The 2011 Census, good or bad?

[Ranbay]

another GEM from the EDL

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=115772995166565&set=o.109490015749172

 

[Tooter]

I'm confused. So...will a US arms company that still manufactures landmines have access to my data?

why are they involved at all?

 

[DotCommunist]

I imagine they tendered a bid for the role and were awarded it because they offered quality and cheapness. This doesn't mean I like Lockheed Martin btw but the 'OMFG an arms company' stuff is beggening to grate. Quite how they could profit from abusing our data is a mystery- this isn't an island where the sale of projectile weaponry to citizens is done with any enthusiasm.

 

[Maurice Picarda]

I imagine they tendered a bid for the role and were awarded it because they offered quality and cheapness. This doesn't mean I like Lockheed Martin btw but the 'OMFG an arms company' stuff is beggening to grate. Quite how they could profit from abusing our data is a mystery- this isn't an island where the sale of projectile weaponry to citizens is done with any enthusiasm.

You're getting dangerously sensible as you age.

 

[Tooter]

Quite how they could profit from abusing our data is a mystery

profit by 150,000,000??

if they have no access to the data then why are they being paid 150 million when we are facing so many cuts?

 

[DotCommunist]

don't touch me, whig.

on a more serious note, the collection of data in order to plot the needs and requirements of a polity is in no way inherently bad. How the collected data is used and who gets short shrifted by the people who use that data is. Facebook killed my fears of a stasi style file-for-everyone because we see that the mass of info is to overwhelming to do much with except plot general trends and the inviolate nature of your personal information is undermined when you offer it up voluntarily.

Its a red herring to assume data collection is a political issue- how the data is used is just that but the collection itself is not. Not in this context

 

[DotCommunist]

profit by 150,000,000??

if they have no access to the data then why are they being paid 150 million when we are facing so many cuts?

you can't buy most of what LM sells. Why are they not having nefarious schemes on the information of a polity they cannot sell to? Because they are being well paid and because it does an arms company good to provide services to people who often have major defense contracts to award. This isn't about wether you are black, white a christian or a jedi. Your data means shit all to lockheed martin- you aren't the market.

 

[DotCommunist]

re: defense contracts I'm beginning to wonder if LM offered a price they will make a loss on in order to cosy up for when the next MOD wedge gets handed out. Now that sort of nefarious scheming seems far more likely than the people at Lockheed Martin being desperate to grasp the data of Barry, 37 from Swansea no dependents.

After all they could afford to take a loss on the contract in the knowledge that next time we need moar shiny weapons the name Lockheed Martin will be remembered as cheap and reliable.

 

[kyser_soze]

I'm confused. So...will a US arms company that still manufactures landmines have access to my data?

why are they involved at all?

Once again:

No Lockheed Martin staff (from either the US parent or UK company) will have access to any personal census data.

So no.

Why are they involved? Well, in the US LM have been involved with setting up lots of large databases containing lots of information that needs to be easily slice & diceable for the US military, in real-time. This means they have techniques and processes that are eminently suited to the collection & processing of massive volumes of data, which is what you get when you do a census. Plus they probably put in a competitive tender price.

 

[doddles]

They don't get the data from the Census either. They're collecting & collating it, and that's the end of their involvement. All the actual analysis is being carried out by the ONS. As an overseas organisation, they're not allowed to own UK census data.
From here:
http://www.ons.gov.uk/census/2011-c...ject/census-data-security-measures/index.html

On the other hand, from here:
http://www.ons.gov.uk/terms-and-conditions/index.html

We do not guarantee that the information on www.ons.gov.uk is fit for any particular purpose.

 

[kyser_soze]

It's a pretty standard 'Don't sue us if you make a decision based on our data that goes wrong.' Taken in the context of the rest of the T&Cs, it's clearly referring to use of the statistical data to be found there.

 

[doddles]

It's a pretty standard 'Don't sue us if you make a decision based on our data that goes wrong.' Taken in the context of the rest of the T&Cs, it's clearly referring to use of the statistical data to be found there.

Agreed. Though it could also serve as a pretty good get out clause should any breech of security be uncovered.

I was reading on another forum that someone had done a "trace" on the census website and it had linked back to US-based LM servers, but I have no idea how to do that and thus whether that's true or not. If it were true, then it would directly contradict what ONS is saying about data not leaving the country.

 

[kyser_soze]

That just shows there's a link between the two organisations. Were they able to demonstrate that Census data was being transferred to the US?

 

[xes]

Hands up if you trust LM and our gov to work together without arse raping us into oblivion.

*doesn't put hand up*

 

[_angel_]

I'm not sure I can even answer some of those questions properly! Not sure what to do really.

 

[DotCommunist]

Hands up if you trust LM and our gov to work together without arse raping us into oblivion.

*doesn't put hand up*

sticking it to the man, one unfilled questionnaire at a time