The 7/7 Report

[A Dashing Blade]

. . .
Are you actually asking for an inquiry into whether it could have been prevented or not?

But isn't that what Crevice and Forest Gate and JCdM and 10/8 are all apparently about, 'preventing another attack'?

I'll write this slowly because you obviously have reading difficulties

"could have been prevented" doesn't mean "preventing another attack"

The first statement refers to the past, the second to the future

 

[Badger Kitten]

You read the blog, honey, you should know what I have said on the subject and I am weary of repeating it again and again for you to miss the point yet again. It's all in the public domain. You're a researcher. Go do some research. I thought you liked that sort of thing.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

And his intention was what exactly? To find WMD? I think bombing another country on the basis of a lie you could pretty much guarantee the outcome.

Questioning the events of 7th July on the basis of the lack of evidence has caused distress to one survivor to my knowledge, and I've never really understood why. I claim we are on the same side if we're on the side of truth and justice.

An amazing demonstration of missing the point entirely - well done. An insanely literal-minded inability to understand the most basic of analogies puts you, I'm sure, in a category of people we should really listen to when it comes to, say, analysing political affairs.

I should really aim my sarcasm a bit lower.

 

[Badger Kitten]

I'll write this slowly because you obviously have reading difficulties

"could have been prevented" doesn't mean "preventing another attack"

The first statement refers to the past, the second to the future

Quite.

 

[Badger Kitten]

Prole claims conspiracy theories have upset only upset one survivor.

Not true...

you are a sad and pitiful person. as you readily admit you know no one involved or affected by these BOMBINGS. We are living with it every day, we were there, we know. Who the hell are you to comment? What business do you have? This is our story, our experience and our life. We have to live with it, pick up the pieces and struggle through every bloody day. people risked their lived to rescue us, people DIED. Who the fuck are you?

And for your train spotter mind, I was on the last carriage, there were emergency lights that came on in that carriage and emergency lights in the tunnel. There was no fire, it was a BOMB not a fire. Human flesh does not ignite. Put that in your bloody pipe and smoke it.

By Holly Finch, at 1/1/06 23:42

Are you an absolute freak?!?!

I was standing about three to five feet away from the bomber at Kings Cross and got the back part of my lower left leg blown away - I have been off work for six months and am still having trauma counselling.

You have no sense whatsoever - the idiocy of thinking this is a conspiracy quite simply boggles the mind. There are now nearly sixty families who have lost a family member and hundreds more, like my own, who have had to deal with the aftermath of this ATTACK - not a conspiracy, but an ATTACK - by terrorists. Are the almost daily events in Iraq a conspiracy? Are people merely pretending to be blown up? I am not an actor, I am an ordinary human who, like some many others, have now experienced terrorism first hand. You are a mindless dolt and in my opinion are no better than the radicals touting their idea of the "truth" in order to recruit suicide bombers.

By Mitchell, at 5/1/06 11:03

 

[Prole]

Prole claims conspiracy theories have upset only upset one survivor.

Not true...

disingenuous i think BK, the second comment wasn't aimed at me was it, and the first comment is untrue, I was affected by the events, as was any other person whose loved ones travel on the tubes.

I'm sorry if it upsets anyone that the issues of July 7th affect us all and not just the survivor's and relatives of the victims.

 

[Prole]

I'll write this slowly because you obviously have reading difficulties

"could have been prevented" doesn't mean "preventing another attack"

The first statement refers to the past, the second to the future

So an inquiry into whether 7th July could have been prevented? Are we talking prior knowledge, or why aren't all young Muslims being watched if they've ever shown even the slightest inclination towards a radical form of Islam?

 

[Badger Kitten]

disingenuous i think BK, the second comment wasn't aimed at me was it, and the first comment is untrue, I was affected by the events, as was any other person whose loved ones travel on the tubes.

I'm sorry if it upsets anyone that the issues of July 7th affect us all and not just the survivor's and relatives of the victims.

Questioning the events of 7th July on the basis of the lack of evidence has caused distress to one survivor to my knowledge, and I've never really understood why. I claim we are on the same side if we're on the side of truth and justice

Prole.

I have just provided you with the reaction of two survivors to conspiracy theories about 7/7.

They clearly do not think that they are ''on the same side as you'', nor do they think that conpisracy theories are '' on the side of truth and justice''.

I'm sorry if it upsets anyone...

Yes, they are clearly VERY upset...

...that the issues of July 7th affect us all

Oh, for God's sake, how low , how ignorant are you? They are not upset because they want to have sole claim to feeling emotional about an event that they were directly involved in, that almost killed them, and in Mitch's case, led to the loss of his hearing and the back half of his leg.

They are upset, Prole because the conspiracy theorist is peddling conspiracy theories ( in a thread by the way, called 'In response to Bridget Dunne, which you contribute to the comments in) and the conspiracy theories are OFFENSIVE LIES.


Jesus.

Why do you push this crap all over the internet? Why? Why?

 

[Jazzz]

Do you know what, after

a) blogging for 10 months on the subject ( go look down the sidebar for a comprehensive round up of links)

b) campaigning relentlessly for 10 months with others

c) writing features in the Mirror, Sunday Times x 3, speaking on BBC, C4, ITN, BBC World Service, CNN, Fox, ABC, Reuters, Press Association, Japanese, Chinese, South American, Norweigian, French, Italian, Spanish TV/radio/press about why an inquiry into 7/7 would be helpful, I can't be bothered to explain yet again to you why I want a 7/7 inquiry.

Go and fucking well look it up.

Or don't bother. Since you already 'think' you 'understand', why trouble yourself with evidence or research? Or, indeed, facts?

Just carry on believing what the hell you like.

There is no proof currently in the public domain that the bombs were not planted by Terry Wogan. There is no proof that the trains and bus were not full of actors and stuntmen. After all, perhaps the hospitals were in on it. Perhaps 7/7 never happened at all. Perhaps we all blacked up in the tunnels and came out covered in ketchup in order to frame the Muslims of the UK and foment race war. There is no proof I can offer you that I am not an M15 disinfo agent. There is no proof that you are not the Messiah.

Fuck's sake.

Righteous indignation is rarely far from your posts is it?

I just can't understand how can get shirty with Prole and others for demanding chips when you are demanding the full fry-up. I'm sure I could go through all your links and be none the wiser.

Oh and DO get over the MI5 disinfo agent thing - I don't give a damn when people accuse me of it.

 

[Prole]

Prole.

I have just provided you with the reaction of two survivors to conspiracy theories about 7/7.

They clearly do not think that they are ''on the same side as you'', nor do they think that conpisracy theories are '' on the side of truth and justice''.



Yes, they are clearly VERY upset...



Oh, for God's sake, how low , how ignorant are you? They are not upset because they want to have sole claim to feeling emotional about an event that they were directly involved in, that almost killed them, and in Mitch's case, led to the loss of his hearing and the back half of his leg.

They are upset, Prole because the conspiracy theorist is peddling conspiracy theories ( in a thread by the way, called 'In response to Bridget Dunne, which you contribute to the comments in) and the conspiracy theories are OFFENSIVE LIES.


Jesus.

Why do you push this crap all over the internet? Why? Why?

BK: calm down. Much of what is written that offers an alternative theory or questions the official version you would have to go and find, such as the Antagonist's blog or the Alex Cox forum, both of which you have searched out by choice. You didn't have to. You didn't have to choose to take on the conspiracy theorists on your blog. You could have chosen to ignore it, but you didn't. The internet allows many voices, many opinions, many you won't agree with neither will I. But that is the freedom we have. Your hysterical responses will not have the desired effect of keeping me quiet. I know other survivors who do question these events and do not find what I write offensive or upsetting. That's people for you, all kinds of views, political and religious beliefs, opinions etc. Accept it, I do.

 

[Loki]

BK: calm down. Much of what is written that offers an alternative theory or questions the official version you would have to go and find, such as the Antagonist's blog or the Alex Cox forum, both of which you have searched out by choice. You didn't have to. You didn't have to choose to take on the conspiracy theorists on your blog. You could have chosen to ignore it, but you didn't. The internet allows many voices, many opinions, many you won't agree with neither will I. But that is the freedom we have. Your hysterical responses will not have the desired effect of keeping me quiet. I know other survivors who do question these events and do not find what I write offensive or upsetting. That's people for you, all kinds of views, political and religious beliefs, opinions etc. Accept it, I do.

To be honest, if I had gone through what BK has and found someone like you spamming away on u75, I wouldn't be able to stop myself calling you a cunt, repeatedly.

 

[Jazzz]

Prole claims conspiracy theories have upset only upset one survivor.

Not true...

Those quotes were taken on one day, after your spat with 'the Antagonist'. You misinterpreted his 'explosions were caused by power surge' to mean 'there was no explosion' and sent your friends round in a pique of righteous indignation. What we have on that isolated event is really you and your influence. And I'll go further and say that your animosity towards CTs is picked up from the climate here on urban set by editor. Let's compare it with over the pond, and 9/11, and here's your equivalent

“At first, we widows didn’t want to be seen with conspiracy people. But they kept showing up. They cared more than those supposedly doing the investigating. If you ask me, they’re just Americans, looking for the truth, which is supposed to be our right.” Lorie Van Auken

 

[Badger Kitten]

Erm... the Antagonist came to my attention by linking to my blog, taking the original u75/BBC post and making it out that I had been in a ''power surge'', by twisting my words.

Alex Cox blog launched a 7/7 discussion with a link to my blog and this comment by The Antagonist,

Thanks Alex and commanderson for your support.

It comes just at an odd time as not one but two posts in as many days, both in a very anti-asking-questions vein, have been published by 'Rachel North', a Piccadilly Line survivor devoted to calling for a public inquiry

Thus was I introduced to the conspiracy theorists.

And I was asked to take you lot on since it was thought that it would be pretty catastrophic to have the sane, rational, clear-eyed campaign for a 7/7 inquiry linked with nutters who think it was an inside job by Mossad, the CIA, M15, lizards, Jews, etc.

I am perfectly calm, thank you I am just disgusted and repelled by your shite posted all over the net, and have never met a single survivor or bereaved person or anyone actively involved in 7/7 who is not equally distresssed or angered by your suggestion that the bombers were innocent. I do not beleive your claims . I think you are lying.

I am aware that one of your number has been bothering the father of one of the bombers, who in his grief wants to deny his son's involvement. And I am disgusted by that too.

Righteous indignation has a time and place, and your twisted bollocks deserves the full force of it.

And don't you call me ''hysterical''. Hysterical? For finding your claiming that the bombers were innocent an offensive pile of bullshit lies? Fuck's sake.

 

[laptop]

BK: calm down.

Why? BK's been defamed by conspiranoids, by your friends.

Quite apart from the other issues of the pain caused by the lies that conspiranoids spread.

You didn't have to choose to take on the conspiracy theorists on your blog.

And as I understand it BK's interaction with the conspiranoids started when she discovered their defamatory comments about her.

I am of the opinion, having read your posts, that the answer to BK's "Why?" question is this: you are suffering from relavely mild late-onset paranoid schizophrenia; and that you associate with conspiranoids because you are seeking others with whom you can construct a shared delusional system in order to convince yourself that it's the rest of the world that has a problem and thereby to put off the inevitable day when you seek treatment.

I would recomend cognitive behaviour therapy initially, and would suggest within the framework of CBT that taking up a harmlessly obsessive hobby like trainspotting would be highly beneficial.

A return to a constructive life is entirely achieveable - if you acknowledge that a change is required.

I am further of the opinion that you are telling the truth when you say you don't know what happened, but only by accident.

The style and obsessiveness of your posting makes it clear that you do believe you know what happened - see "shared delusional system" - and thus when you say you are "only asking questions" you are lying (despite being right by accident).

Do calm down, now.

 

[Prole]

To be honest, if I had gone through what BK has and found someone like you spamming away on u75, I wouldn't be able to stop myself calling you a cunt, repeatedly.

Look if this is the support BK thread then fine, as it is called the 7/7 report thread then I should be free to post up what I choose. I didn't read anything in the FAQ's that said I had to agree with BK's views.

As for calling me a cunt, it won't be the first or I suspect the last time I'm called that on u75.

i notice you still haven't posted anything relevant to the thread.

 

[Bob_the_lost]

Look if this is the support BK thread then fine, as it is called the 7/7 report thread then I should be free to post up what I choose. I didn't read anything in the FAQ's that said I had to agree with BK's views.

As for calling me a cunt, it won't be the first or I suspect the last time I'm called that on u75.

i notice you still haven't posted anything relevant to the thread.

Let's face facts, neither have you.

 

[Badger Kitten]

Those quotes were taken on one day, after your spat with 'the Antagonist'. You misinterpreted his 'explosions were caused by power surge' to mean 'there was no explosion' and sent your friends round in a pique of righteous indignation. What we have on that isolated event is really you and your influence.

The Antagonist was quite clearly saying no bombs, no explosions, just power surges, and linking to my blog, and twisting my words to support his stupid theory, a theory which also included the bus being full of actors and stuntmen. ''No bombs''. Reading that crap three weeks after I had witnessed 7/7 wasn't too great an experience. How would you like to have your words twisted and made into a lie and posted by a fantasist?

And I'll go further and say that your animosity towards CTs is picked up from the climate here on urban set by editor.

No, I hated liars and mischief makers long before I ever came to this site, and those who push bullshit by denying mass murder for a peculiar agenda are beneath my contempt. Always have been, always will be.

Do you not understand how all this denying bombs ever happened, twisting my words, linking to my blog, discussing me all over the internet and then claiming I was some kind of gatekeeping plant might just piss me off, ever so slightly? Three weeks after 26 people died feet away from me in an event he claims was caused by an electrical accident and followed by a role play exercise in which all deaths were faked ?

No?

Then I suggest you exercise your clearly fertile imagination, I was under the impression you had an unlimited ability to fantasise, if not empathise.

 

[Prole]

And I was asked to take you lot on since it was thought that it would be pretty catastrophic to have the sane, rational, clear-eyed campaign for a 7/7 inquiry linked with nutters who think it was an inside job by Mossad, the CIA, M15, lizards, Jews, etc.

Who asked you?

 

[Prole]

Let's face facts, neither have you.

Are you sure about that? It seems to me that when I'm not being forced to defend myself against the most grotesque fantasies (see laptop's for example), my posts are always about the report and the evidence or lack of it.

 

[Badger Kitten]

You are not required to support me, Prole, just support a recognisable version of sane reality. The 7/7 report is there to be discussed, however, you aren't discussing it, you are instead attempting to push a website which you run in which you espouse the theory that 7/7 was an inside job and the bombers were innocent as new born lambs. Because you know this to be hugely controversail, to put it politely, you obfuscate it with claims that nobody knows for sure. But you have in the past made it clear your real agenda, and if you came out and said '' I think the bombers were innocent'' instead of claiming you ''just wanted the Truth'', I might have more respect for you.

Quite why you think they are innocent is another matter, since you have not a single shred of evidence to indicate this other than the fact that they caught an earlier train. This having been established, perhaps you would like to furnish us all with the evidence that the 7/7 report is a lie, the bombers were innocent and the whole thing is an inside job. The onus is on you, since you are claiming that the official version is wrong, to show why.


And simply sayng, I feel it is wrong in my water isn't good enough.

It is notable that after fuck knows how many pages, you have not been able to indicate why the bombers are innocent and the official version wrong.

I urge you to attempt to do so now.

Your belief must rest on some facts, some evidence, rather than hunches and speculation and the lack of evidence to disprove your hunches.

Otherwise, simply admit you have no evidence, and are peddling a bizarre beleif system based on faith and faith alone.

 

[Jazzz]

And I was asked to take you lot on since it was thought that it would be pretty catastrophic to have the sane, rational, clear-eyed campaign for a 7/7 inquiry linked with nutters who think it was an inside job by Mossad, the CIA, M15, lizards, Jews, etc.

Leaving aside your spat with one individual I would like to take you up on this because it's doing none of us any good and maybe part of you recognises that.

Whatever the truth of 7/7, no-one calling for a public enquiry has anything to fear from others who are calling for a public enquiry. We are on the same side; that doesn't mean anyone need agree on anything.

All you need to say is 'there are indeed conspiracy theories surrounding 7/7, and another reason to have a public enquiry is that it would clear away the nonsense'.

Simple.

 

[Badger Kitten]

Who asked you?

Oh, M15, my lizard handlers, Tony Blair, and survivors and bereaved who were asking for a public inquiry.

 

[Badger Kitten]

All you need to say is 'there are indeed conspiracy theories surrounding 7/7, and another reason to have a public enquiry is that it would clear away the nonsense'.

Simple.

Christ, I have said exactly that, many times.

I said it to John Reid a month ago.

 

[Badger Kitten]

And pointed out that we are nothing to do with said conspiracists, and cannot be dismissed as such.


As evidenced by interactions such as these.

Which help to make the point that we can't be dismissed as nutters, because we have an anti-nutter policy. Makes it much harder to refuse, Do.You.See?

 

[Jazzz]

The Antagonist was quite clearly saying no bombs, no explosions, just power surges,

No - you still don't understand - power surges can be explosions, and very big ones too. He was theorising that the explosions were power surges. Not that there were 'no explosions'. Is this wilful misinterpretation?

 

[Jazzz]

Christ, I have said exactly that, many times.

I said it to John Reid a month ago.

So where's the problem? The presence of CTs is assisting your call.

 

[Badger Kitten]

If The Antagonist's observations are correct and the Number 30 bus full of stuntmen and actors was diverted as part of Peter Power's 1,000 man crisis management exercise in Central London into Tavistock Square and 'exploded' in front of the offices of Fortress GB, then we are left only with the simultaneous 'exploding' trains to explain which MetroNet and the media attributed for some time on the day to a power surge. This is a perfectly normal and rational explanation for what occurred, supports the survivor accounts perfectly and yet this story has somehow become an incredulous conspiracy that is beyond the realms of comprehension.

It is the belief of The Antagonist that the original power surge story was changed when it was recognised quite how many people had been killed by the power surge. Somewhere along the line, in the upper echelons of the corridors of power, it was decided that, the blood from another UK rail tragedy would, yet again, not be found on corporate hands.

Wilful misinterpretation on his part, yep, and that is being very polite. Industrial accident, he claims for the trains, covered up, and the bus was full of actors and nobody died.

 

[Badger Kitten]

So where's the problem? The presence of CTs is assisting your call.

CTs need to be kept at arm's length from people pursuing an inquiry for sane reasons. Their cries that it was Mossad, lizards, an inside job, whatever simply make anyone who espouses an inquiry look like a crank. Baby, bathwater.

CTs also help to foster the sense of grievance in which extremism thrives; they are part of the problem, and allow denial and paranioa and anger to flourish, create a sense of suspicion and victimhood, and frankly, are no help for those looking to stop suicide bombings and the growth of extremism, because to deal with it you have to face the fact that it happens in the first place.

 

[Badger Kitten]

Sod this, I am ill and I am going to bed.

 

[Prole]

You are not required to support me, Prole, just support a recognisable version of sane reality. The 7/7 report is there to be discussed, however, you aren't discussing it, you are instead attempting to push a website which you run in which you espouse the theory that 7/7 was an inside job and the bombers were innocent as new born lambs. Because you know this to be hugely controversail, to put it politely, you obfuscate it with claims that nobody knows for sure. But you have in the past made it clear your real agenda, and if you came out and said '' I think the bombers were innocent'' instead of claiming you ''just wanted the Truth'', I might have more respect for you.

Quite why you think they are innocent is another matter, since you have not a single shred of evidence to indicate this other than the fact that they caught an earlier train. This having been established, perhaps you would like to furnish us all with the evidence that the 7/7 report is a lie, the bombers were innocent and the whole thing is an inside job. The onus is on you, since you are claiming that the official version is wrong, to show why.


And simply sayng, I feel it is wrong in my water isn't good enough.

It is notable that after fuck knows how many pages, you have not been able to indicate why the bombers are innocent and the official version wrong.

I urge you to attempt to do so now.

Your belief must rest on some facts, some evidence, rather than hunches and speculation and the lack of evidence to disprove your hunches.

Otherwise, simply admit you have no evidence, and are peddling a bizarre beleif system based on faith and faith alone.

BK it is up to the PTB to produce the evidence to support the official version which they have to date failed to do, as you pointed out on your own blog. The lack of a forensics report is also laughable if it wasn't patently absurd.

There are 9 hypothesis on the website, none of which are proved yet.

I asked who asked you to take on the conspiraloons, the ones that were so threatening to the campaign for a public inquiry (the fact that the government has refused 3 times is another absurdity and surely suspicious). I think you need to see what the real threat here is and it certainly isn't from people like me who just seek truth and justice.

The onus most certainly isn't on people like me, how ridiculous, the onus is on the police and the government to state the facts and produce the evidence.

As for not discussing the report, just check my posts.