quickly move on to the next phase of the great 21st century oil grab.
Anybody willing to hazard a guess at how long we will have to wait before the words 'Terrorist', 'Iran' and 'Al Qaeda' are uttered in the same sentance?
Bob_the_lost
Elsewhere
The population of the UK, the same "we" that just got attacked by terrorists. Try to keep up on this one. I can say it again with shorter words and simpler sentences if i'm not making sense.bigfish said:
Adorno boy
New Member
Okay....whilst I cannot hide the fact that I've been goaded out of silence (after four years of following, though never participating in U75)...perhaps finally I may have something useful to say. I'm watching what's going on in London from Iraq, where I have seen people killed and injured; in a war that many out here have serious reservations about, but are complicit in because of the alluring nature of 'a steady job', oh, and good friends. And I appreciate this site precisely because of the 'out of the box' thing. But it's facile to accredit what's happened in London or the vast majority of what happens out here to organised social structures like imperialism, capitalism (to a lesser extent) or ethnicity. All these are just collective representations of the human spirit which, as the cliche goes, covers everyone from Gandhi to Hitler.
Whats my point? What's happened today is opportunistic, homicidal vandalism.....and that is not an expression of a man in uniform's denial. People are right when they say Al-Q is a mirage - it is, and used as a veneer by people guilty of equally unthinking vandalism. But let's not keep wringing or hands about our own complicity when we are bombed on our own trains....the 'religion' behind which the murderers veil themselves is a convenience - not a reaction to capito-christianity. These people are not Saladhin nor more noble than our own 'home grown' murdering bastards.
Without wishing to be rude...
Organised social structures have everything to do with it. How could they not - unless you seriously think that the fact that the Middle East sits on most of the world's oil is entirely irrelevant to the current situation?
Besides, the second sentence in there is considerably more facile than anything that most people have suggested on this thread. You're trying to replace a considered analysis of what has gone on with some sort of airy-fairy stuff about 'the human spirit.'
Well yes, I would agree with that.
I'm not wringing my hands: it isn't my responsibility. I didn't start the Iraq war: I campaigned against it. However, I do fear that the consequences of our leaders' actions are likely to impact on us all - indeed, that they already are doing.
People blow themslves and others up for it. Some 'convenience!' Besides, if it's not a reaction to Capito-Christianity, as you term it, how do you accoutn for the fact that it's increased many times in strength and numbers since 'capito-Christianity' started fucking about in that part of the world?
Tbh, what you've said reads like a denial of responsibility.
Just because I think that the form their religion is taking is a reaction to outswide interference, that doesn't mean I attribute any sort of nobility to them. They're sick, murdering fuckers who should be strung up. But that doesn't mean that there's nothing to be gained from trying to understand why they act as they do.
Organised social structures have everything to do with it. How could they not - unless you seriously think that the fact that the Middle East sits on most of the world's oil is entirely irrelevant to the current situation?
Besides, the second sentence in there is considerably more facile than anything that most people have suggested on this thread. You're trying to replace a considered analysis of what has gone on with some sort of airy-fairy stuff about 'the human spirit.'
Well yes, I would agree with that.
I'm not wringing my hands: it isn't my responsibility. I didn't start the Iraq war: I campaigned against it. However, I do fear that the consequences of our leaders' actions are likely to impact on us all - indeed, that they already are doing.
People blow themslves and others up for it. Some 'convenience!' Besides, if it's not a reaction to Capito-Christianity, as you term it, how do you accoutn for the fact that it's increased many times in strength and numbers since 'capito-Christianity' started fucking about in that part of the world?
Tbh, what you've said reads like a denial of responsibility.
Just because I think that the form their religion is taking is a reaction to outswide interference, that doesn't mean I attribute any sort of nobility to them. They're sick, murdering fuckers who should be strung up. But that doesn't mean that there's nothing to be gained from trying to understand why they act as they do.
Bob_the_lost
Elsewhere
We, the west, whoever you like. If i misinterpreted you i'm sorry, but even western intervention in the middle east is no excuse for this sort of act.mattkidd12 said:
Kid_Eternity
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
I think its interesting that the police say they don't know who is behind this yet the government seem to think that its Al Qaeda...
Bob_the_lost
Elsewhere
True, but the same site's been used before to make claims, not sure if they had a registered poster that went to the offline events or not for the other claims though...DrJazzz said:
Could be "quick, let's claim it!" or could be the real thing, time will tell.
kyser_soze
Hawking's Angry Eyebrow
exleper said:
TBH I think it's a combination of UK FP AND the fact the G8 Conference started today - if it were being held in Tolouse or Naples I reckon the result would have been the same that this is as much a message to the G8 generally, not just USUK...
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