Prevent: How far has surveillance of muslim communities gone?

[Thimble Queen]

Yes, I saw you on the news earlier. Your reign has made you legendary.
Now can we leave the thread clear for those who want to discuss the subject?

What like you?? You've contributed fuck all except for piping up to quote me when i I challenge 39th wotsit on his ridiculous ableism.

Prevent aint an abstract subject to people like me and dial. It actually affects our lives... it's not just 'academic' to us

 

[Jurrihahay]

What like you?? You've contributed fuck all except for piping up to quote me when i I challenge 39th wotsit on his ridiculous ableism.

Prevent aint an abstract subject to people like me and dial. It actually affects our lives... it's not just 'academic' to us

Of course, of course...

 

[Thimble Queen]

Of course, of course...

Yes dear.

 

[Jurrihahay]

Yes dear.

'Prevent' is about you. Everything is about you.

 

[Thimble Queen]

'Prevent' is about you. Everything is about you.

Aww. You feeling left out?

 

[ManchesterBeth]

Aww. You feeling left out?

Seems like it.

 

[Thimble Queen]

Diddums

 

[Jurrihahay]

Aww. You feeling left out?

A bit, yeah. I wish I could feel like it was all about 'me' (who, like 'you', barely exists really.) I'm beginning, though, to feel a bit like you're flirting. Is this wise? I still think we should leave it to those who want to discuss the subject...

 

[The39thStep]

No fuckface you're talking about me and my siblings here. perhaps if you'd get off your high horse and actually talk to muslims (rather than this condescending bullshit) that would do you some good.

Not at all sure why you are calling me a cunt or indeed fuckface .If you want a discussion about the subject matter in the thread then fine but unless i have missed something then cut out the abuse.
Can you explain what you mean when you say I am talking about you and your siblings?
As for talking to muslims I do as some are my neighbours, friends and ex work mates . I even go to the local mosque a couple of times a year as I am friends with two members who are trustees. And yes that has done me some good.

 

[Athos]

Not at all sure why you are calling me a cunt or indeed fuckface .If you want a discussion about the subject matter in the thread then fine but unless i have missed something then cut out the abuse.
Can you explain what you mean when you say I am talking about you and your siblings?
As for talking to muslims I do as some are my neighbours, friends and ex work mates . I even go to the local mosque a couple of times a year as I am friends with two members who are trustees. And yes that has done me some good.

Are some of your best friends Muslims?

 

[likesfish]

UK Muslims have fucked off to syria to take part in beheadings.
Have committed mass murder in the UK and planned more attacks so its not a fantasy that this is an issue
Now theres an Arguement that prevent is the wrong stratergy

 

[Pickman's model]

UK Muslims have fucked off to syria to take part in beheadings.

what, all of them?

 

[Thimble Queen]

Not at all sure why you are calling me a cunt or indeed fuckface .If you want a discussion about the subject matter in the thread then fine but unless i have missed something then cut out the abuse.
Can you explain what you mean when you say I am talking about you and your siblings?
As for talking to muslims I do as some are my neighbours, friends and ex work mates . I even go to the local mosque a couple of times a year as I am friends with two members who are trustees. And yes that has done me some good.

What do your muslim friends think about prevent?

 

[ManchesterBeth]

Not at all sure why you are calling me a cunt or indeed fuckface .If you want a discussion about the subject matter in the thread then fine but unless i have missed something then cut out the abuse.
Can you explain what you mean when you say I am talking about you and your siblings?
As for talking to muslims I do as some are my neighbours, friends and ex work mates . I even go to the local mosque a couple of times a year as I am friends with two members who are trustees. And yes that has done me some good.

Hi, sorry for blowing up at you, it's just that the argument is generally used by islamophobes ime.

i would second Thimble Queen 's question.

The siblings comment was metaphor, I was raised in that community after all. I'm far from what a sizeable minority of muslims would consider to be practicing and I'm probably not a muslim in terms of faith.

But that still doesn't change the fact that I experience the status of being muslim every day. But you know, even if I don't believe in a literal interpretation of the quran I'm cool with that.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Nobody has been 'personally' slated. (Of course, you can choose to take more or less anything personally. After all, it is the contemporary ethos.)

Nobody claimed that anyone had been personally slated, Thimble Queen said " we should be able to have a say without getting slated for taking things too personally". Can you spot the difference, or are you as bubbleheaded as you present yourself?

 

[Jurrihahay]

Nobody claimed that anyone had been personally slated, Thimble Queen said " we should be able to have a say without getting slated for taking things too personally". Can you spot the difference, or are you as bubbleheaded as you present yourself?

I don't take your comments at all personally.

 

[ViolentPanda]

I don't take your comments at all personally.

How very adult of you, dear.

 

[Thimble Queen]

Nobody claimed that anyone had been personally slated, Thimble Queen said " we should be able to have a say without getting slated for taking things too personally". Can you spot the difference, or are you as bubbleheaded as you present yourself?

They are a fucking idiot. I wouldn't waste your breath. The sexual element they brought into the conversation last night was very very odd.

 

[Jurrihahay]

They are a fucking idiot. I wouldn't waste your breath. The sexual element they brought into the conversation last night was very very odd.

It was positively pornographic.

 

[Treacle Toes]

They are a fucking idiot. I wouldn't waste your breath. The sexual element they brought into the conversation last night was very very odd.

He was baiting you. He wouldn't have posted that if he thought you to be a man.

 

[Thimble Queen]

Since when was mental illness, taking medication or having tourettes a


He was baiting you. He wouldn't have posted that if he thought you to be a man.

That's why I didn't bother replying. Its fucking gross.

 

[Jurrihahay]

Since when was mental illness, taking medication or having tourettes a


He was baiting you. He wouldn't have posted that if he thought you to be a man.

I might have. Men can flirt with men. It was actually an appeal for said poster to stop derailing with his/her narcissism.
This is how it is now. The most throwaway comment is an excuse for somebody, somewhere, to be 'offended.'

 

[Jurrihahay]

That's why I didn't bother replying. Its fucking gross.

It's the kind of thing that, left unchallenged, might bring progress to a grinding halt. Possibly ending the world itself eventually.

 

[Pickman's model]

Men can flirt with men.

yes, darling. but nothing you've posted shows any ability in flirting with anyone - or indeed any thing.

 

[Jurrihahay]

yes, darling. but nothing you've posted shows any ability in flirting with anyone - or indeed any thing.

That's because I wasn't doing it but merely noticing it.
Nice to see the derail rolling on.

 

[The39thStep]

What do your muslim friends think about prevent?

Generally they welcome any scheme or assistance including Prevent that would safeguard their kids or others being drawn into anything like Daesh/ISIS. They think Choudray and his ilk distort Islam and give it a bad name.Several parents stopped going to one mosque because the prayers were not In English. The inman told me himself that Islamacist propaganda and agitation was not welcome and that he and others would if necessary confront any such activity. The mosques accepted Prevent money years ago to run open days so the local non muslim community could see for themselves, one runs sports classes for local kids regardless of their religion and supports local charities as well as those in Pakistan.

 

[Pickman's model]

Generally they welcome any scheme or assistance including Prevent that would safeguard their kids or others being drawn into anything like Daesh/ISIS.

how does it safeguard those being drawn into things like daesh?

 

[Thimble Queen]

Thanks The39thStep obviously parents would want to protect their children. However that wasn't quite what I was thinking about, my question should have been more specific.

Do any of them have concerns about the way prevent is applied and cases where kids and parents are threatened and hauled over the coals for ridiculous things such as drawing pictures of cucumbers.*

This doesn't seem like the best way to protect or safeguard children to me. Whem applied in a cack handed manner, anti-radicalisation strategies have the potential to further the othering of people from already marginalised and maligned communities. This is a problem. We all *know* that the stuff about the far right etc was bunged in to make it seem like muslims weren't being specifically targetTed and that clumsiness (at best) again is a problem. Speaking up while brown or black marks you out and in some very obvious cases you don't even have to be speaking up about anything some idiot just misinterprets a child's drawing and a whole family (and by extension whole communities) is under suspicion.

*this did actually happen just Google prevent cucumber

 

[ManchesterBeth]

lol i remember writing a crappy mafia shoot em up story in year 8 english class. This was around the time the counter-terrorism strategy had been made public.

They sent letters home, called parents in and everything, the amount of shit i got was not pleasant, and i did deserve to be told that fetishising violence is not fun, but i was 12 and it felt like i was being singled out for being part of a marginal group. And obviously my family were trying to accomodate to what they perceived as british values whilst talking about not selling out at the same time.

Gah. it's a mess.

 

[Thimble Queen]

A couple of questions though a lot of what you say doesn't have much to do with what they think of prevent as a strategy and is more about proving they are the right kind of Muslims... which is exactly what is wrong with prevent....

They think Choudray and his ilk distort Islam and give it a bad name.

What does that have to do with what they think of prevent? I'd say the majority of Muslims (and reasonable non-muslims) think that.

Several parents stopped going to one mosque because the prayers were not In English.

What does prayers not being in English have to do with radicalisation?

The inman told me himself that Islamacist propaganda and agitation was not welcome and that he and others would if necessary confront any such activity. The mosques accepted Prevent money years ago to run open days so the local non muslim community could see for themselves, one runs sports classes for local kids regardless of their religion and supports local charities as well as those in Pakistan.

The thing about accepting prevent money years ago is interesting. Do you think they would still accept money from prevent today considering how widely criticised it is by both muslims and non-muslims?

It's quite normal for muslim community work to open to people from a variety of faiths and none. For example the schools and hospitals funded and built by the Aga khan are open to anyone. Admission isn't dependant on religious faith.