Ritual slaughtering of animals stopped in Poland.

[Ponyutd]

Jews and Muslims alike took to the streets to show their opposistion to halal and kosher practices.
The government has knocked back a motion to reinstate the ritual. The cheif Rabbi has threatened to resign. So it's no longer possible to drain the life blood from animals while concious.
Good.

 

[pissflaps]

The cheif Rabbi has threatened to resign.

 

[treelover]

Can you imagine if that law was suggested here in the U.K?

 

[frogwoman]

Well why have they done it?

 

[butchersapron]

Jews and Muslims alike took to the streets to show their opposistion to halal and kosher practices.
The government has knocked back a motion to reinstate the ritual. The cheif Rabbi has threatened to resign. So it's no longer possible to drain the life blood from animals while concious.
Good.

You mean took to the streets in opposition to the banning of the practices. And that parliament knocked back the govts attempt to 'reinstate the ritual'.

 

[frogwoman]

Because I'm really not sure this is a good thing, I'm sceptical that the Polish government had the welfare of animals on its mind when it passed this legislation.

that said i'd be interested to read what the law says exactly. If it says that stunning has to be done before the animal is killed I don't have a problem with that.

 

[joustmaster]

Can you imagine if that law was suggested here in the U.K?

Most halal meat in the UK has been stunned first.

 

[butchersapron]

Well why have they done it?

Pretty convincing reasons why here.

 

[butchersapron]

Can you imagine if that law was suggested here in the U.K?

What do you think the law is here now and how do you think it compares to what is now the situation in Poland?

 

[Louis MacNeice]

The NF used to use opposition to the cruelty of kosher and halal slaughter as a hook for public meetings (as a teenage veggie & hunt sab I went to one unaware at the outset what was going on); it is probably because of this that I'm always slightly skeptical/suspicious when I hear the line being pushed...it must be my age.

Cheers - MacNeice

 

[butchersapron]

The NF used to use opposition to the cruelty of kosher and halal slaughter as a hook for public meetings (as a teenage veggie & hunt sab I went to one unaware at the outset what was going on); it is probably because of this that I'm always slightly skeptical/suspicious when I hear the line being pushed...it must be my age.

Cheers - MacNeice

Famous piece of NF 'stop ritual slaughter' graffiti at temple meads for years and years, through the 80s and most of the 90s.

 

[bi0boy]

I've got to post this again

 

[DrRingDing]

Electrical 'Stunning' is disgusting. It's just to incapacitate rather than kill the animal so the butchering can begin.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

Famous piece of NF 'stop ritual slaughter' graffiti at temple meads for years and years, through the 80s and most of the 90s.

If it was there after 92 I probably saw it though it doesn't ring any bells.

Cheers - Louis MacNeice

 

[Greebo]

Well why have they done it?

Good question.

I'd be inclined to see it as part of Poland's general trend towards making the law more in line with christian (ie Roman Catholic) doctrine, hence the tightening up of abortion laws in recent years. You might call this antisemitism and racism being allowed in by the backdoor, I couldn't possibly comment.

 

[frogwoman]

Good question.

I'd be inclined to see it as part of Poland's general trend towards making the law more in line with christian (ie Roman Catholic) doctrine, hence the tightening up of abortion laws in recent years. You might call this antisemitism and racism being allowed in by the backdoor, I couldn't possibly comment.

I thought that the party which was into all the political Catholic stuff was the one with those twins in it? And I thought they were no longer in power?

 

[Greebo]

I thought that the party which was into all the political Catholic stuff was the one with those twins in it? And I thought they were no longer in power?

Don't know - I really don't keep up with the situation over there as much as I ought to.

 

[audiotech]

I find it hard to believe that any reasonably intelligent, thinking person can hold the opinion that ritual slaughter, as practiced by Jews, is worthy of being singled out as particularly cruel to animals… I don't accept the idea that a country where you can go out and hunt for pleasure… should outlaw a form of killing that was devised thousands of years go to be humane.

Animal welfare in slaughterhouses is an oxymoron. Viewer discretion is advised.

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

Animal welfare in slaughterhouses is an oxymoron. Viewer discretion is advised.

Surely these are a minority of abusive cases though?

 

[Casually Red]

Electrical 'Stunning' is disgusting. It's just to incapacitate rather than kill the animal so the butchering can begin.

um..thats why its called stunning as opposed to death by electricity

 

[Falcon]

Pretty convincing reasons why here.

Rabbi Michael Schudrich said: "The completely untrue idea that such slaughter is cruel, or even intentionally cruel, has triumphed. This idea gained popularity in Europe in the 1930s, when Norway and Sweden banned ritual slaughter under the influence of Nazi propaganda."

Those Nazis and their pesky animal welfare propaganda. Always good to get a sand blown stone age opinion untainted by three thousand years of regrettable human moral development.

 

[DotCommunist]

do you really want to start talking about the jews again icarus? Last time your wings fell off

 

[Falcon]

do you really want to start talking about the jews again icarus? Last time your wings fell off

Do I want to point out that deliberately prolonging an animal's period of consciousness, and therefore suffering, during slaughter to appease an invisible, stone age sky god is a revolting practice that is not consistent with what modern thinking considers to be moral?

Sure I do.

Of course, I'm talking about any religion that does it, not jews, and we've established previously (your "wings fell off" refers) that you can't differentiate reliably between being anti-religious and anti-Semitic. So I confidently predict we are on the cusp of yet another urban75 ad-hominem fallacy argument. But by all means knock yourself out (to use an appropriately savage phrase) defending its practitioners.

 

[DotCommunist]

appeals to morals from a malthusian anti semite- do jog on

 

[Falcon]

appeals to morals from a malthusian anti semite- do jog on

Oh my. From prediction of ad-hominem fallacy to manifestation in 7 minutes. Must be some sort of record, even for me. But you missed fascist, capitalist, nazi, conservative, and anti-gay, in Urban75 ad-hominem bingo, so no Full House for you.

 

[DotCommunist]

Mr Logic again. Still, latin on the internet. Match point to you eh

 

[DotCommunist]

Also you have issued forth enough garbage about the jews in the past that its perfectly reasonable to question your motives here.

 

[frogwoman]

Schechita was supposed to ease suffering. That's the reason behind doing it. The animals throat is cut and the idea is that it bleeds out almost instantly.

I think that when it was started however many years ago it was it was probably preferable to other methods of slaughter like beating it to death with sticks or whatever.

These days its probably, at best, no less cruel than other forms of slaughter used in the slaughterhouse with the modern technologies that are used today.

If I was going to start practicing my religion again properly I would be vegetarian because you basically can't get kosher meat in much of the country without paying extortionate prices for it.

It is cruel and I think most people who eat this type of meat wouldn't have a problem with it being made less cruel through stunning or whatever. However I am a bit dubious about why this method is being singled out when slaughterhouses are notorious for animal rights abuses anyway.

When the animals go into a slaughterhouse, they know. it doesn't matter how they are being killed. they know.

 

[frogwoman]

Those Nazis and their pesky animal welfare propaganda.

The Nazis introduced all sorts of animal welfare measures - they banned cooking live lobsters as well iirc

They also were some of the first to prove the harmful effects of smoking

 

[DotCommunist]

Having worked in a slaughterhouse, a normal non religious prep one, I can say that the method of slaughter does not seem that much more humane. It's all horrible blood, shit, death and the smell of freshly opened guts.

never did work out why christians don't have a similar stricture-setup about animal slaughter. Its from the same source religion as islam and so forth. Yet no guidlines as to slaughter. hmm.