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Noncey or Sexually Inappropriate Music

JuanTwoThree said:
There was a Leslie Thomas novel where the 'hero' spied on under-age girls through a peep-hole and had sex with them while their sports teacher. Published 1970. It's difficult to look back and find any justification for this or for some of the songs in this thread. The French say 'autres temps, autres moeurs' but it's just not good enough. Really, with permissiveness (good thing) a certain amount of skeeziness slipped though the net (bad thing) and got away with it.
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So before 1963 it was a different time when the French adage applied?
 
JuanTwoThree said:
I have no idea what you mean. It's a very old saying 'Alia (sunt) tempora, alii mores'.
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As far as I can make out what you're saying, things were very different in the past but your French adage only applies from permissiveness - hence my reference to larkin's sexual intercourse began in 1963. God knows what you'd have made of the sexual licence of the weimar republic, blown a gasket probably
 
JuanTwoThree said:
There was a Leslie Thomas novel where the 'hero' spied on under-age girls through a peep-hole and had sex with them while their sports teacher. Published 1970. It's difficult to look back and find any justification for this or for some of the songs in this thread. The French say 'autres temps, autres moeurs' but it's just not good enough. Really, with permissiveness (good thing) a certain amount of skeeziness slipped though the net (bad thing) and got away with it.
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I found this book in a charity shop last year - I didn't buy it, but I did photo the back cover. Gross.

44638287_10156812116180984_5956296255666651136_n.jpg
 
Saul Goodman said:
The song alone is harmless but when coupled with the video, it's... disturbing.

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Reno said:
The idea was that the little girl is the illegitimate child of his wife (who tries to win back his affection) and the black slave in the background. He addresses the child as the unwanted result of the affair, not as a seductress. It’s a crap video and everybody was probably high on coke when they shot it but the intention wasn’t to suggest noncery. It would have been more clear had he addressed the performer playing his wife but the kid was cute, so they made her the focus.
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Not that it detracts at all from the implied issues of the video, but is that the video most associated with the song? It isn't the one I remember, which is this
 
dessiato said:
Not that it detracts at all from the implied issues of the video, but is that the video most associated with the song? It isn't the one I remember, which is this
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This was the promo they did for the re-release of the single in the early 90s.
 
littlebabyjesus said:
Just wait until you actually hear it. Neatly pulls together the two rs of this thread: both rapey and racist.
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There's been some very weird shit going on with music censorship over the years depending on who does it, I guess. Sarstedt's Where Do You Go To My Lovely originally had the line "your body is firm and inviting" removed for BBC airplay despite the fact that the song also makes clear that the subject is "aged between 20 and 30". Patrick McNee however, got a complete pass on "sexy little schoolgirls" a couple of years earlier.
 
Spymaster said:
There's been some very weird shit going on with music censorship over the years depending on who does it, I guess. Sarstedt's Where Do You Go To My Lovely originally had the line "your body is firm and inviting" removed for BBC airplay despite the fact that the song also makes clear that the subject is "aged between 20 and 30". Patrick McNee however, got a complete pass on "sexy little schoolgirls" a couple of years earlier.
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a very active and peculiar sex life apparently
upload_2019-2-7_9-30-42.png
Patrick Macnee was drug-taking lothario expelled from Eton for peddling porn | Daily Mail Online
 
Pickman's model said:
what's utterly dishonest is linking the royalties dispute to other behaviour within the band on the basis of er no evidence, especially when the result of the lawsuit was to find inter alia that songwriting credits should be widened to the whole band, making me a bit more confident that a discussion occurred. How confident you ask? Reasonably.

E2A you're not really interested in this at all, it's an attempt to make yourself feel better when shit's not going so well
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Not sure what you think isn't going well for me but I've been listening to the Dead Kennedys since I was seven and 'it's ok they had a black drummer' is a shit excuse particularly considering Boucher's attempt to appropriate musical rights from the rest of the band including said drummer.
 
maomao said:
Not sure what you think isn't going well for me but I've been listening to the Dead Kennedys since I was seven and 'it's ok they had a black drummer' is a shit excuse particularly considering Boucher's attempt to appropriate musical rights from the rest of the band including said drummer.
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not sure the edit really adds anything
 
Pickman's model said:
i wouldn't disagree but it's not an excuse i've made. do pay attention.
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In reply to a post saying that Dylan's song was less problematic than DK or EC's you brought DK's drummer's skin colour into it so it's difficult to imagine what you did mean if you didn't mean that.
 
maomao said:
In reply to a post saying that Dylan's song was less problematic than DK or EC's you brought DK's drummer's skin colour into it so it's difficult to imagine what you did mean if you didn't mean that.
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no it isn't. or rather, no doubt it is difficult for you to imagine. i have not said, suggested or implied that
maomao said:
'it's ok they had a black drummer'
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that's your perverse interpretation of what i said. in the light of what i've read about the royalties case i am reasonably confident that every member of the band had input into the song. so it's not that they had a black drummer so that's ok: they had a black drummer and other members of the band who had input into the song, who were ok with it, and i think because of what the song was saying. as i said in post 66,
Pickman's model said:
it's always been clear to me that that 'nigger' was what the subject of the song thought, that the entire song's against affected liberals who play ethnicky jazz but are racist wankers behind a mask. but if you've a different interpretation i'd be very interested to hear it.
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e2a: you're saying i'm arguing tokenism i'm saying all the members of the dead kennedys seem to have had input into the songs they performed.
 
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Pickman's model said:
As far as I can make out what you're saying, things were very different in the past but your French adage only applies from permissiveness - hence my reference to larkin's sexual intercourse began in 1963. God knows what you'd have made of the sexual licence of the weimar republic, blown a gasket probably
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It's a banal observation that things were different in the past so the French and Latin sayings must be used to somehow justify past behaviours. I don't think it works for Confederate slavery, Spartans leaving babies to die or indeed 1970s perviness. The only sexual licences of The Weimar I would take issue with are ones I would object to now.

Having said that I do think that the age of consent is a tricky one. Perhaps an age difference law would work.
 
Pickman's model said:
no it isn't. or rather, no doubt it is difficult for you to imagine. i have not said, suggested or implied that
that's your perverse interpretation of what i said. in the light of what i've read about the royalties case i am reasonably confident that every member of the band had input into the song. so it's not that they had a black drummer so that's ok: they had a black drummer and other members of the band who had input into the song, who were ok with it, and i think because of what the song was saying. as i said in post 66,
e2a: you're saying i'm arguing tokenism i'm saying all the members of the dead kennedys seem to have had input into the songs they performed.
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the wikipedia page on fresh fruit for rotting vegetables shows the band as collectively responsible for the song
upload_2019-2-7_11-0-35.png
citing a book about the album:
upload_2019-2-7_11-1-19.png
 
Pickman's model said:
no it isn't. or rather, no doubt it is difficult for you to imagine. i have not said, suggested or implied that
that's your perverse interpretation of what i said. in the light of what i've read about the royalties case i am reasonably confident that every member of the band had input into the song. so it's not that they had a black drummer so that's ok: they had a black drummer and other members of the band who had input into the song, who were ok with it, and i think because of what the song was saying. as i said in post 66,
e2a: you're saying i'm arguing tokenism i'm saying all the members of the dead kennedys seem to have had input into the songs they performed.
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You dont seem to have read much about the case or did Biafra/Boucher's claim that he had composed all the music despite not being able to play an instrument by singing all the riffs at the band members convince you that he was open to input on his lyrics?

And tokenism's not the word. Tbf I can't think of the right word myself but it's not tokenism.
 
maomao said:
You dont seem to have read much about the case or did Biafra/Boucher's claim that he had composed all the music despite not being able to play an instrument by singing all the riffs at the band members convince you that he was open to input on his lyrics?

And tokenism's not the word. Tbf I can't think of the right word myself but it's not tokenism.
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upload_2019-2-7_11-15-41.png
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Dead Kennedys - Wikipedia

if songwriting credits due to the entire band then are you sure they were biafra's lyrics?
 
maomao said:
The band didn't claim to have written the lyrics in court. They claimed to have been responsible for the music. If they'd written the lyrics why didn't they bring that up in court
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p7/13

upload_2019-2-7_11-51-3.png

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when they say songwriting was a collaborative effort and the band worked collectively on the creation of its musical compositions i'd take that - and i'd be interested to know why you differ - that they worked together on all aspects of the song, both music and lyrics. unless you know better, of course.
 
Spymaster said:
There's been some very weird shit going on with music censorship over the years depending on who does it, I guess. Sarstedt's Where Do You Go To My Lovely originally had the line "your body is firm and inviting" removed for BBC airplay despite the fact that the song also makes clear that the subject is "aged between 20 and 30". Patrick McNee however, got a complete pass on "sexy little schoolgirls" a couple of years earlier.
Click to expand...
BBC in "Sex is bad, unless it's with underage girls" shocker.
 
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