Side-by-side cycling

[maomao]

Go find some better ones then, if you really can't comprehend that to proceed beyond a line means to go over it.

It's ambiguous at best.

 

[platinumsage]

It's ambiguous at best.

How? It's plain English.

Do you find yourself wondering whether a train that has passed a red signal, but the rear coach remains behind the signal, has proceeded beyond the signal or not?

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

I guess this is the point we move to discussing the relative consequences of a car crossing a stop line/running a light/insert-traffic-violation-of-choice-here verses those of a bicycle doing the same, and why police tend to go after the former and ignore the latter.

 

[Pickman's model]

Go find some better ones then, if you really can't comprehend that to proceed beyond a line means to go over it.

no no, that won't do at all. you've been very clear:

It's so obvious that's what it means that they saw no need to explicitly define it in TSRGD. If you think this is wrong I refer you to all the court cases involving traffic light cameras.

but anyone who knows anything of the law will recognise that the great majority of these cases will have ended up in the magistrates court and not, therefore, have the details appear on a legal database whether free or not. so i suppose you're going to have to produce a crown court case or two if you want to summon all the court cases involving traffic light cameras to your aid.

or just be known as a billy bullshitter

 

[Spymaster]

It's ambiguous at best.

I can certainly understand why you would say that.

 

[Spymaster]

I guess this is the point we move to discussing the relative consequences of a car crossing a stop line/running a light/insert-traffic-violation-of-choice-here verses those of a bicycle doing the same, and why police tend to go after the former and ignore the latter.

And again. The typical Urban cyclist response.

Urban cycle wally: 'Cyclists hardly ever break the law'
Normal person: 'Here's a picture with all the cyclists in it breaking the law'
Urban cycle wally: 'Drivers break the law more'

 

[platinumsage]

no no, that won't do at all. you've been very clear:

but anyone who knows anything of the law will recognise that the great majority of these cases will have ended up in the magistrates court and not, therefore, have the details appear on a legal database whether free or not. so i suppose you're going to have to produce a crown court case or two if you want to summon all the court cases involving traffic light cameras to your aid.

or just be known as a billy bullshitter

Youre the one who asked for a link. When I said “I refer you to” I meant in the broadest sense. I am sure you can figure out a way to find out whether people are prosecuted for having part of their vehicle proceed beyond a stop line.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

And again. The typical Urban cyclist response.

Urban cycle wally: 'Cyclists hardly ever break the law'
Normal person: 'Here's a picture with all the cyclists in it breaking the law'
Urban cycle wally: 'Drivers break the law more'

That’s... not what I said, is it?

Mind you, even the Daily Mail agrees with that...

Cyclists break fewer rules of the road than motorists

A study by the Danish government says that only 6 per cent of cyclists they looked at broke the rules of the road while 66 per cent of motorists they observed had.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[maomao]

Urban cycle wally: 'Cyclists hardly ever break the law'

Who said this? Cyclists and motorists regularly break the law.

 

[maomao]

I don't have any lights on my bike and use empty pavements when it's safer. But I would put my lights on my bike if I had any intention of riding it in the dark and only the most casual cyclist wouldn't.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Who said this? Cyclists and motorists regularly break the law.

Yet even the newspaper that supported Hitler reports that car drivers break the law in a far greater percentage!

 

[maomao]

Yet even the newspaper that supported Hitler reports that car drivers break the law in a far greater percentage!

They ain't been following me then.

 

[Spymaster]

But I would put my lights on my bike if I had any intention of riding it in the dark and only the most casual cyclist wouldn't.

 

[maomao]

View attachment 236137

I'm not even sure what you're chinny reckoning there. I can go film myself hurtling down a pavement with no lights on my bike of you'd like.

 

[Spymaster]

 

[platinumsage]

That’s... not what I said, is it?

Mind you, even the Daily Mail agrees with that...

Cyclists break fewer rules of the road than motorists

A study by the Danish government says that only 6 per cent of cyclists they looked at broke the rules of the road while 66 per cent of motorists they observed had.

www.dailymail.co.uk

You really think Danish cyclists are in any way similar to UK ones?

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

That’s... not what I said, is it?

Mind you, even the Daily Mail agrees with that...

Cyclists break fewer rules of the road than motorists

A study by the Danish government says that only 6 per cent of cyclists they looked at broke the rules of the road while 66 per cent of motorists they observed had.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Danish cyclists all ride on the wrong side of the road, for a start.

 

[Pickman's model]

Youre the one who asked for a link. When I said “I refer you to” I meant in the broadest sense. I am sure you can figure out a way to find out whether people are prosecuted for having part of their vehicle proceed beyond a stop line.

you know nothing of the law

Because it's not people being prosecuted who you've been talking about

But those convicted. And I've yet to see anything from you beyond ill-informed bluster or lacklustre links.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

You really think Danish cyclists are in any way similar to UK ones?

Ooooh, we’re nearly there, small steps and all that.

Of course not. And the reason why that is, is because...?

 

[platinumsage]

you know nothing of the law

Because it's not people being prosecuted who you've been talking about

But those convicted. And I've yet to see anything from you beyond ill-informed bluster or lacklustre links.

I’m really not going to go out of my way to find you freely available web pages which explain what crossing a line is all about. I know what the law says, and what it means, and that drivers are prosecuted, successfully, for crossing stop lines with only part of their vehicle. You’re welcome to persist in some other view, even if it’s based on nothing other than your supposition, or desire to adopt a contrary position to mine.

 

[Spymaster]

"Oi ave not crossed the loine wiv moi boike"

"Except for teh part of moi boike that oive crossed the loine wiv"

 

[likesfish]

its surprising car drivers appear to want judge Dredd to crack down on the existence of cyclists. yey expect leniency for running red lights parking and speeding regardless of the fact.
cyclists cause an insignificant number of deaths and injuries and Cars cause the majority

 

[Pickman's model]

I’m really not going to go out of my way to find you freely available web pages which explain what crossing a line is all about. I know what the law says, and what it means, and that drivers are prosecuted, successfully, for crossing stop lines with only part of their vehicle. You’re welcome to persist in some other view, even if it’s based on nothing other than your supposition, or desire to adopt a contrary position to mine.

when you did try to find a freely available website it turned out to be a load of bollocks

you don't know what the law says (you haven't even named a relevant statute) or you wouldn't have tried to foist the aforementioned load of bollocks on me

the simple fact is that you've been asked to put up some substantiating material several times. you haven't managed to demonstrate that what you claim to be 'the law' is anything of the sort. if you're going to make these claims you should recognise how feeble, how piddling, those claims appear when all you have to support them is whiny bluster.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

May as well stick this here - In news that yet again shows the Dutch have the right idea, they have just passed legislation mandating 30kph (approx 18mph) limits as the standard default in all built up areas. Any limit higher than that has to be argued/applied for by the local authority, not the other way around

 

[platinumsage]

when you did try to find a freely available website it turned out to be a load of bollocks

you don't know what the law says (you haven't even named a relevant statute) or you wouldn't have tried to foist the aforementioned load of bollocks on me

the simple fact is that you've been asked to put up some substantiating material several times. you haven't managed to demonstrate that what you claim to be 'the law' is anything of the sort. if you're going to make these claims you should recognise how feeble, how piddling, those claims appear when all you have to support them is whiny bluster.

This post of yours is the definition of whiny bluster. Either you agree with me about the law or you disagree. Which is it?

 

[Saul Goodman]

I guess this is the point we move to discussing the relative consequences of a car crossing a stop line/running a light/insert-traffic-violation-of-choice-here verses those of a bicycle doing the same, and why police tend to go after the former and ignore the latter.

But, but but wattabout cars!

 

[Pickman's model]

This post of yours is the definition of whiny bluster. Either you agree with me about the law or you disagree. Which is it?

i simply await your demonstration that your claims have any merit. there is neither whining nor bluster in my post, just a recounting of the useless way you have attempted to prove your assertion.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

But, but but wattabout cars!

More “compare and contrast” than “what about”...

 

[Saul Goodman]

More “compare and contrast” than “what about”...

We were specifically talking about bikes, so bringing cars into it absolutely is whataboutery.

 

[Artaxerxes]

brakes

Acceptable behaviour.

Thank you sir.