Ukraine

[frogwoman]

Wait, wait, I know this one. . .

Do you want to phone a friend?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Fw wanted people to have sympathy for forces loyal to the fascist backed government. Well fuck that, they're on the same side as the murdering cunts from the Right Sector. I have no sympathy for them and never will have.

No, she expressed sympathy about the death of working-class soldiers.
It's hardly her fault you're too dim to have worked that out.

 

[Idris2002]

Do you want to phone a friend?

You need friends for that.

On a serious note - the TLDR for the present debate on this thread is that far-right/ethnonational chauvinist forces appear to be present on both sides in Ukraine, and that neither side is worthy of the support of anyone who aspires to a genuine anti-fascist position?

 

[ViolentPanda]

Using missiles, rockets, artillery, bombs etc is very relevant to whether the level of force being used is proportionate and discriminating. Ukraine has the hardware to completely flatten the anti-Maiden HQ buildings if it chose to but it obviously doesn't want to do so.

Out of interest, if someone is part of a 'force' (ie an armed combatant) then are they really a 'civilian'? If they aren't armed combatants then how are they part of a 'force'?

You obviously don't understand Jim's perfectly-comprehensible anti-fascist language, you fascist!

 

[DotCommunist]

You need friends for that.

On a serious note - the TLDR for the present debate on this thread is that far-right/ethnonational chauvinist forces appear to be present on both sides in Ukraine, and that neither side is worthy of the support of anyone who aspires to a genuine anti-fascist position?

if you don't pick a team, you are as bad as the vichy government.

 

[frogwoman]

My position is that I'm not going to take sides between two camps of nationalists in a civil war where both sides are committing atrocities. It's disgusting and nothing to do with anti fascism.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Svoboda and the right sector aren't the only ones who're lucky that didn't happen though are they? I imagine there would have been more innocent deaths than fascist ones. Do we have any evidence that Kiev have targeted the anti-maidan 'side' with helecopter gunships? In other words, do we know the choppers were there to fire on people rather than, say, surveylance or transportation? Genuine question - I have no idea.

Military copters are often used for both. Ask any resident of the more rural parts of the six counties.

 

[ViolentPanda]

They're helicopter gunships... Choppers just sounds to cute.
anyway, see the link I posted to the ukrainian defence ministry who admited "targetting".
in their next statement they talked of 30 deaths

They're Hind Mi-24s. They're multiple-role helipcopters that can be used for air assault, troop carrying or airborne artillery. They're also very handy for surveillance as they (and their counterparts in the rest of the world) generally carry advanced recording equipment, just like planes do (you may remember the US helicopter crew who shot themselves metaphorically in the foot by firing on Iraqi civilians?).

 

[ViolentPanda]

it's never happened here, so people can't imagine it.

Yup.
Belushi and I, among others, have tried to put across the diversity of peoples in Ukraine, and how that informs the social and political dynamics, but some posters don't seem to want to grasp the complexity, or perhaps they're unable to.

 

[ViolentPanda]

We also haven't got a law criminalising positive depictions of homosexuality

I bet Putin has got a massive collection of lesbo porn, too, the hypocritical cunt!

 

[ViolentPanda]

What's the bet that this anti neo nazi law will just be used to silence critics of anything putin dies in Ukraine? After all it wouldn't be the first time governments have used laws against something everyone is against like terrorism to criminalise protests and shut people up would it?

Pretty much a given that this'll be used to stifle criticism, unfortunately. Watch for more critical Russian journos dying in car accidents in the near future.

 

[frogwoman]

I bet Putin has got a massive collection of lesbo porn, too, the hypocritical cunt!

Am I imagining things or was there a rumour he liked kids? Not that I believe it (I don't) but I am sure that it was mentioned here before.

 

[ViolentPanda]

if you don't pick a team, you are as bad as the vichy government.

Petain - Putain - Putin.

It's a short step from traitor to whore to authoritarian dog-sodomiser.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Am I imagining things or was there a rumour he liked kids? Not that I believe it (I don't) but I am sure that it was mentioned here before.

IIRC, the US intelligence community floated some stuff about that when he first won the presidency, but it was all "a friend of a friend told someone at the US embassy in Moscow" kind of stuff.

 

[Idris2002]

Am I imagining things or was there a rumour he liked kids? Not that I believe it (I don't) but I am sure that it was mentioned here before.

IIRC, the US intelligence community floated some stuff about that when he first won the presidency, but it was all "a friend of a friend told someone at the US embassy in Moscow" kind of stuff.

There's footage out there of Putin at some public event on Red Square. He lifts up the t-shirt of some kid and kisses him on the bare chest. . .

 

[ViolentPanda]

Yup.
Belushi and I, among others, have tried to put across the diversity of peoples in Ukraine, and how that informs the social and political dynamics, but some posters don't seem to want to grasp the complexity, or perhaps they're unable to.

Reading some of the shite in the mainstream media (and on this thread) about Ukraine and the "sides" reminds me of the story about the Rabbi who goes to visit a friend in Belfast, and who gets into conversation with an Ulsterman who demands to know "so, are ye a Protestant Jew, or a taig Jew, Rabbi?".

 

[ViolentPanda]

There's footage out there of Putin at some public event on Red Square. He lifts up the t-shirt of some kid and kisses him on the bare chest. . .

Weird, but possibly not paedo.
He was probably trying to inconspicuously drain blood from the kid in a Gilles de Rais style, drinking it fresh from the chest!

 

[frogwoman]

IIRC, the US intelligence community floated some stuff about that when he first won the presidency, but it was all "a friend of a friend told someone at the US embassy in Moscow" kind of stuff.

Obviously completely untrue you fascist

 

[Idris2002]

Reading some of the shite in the mainstream media (and on this thread) about Ukraine and the "sides" reminds me of the story about the Rabbi who goes to visit a friend in Belfast, and who gets into conversation with an Ulsterman who demands to know "so, are ye a Protestant Jew, or a taig Jew, Rabbi?".

The only joke to come out of the Norn Iron conflict. Surely worth 3000 dead.

 

[J Ed]

Coppers defecting in Odessa:



eta: reportedly during the protest outside the policestation to release the anti gov people.

Interesting celtic cross on one of those shields.

 

[Spanky Longhorn]

I remember the local government act of 1972 when Leicestershire annexed Rutland and Nottinghamshire threatened to invade unless Rutland had a referendum.

And who could forget the notorious Oakham Peoples Republic of 74? I still think it was sponsored by Devon

 

[SpineyNorman]

I've always thought Rutland was a pointless county to be honest.

Oakham is a pointless town too. Though it became more popular among the lads I hung about with in my teenage years in Peterborough when they discovered that it was home to a fairly large residential girls only sixth form college. It was even given a rhyming slang name that I will only hint at here for the sake of decency (Oakham where you...)

 

[Idris2002]

A colleague from my Leningrad days posted this on facebook.

This is may day in St. Petersburg - looks like certain people didn't get the memo about Vladi baby's fresh new antifa stance.

 

[frogwoman]

Just been looking at the fash page again.

More celebrations:

sunny jim has gone awfully quiet

 

[frogwoman]

Let's celebrate

 

[frogwoman]

The pictures of the marches on the fascist site came from this website:

http://slavrusdotnet

Black, yellow and white fun here

 

[frogwoman]

Just normal stuff

 

[frogwoman]

seventh bullet Idris2002 can you translate what the fash have got on their placard?

 

[frogwoman]

.

 

[frogwoman]

Celebrations again