Parents gather outside Birmingham school to protest against gay teacher

[likesfish]

[QUOTE="n
Have you ever noticed this is a funny old world without a single, all encompassing, dead simple, uncompromising and above all consistent position that's applicable in all circumstances?[/QUOTE]

Piers Morgan is always twat though
occasionally he has a point buts still a TWAT

 

[Don Troooomp]

There is so much wrong with this post that I doubt you’d understand if I tried to parse it all. But suffice it to say that you are a dangerous fool.

Try me.
I'm not too thick and I'm always open to listen to well laid out points of view.

 

[Don Troooomp]

But not to insist a whole school follows them in that.

Given 80% of the parents withdrew their kids for the protest, there goes democracy.

 

[mojo pixy]

Or, up to 80% of parents were browbeaten into withdrawing their kids, by a vocal minority who used shaming tactics to make themselves appear more important / powerful than they actually were.

 

[danny la rouge]

Sex is talking about relationships

Gay people are not “sex people”, they’re people.

If a child asks a question, the trick is to answer what’s asked, then stop talking. “Joseph has two daddies” is enough. There’s no need to go into whether they enjoy rimming and how that’s done.

Yes, the teachers was forcing kids to learn about stuff that is alien to their culture, and the parents objected.

“Alien to their culture”.

Culture is not uniform, immutable, or in any given iteration a necessity for any given group. That’s racist essentialism.

You are arguing that you can’t criticise homophobia “because it’s their culture”, and that to do so is oppression. Can I get round that by explaining that I’m an oppressed minority? It’s my culture to oppose homophobia. If you tell me not to, that’s racism. This is a mess of intersectionality top trumps. We can’t go on that way.

So, the answer is to oppose homophobia (or misogyny, or whatever), by supporting and following the lead of, for example, gay Muslims, feminist Muslim groups (or whatever).

Or, you could be a good liberal top-down multiculturalist, and decide that it is authentically Muslim to be homophobic, and knock down all criticism of homophobia within Muslim cultures, including from within those cultures.

 

[Don Troooomp]

You are arguing that you can’t criticise homophobia “because it’s their culture”, and that to do so is oppression. Can I get round that by explaining that I’m an oppressed minority? It’s my culture to oppose homophobia
........
Or, you could be a good liberal top-down multiculturalist, and decide that it is authentically Muslim to be homophobic, and knock down all criticism of homophobia within Muslim cultures, including from within those cultures.

Odd argument.
These parents objected to their kids being told about relationships at a very young age. They didn't express homophobic views (at least not in any of the reports I've read), just objected to their kids being indoctrinated with someone else's idea of relationship education.
None of them attacked the gay community, nor did they take to the streets demanding gays be stoned to death, but they did object to someone interfering in their families and, most crucially, forcing an opinion on them.
In other words, the school was wrong to allow it, and bigotry is showing its ugly head on this thread.
Here's the bit I really dislike - Many on this thread know they are so right, they're sure everyone else is wrong to the point they have no interest in the people they're attacking, or even realise they're attacking them.
Removing the right to believe in and observe a religion risks taking the world down a dangerous road where thoughts are wrong if they aren't the right thoughts.

In case you think I'm defending homophobia, I'll say this clearly and directly, homophobia is fucking crap, as is racism and all other forms of bigotry.

 

[danny la rouge]

Odd argument.
These parents objected to their kids being told about relationships at a very young age. They didn't express homophobic views (at least not in any of the reports I've read), just objected to their kids being indoctrinated with someone else's idea of relationship education.
None of them attacked the gay community, nor did they take to the streets demanding gays be stoned to death, but they did object to someone interfering in their families and, most crucially, forcing an opinion on them.
In other words, the school was wrong to allow it, and bigotry is showing its ugly head on this thread.
Here's the bit I really dislike - Many on this thread know they are so right, they're sure everyone else is wrong to the point they have no interest in the people they're attacking, or even realise they're attacking them.
Removing the right to believe in and observe a religion risks taking the world down a dangerous road where thoughts are wrong if they aren't the right thoughts.

In case you think I'm defending homophobia, I'll say this clearly and directly, homophobia is fucking crap, as is racism and all other forms of bigotry.

Utter mince.

 

[mojo pixy]

Here's the bit I really dislike - Many on this thread know they are so right, they're sure everyone else is wrong to the point they have no interest in the people they're attacking, or even realise they're attacking them.
Removing the right to believe in and observe a religion risks taking the world down a dangerous road where thoughts are wrong if they aren't the right thoughts.

Like when religious people get in charge of a place and make everyone do what they say (aka what god says)

Religion, eh? Believe what you want and keep it to your self.

 

[Serge Forward]

Utter mince.

I concur. And not worth bothering discussing further with this Troooomp idiot.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

They didn't express homophobic views (at least not in any of the reports I've read),

Either you've not read the same reports as me, or you missed the homophobia. Several of the parents were keen to stress that they had no problem with the fact that Andrew Moffat is gay. However, that wasn't actually true, because they went on to express an objection to him being openly gay at school.

I've no idea if he's married or in a long-term relationship, but let's say that he is. Maybe he talks to the kids about their holidays.

'Where did you go on your holiday, Mr Moffat?' asks one of the kids.

'Oh we went to the Lake District. My husband loves it there.'

'Your husband? But you're a man. How can a man have a husband?'

Mr Moffat explains that sometimes two men may get married or two women.

Kid goes home and tells parents about Mr Moffat and his husband. Parent gets on the phone to express outrage.

Of course, if Mr Moffat had told the kids that he and his wife had gone to the Lake District, parent would not have got on the phone. That's homophobia, right there, and of a kind that this approach to teaching is intended to counter - in order to normalise gay relationships to a point where they are no big deal. It is exactly that normalisation process that the parents object to - and as noted earlier, we must not pretend that those driving these protests do not see homosexuality as a sin against god, because they do, and that is what is at the root of this.

 

[scifisam]

Also the poster at the protest (as in physical handheld poster, not a person posting on here) that said "protect our children's innocence" is homophobic. Children don't lose their innocence by being told that some men love men and some men love women and so on. Unless you object to kids being told that love exists between people at all then there's no innocence being lost just because the relationships involved aren't hetero.

If the gay people concerned are parents of young kids - which is how it's being brought up, that some kids have parents of the same gender - the odds are they aren't having much sex anyway

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Also the poster at the protest (as in physical handheld poster, not a person posting on here) that said "protect our children's innocence" is homophobic. Children don't lose their innocence by being told that some men love men and some men love women and so on. Unless you object to kids being told that love exists between people at all then there's no innocence being lost just because the relationships involved aren't hetero.

If the gay people concerned are parents of young kids - which is how it's being brought up, that some kids have parents of the same gender - the odds are they aren't having much sex anyway

It very specifically isn't sex education. Those saying that it is are just factually wrong about that. As the saying goes, we're entitled to our own opinions, but not to our own facts.

 

[likesfish]

In their world people might be told that gay people exsist once they reach a reasonable age say 21 but only the filthy kaffir need to know .

 

[Treacle Toes]

In their world people might be told that gay people exsist once they reach a reasonable age say 21 but only the filthy kaffir need to know .

Can you stop using racist terminology. I don't give a flying fuck what point you are trying to make. You are failing.

 

[8ball]

In their world people might be told that gay people exsist once they reach a reasonable age say 21 but only the filthy kaffir need to know .

Are you thinking of that word for "infidel"?

Because I think you may have gone a bit wrong.

 

[likesfish]

Whatever not my sky fairy don't really care, but the sort of people who complain are the sort to object at any age to anything remotely mentioning sex including the hpv vaccine.

Islam isn't a race its a relegion although the price for walking away is excessive.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Whatever not my sky fairy don't really care, but the sort of people who complain are the sort to object at any age to anything remotely mentioning sex including the hpv vaccine.

Islam isn't a race its a relegion although the price for walking away is excessive.

What the hell are you talking about?

Do you know what Kaffir means and how it is used? It's nothing to do with religion and everything to do with race.

It is very much your problem if you think you can post shit like that.

Cunt.

 

[8ball]

What the hell are you talking about?

Do you know what Kaffir means and how it is used?

It is very much your problem if you think you can post shit like that.

Cunt.

I was trying to gentle with him there, but yeah, I think likesfish was aiming for the Arabic "kafir", then being a bit too puffed-up to think about the responses that were coming back.

 

[likesfish]

My mistake meant Kafir insulting term fir infidel not the racist one

 

[SpineyNorman]

Whatever not my sky fairy don't really care, but the sort of people who complain are the sort to object at any age to anything remotely mentioning sex including the hpv vaccine.

Islam isn't a race its a relegion although the price for walking away is excessive.

You're the mirror image of Don Troooomp.

 

[scifisam]

What the hell are you talking about?

Do you know what Kaffir means and how it is used? It's nothing to do with religion and everything to do with race.

It is very much your problem if you think you can post shit like that.

Cunt.

TBF on Likesfish he posts up lots of non-discriminatory stuff too (he has in this thread, for example, not just about gay people either - he's used words like "fundies," and not made it sound like he thinks all Muslims are fundies). Kaffir's a dodgy as fuck word but I'd be more inclined to put it down to a mistake than intentional bigotry. So it's a teachable moment, really, IYSWIM

 

[spanglechick]

Odd argument.
These parents objected to their kids being told about relationships at a very young age. They didn't express homophobic views (at least not in any of the reports I've read), just objected to their kids being indoctrinated with someone else's idea of relationship education.
None of them attacked the gay community, nor did they take to the streets demanding gays be stoned to death, but they did object to someone interfering in their families and, most crucially, forcing an opinion on them.
In other words, the school was wrong to allow it, and bigotry is showing its ugly head on this thread.
Here's the bit I really dislike - Many on this thread know they are so right, they're sure everyone else is wrong to the point they have no interest in the people they're attacking, or even realise they're attacking them.
Removing the right to believe in and observe a religion risks taking the world down a dangerous road where thoughts are wrong if they aren't the right thoughts.

In case you think I'm defending homophobia, I'll say this clearly and directly, homophobia is fucking crap, as is racism and all other forms of bigotry.

If, for religious reasons, 90% of parents wanted a school to stop teaching evolution, would that be ok with you?

What about if part of young children’s relationships education told them that mixed race relationships were normal and healthy, but a bunch of parents objected to that on cultural grounds?

 

[8ball]

If, for religious reasons, 90% of parents wanted a school to stop teaching evolution, would that be ok with you?

Schools barely teach evolution anyway tbf, but then these squabbles always seem to be over relatively miniscule bits of the curriculum.

 

[SpineyNorman]

If, for religious reasons, 90% of parents wanted a school to stop teaching evolution, would that be ok with you?

I made the same point and he basically accused me of wanting to put creationists in concentration camps, he's essentially already said he's fine with that.

 

[SpineyNorman]

What if these parents were complaining about kids being taught evolution in science and insisted they taught creationism instead?

Wouldn't surprise me at all if that was the next step.

What is these parents insisted on a magical figure that created and controls the world? - OMG - STOP THEM!
Ban religion, ban thoughts that don't conform to yours, ban reading, ban .......

Quite remarkable.

 

[planetgeli]

To reiterate.

Kafir - Arabic for infidel.

Kaffir - racist term for black South African.

I know likesfish got it wrong unintentionally. I wonder if his critics even know the difference.

 

[Treacle Toes]

To reiterate.

Kafir - Arabic for infidel.

Kaffir - racist term for black South African.

I know likesfish got it wrong unintentionally. I wonder if his critics even know the difference.

Wonder away.

Kafir is the root of Kaffir...wonder if you even know that.

If someone wants to say infidel, it's probably better that they do.

It's not solely used to describe Black South Africans either...Whilst it festered there, the usage has spread. I've been called it myself here in England more than once in my life.

 

[mojo pixy]

Forget it, I hate the word

 

[planetgeli]

Wonder away.

Kafir is the root of Kaffir...wonder if you even know that.

Yep, I did. But I think you were too busy trying to make a “you’re racist” point to likesfish than anything about etymology weren’t you.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Yep, I did. But I think you were too busy trying to make a “you’re racist” point to likesfish than anything about etymology weren’t you.

Yeah of course you did. That's why you waded in trying to draw definitive lines between the two spellings as if there's no relationship and insisted that it's only used to describe Black South Africans. You were wrong on both counts.

I have a problem with racist terminology. I couldn't care less what you think.