Northern Irish rape victim, 12, forced to travel to England under police escort for abortion

[likesfish]

Let's give it back to Eire. It's the fairest thing to do.

it also continues the "great" British tradition of doing the absolute most stupid solution to anything to do with Ireland. A reunited ireland by Westminster degree would be the 2nd most stupid idea the 1st being armed annexation of the republic. hey you wanted a united ireland and the troops dont have anything to do after afghan what could possibly go wrong

 

[Edie]

Fuck religion. Fuck all of it. Backwards, idiotic, shit.

I actually find it surprising that views like this aren’t just tolerated but are encouraged here. The pure arrogance of it.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

I actually find it surprising that views like this aren’t just tolerated but are encouraged here. The pure arrogance of it.

Yeah, the sheer arrogance of pointing out that a particular set of beliefs in a magical sky pixie gives an excuse for disgusting behaviour. How utterly awful.

 

[SpookyFrank]

Yeah, the sheer arrogance of pointing out that a particular set of beliefs in a magical sky pixie gives an excuse for disgusting behaviour. How utterly awful.

Religion doesn't give an excuse, the law does. Blaming jesus lets way too many living humans off the hook.

 

[likesfish]

religion for all the good some of its adherents do has done countless damage down the centuries. From the poor sods who were sacrificed for reasons, the defense of kings and empire building, slave-owning oppression of women. objecting to science and critical thinking with zero proof that any God actually exists (except for prince Phillip obviously)

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Religion doesn't give an excuse, the law does. Blaming jesus lets way too many living humans off the hook.

Religion gives the excuse for the law. A way to enforce gods will. A convinient smokescreen for people to be controlling arseholes.

 

[killer b]

There should be weekly mandatory church attendance for anyone who's critique of religion includes the phrase 'sky pixie'.

 

[dessiato]

I actually find it surprising that views like this aren’t just tolerated but are encouraged here. The pure arrogance of it.

I'm with you on this one. All you'll find now is a torrent of abuse from some.

 

[Judelo]

Religion gives the excuse for the law. A way to enforce gods will. A convinient smokescreen for people to be controlling arseholes.

And so we come round to the fact its people choosing it.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

There should be weekly mandatory church attendance for anyone who's critique of religion includes the phrase 'sky pixie'.

I’ll go with “made up shit” then.

 

[Edie]

I'm with you on this one. All you'll find now is a torrent of abuse from some.

I know.

I’ll go with “made up shit” then.

Usually by people who have a false sense of control over their lives, and just don’t understand the basic idea of redemption. Oh, and think they’re better than people obviously.

 

[killer b]

I’ll go with “made up shit” then.

with mass said in latin.

 

[eoin_k]

I've no problem with blustering about the DUP but it is worth remembering that Sinn Fein, until it changed policy in June last year, was as opposed to abortion as the DUP

Whatever their policy in the north before the referendum result in the south, describing Sinn Fein as being 'as opposed to abortion as the DUP' seems like a bit of an exageration.

Back in 1985 a Sinn Fein Ard-Fheis (National Conference) passed a motion adopting a pro-choice policy. You can see some of the backlash within the party at the next year's Ard-Fheis here from page 45 onwards, although there's also a motion from a Cumann (branch) from Derry trying to maintain a pro-choice line. While this might not do much for the party's feminist credentials, the extent to which the issue was being contested within the party was well ahead of other major political parties either side of the border.

Sinn Fein's position on women's reproductive rights has historically reflected the social conservatism prevalent in Irish society, north and south, in combination with other tendencies with an more progressive attitude to women's rights at least nominally, even if they were prepared to put these's issues on the back burner indeffinitely.

Edited to add:

This article also includes a good critical overview of some of the tensions within Sinn Fein's position on reporductive rights.

 

[Judelo]

the basic idea of redemption

Yes

We have to question the whole 'rules' thing, and the command on followers to 'commit to' and 'worship' a g(G)od figure, though.

So, religion. (And (some of) those who (claim to) choose it.)

 

[SpookyFrank]

There should be weekly mandatory church attendance for anyone who's critique of religion includes the phrase 'sky pixie'.

Nice arbitrary dogma. You'd make a great priest.

 

[likesfish]

There should be weekly mandatory church attendance for anyone who's critique of religion includes the phrase 'sky pixie'.

why what else is an angel its a mythical flying creature aka sky pixie.?
the whole thing Christianity Islam Hinduism and the rest are full of utter bullshit Islam's claim to Jerusalem is mo may have landed on it via magic flying horse or just dreamed the whole thing

 

[killer b]

Nice arbitrary dogma. You'd make a great priest.

I'm from a catholic family, it's an option we've all considered.

 

[killer b]

why what else is an angel its a mythical flying creature aka sky pixie.?
the whole thing Christianity Islam Hinduism and the rest are full of utter bullshit Islam's claim to Jerusalem is mo may have landed on it via magic flying horse or just dreamed the whole thing

10 hail marys please.

 

[tim]

Yeah, the sheer arrogance of pointing out that a particular set of beliefs in a magical sky pixie gives an excuse for disgusting behaviour. How utterly awful.

I suppose it

 

[SpookyFrank]

Yeah, the sheer arrogance of pointing out that a particular set of beliefs in a magical sky pixie gives an excuse for disgusting behaviour. How utterly awful.

Atheist famously never find any reasons to engage in shitty behaviour of course.

 

[likesfish]

they just don't have a supernatural buddy as an excuse to engage into shitty behavior.

 

[SpackleFrog]

Yeah, the sheer arrogance of pointing out that a particular set of beliefs in a magical sky pixie gives an excuse for disgusting behaviour. How utterly awful.

There's religion in the rest of Britain, and free access to abortion for all as well.

It's not religion that is to blame for the fact women are denied reproductive rights in the North. It's the result of centuries of colonialism, imperialism, sectarianism and patriarchy. You're distracting from the problem, probably because while you think you have some magical sky pixie type insight into the situation, you are in fact just being a tool.

 

[eoin_k]

Its easy to roll your eyes at the thick paddies—green or orange they all look the same from a distance with their primitive belief in sky pixies and the barbaric way they treat their women folk. Yet, there is generally a risk of misrepresenting the situation in the north of Ireland primarily in terms of religion and that might be relevant in this case, too.

Sure, the sectarian divide runs along religious lines, but nobody on either side engaged in holy war. Likewise, attitudes towards women’s reproductive rights are clearly bound up with how religious ideology and institutions function and exercise power in such a context, while plenty of the faithful manage to separate matters of conscience from public policy, or just plain disagree with aspects of church doctrine.

Without wanting to let the church(es) off the hook, simply pinning this all on religion obscures how such an anomalous situation came about in a particularly deprived and neglected, not to say abused, corner of what remains the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland according to most maps.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Also, let's not forget the RoI only voted last year to reform the abortion laws, south of the border.

 

[Judelo]

Tbh I'd always thought of the Irish anti abortion thing as being specifically catholic, so this is a surprising (to me) anomaly, though understandable in context (i.e. ROI only changing last year).

 

[eoin_k]

Also, let's not forget the RoI only voted last year to reform the abortion laws, south of the border.

You think Big Ian might have embraced "Rome Rule" if confronted by the prospect of progressive abortion legislation?

 

[SpackleFrog]

You think Big Ian might have embraced "Rome Rule" if confronted by the prospect of progressive abortion legislation?

NEVER

 

[SpackleFrog]

Sorry.

 

[8ball]

why what else is an angel its a mythical flying creature aka sky pixie.?
the whole thing Christianity Islam Hinduism and the rest are full of utter bullshit Islam's claim to Jerusalem is mo may have landed on it via magic flying horse or just dreamed the whole thing

You don't see much mention of the flying magic horse, so kudos for that.

The magic flying horse has declined to comment on this particular case.

 

[tim]

Whatever their policy in the north before the referendum result in the south, describing Sinn Fein as being 'as opposed to abortion as the DUP' seems like a bit of an exageration.

Back in 1985 a Sinn Fein Ard-Fheis (National Conference) passed a motion adopting a pro-choice policy. You can see some of the backlash within the party at the next year's Ard-Fheis here from page 45 onwards, although there's also a motion from a Cumann (branch) from Derry trying to maintain a pro-choice line. While this might not do much for the party's feminist credentials, the extent to which the issue was being contested within the party was well ahead of other major political parties either side of the border.

Sinn Fein's position on women's reproductive rights has historically reflected the social conservatism prevalent in Irish society, north and south, in combination with other tendencies with an more progressive attitude to women's rights at least nominally, even if they were prepared to put these's issues on the back burner indeffinitely.

Edited to add:

This article also includes a good critical overview of some of the tensions within Sinn Fein's position on reporductive rights.

My comments were based on this.

Sinn Féin delegates have voted to change the party's position on abortion at a conference in Belfast.

Members comprehensively backed a leadership motion stating that women should have access to abortions within "a limited gestational period".

The party can now support a law due to be brought before the Irish parliament, which is expected to allow abortions within the first 12 weeks of pregnancy.
...
Previously Sinn Féin had backed making terminations available in circumstances like fatal foetal abnormality, rape or sexual abuse.
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