London Student protests - Wed 8th Dec+ Thurs 9th

[Mr.Bishie]

The Lib Dem, as a political party, are over.

Next objective, bring down the Coalition

 

[stupid kid]

But I can't see the Libdems allowing the govt to fall - they'd be giving up their best chance of ending the two party system. They'd be back in the wildnerness for the rest of the century.

They've basically ensured this happens anyway.

 

[killer b]

Then gets it taken away again for being a genuine couldn't give a fuck tory yahoo. Mark Reckless MP sorry for being 'too drunk to vote'.

i like him all the more for that tbh. a shame to send him to the lime pits, but we all have to make sacrifices.

 

[claphamboy]

Clegg won't. But it ain't his choice. The MPs know they will all lose their seats because of this - they owe him no loyalty. The party has far, far more power in local councils than they do in parliament - the councillors will lose their seats too. It only takles 75 constituency parties (approx one in eight) to force a leadership election.

You seriously think the bulk of LibDems would fall on their own swords by bringing on an early election and getting themselves kicked out to save a few councillors?

They will hang in there hoping that things will get better over the next four years, most of this will be forgotten, and they'll have at least some chance of saving their sorry arses - FFS they are politicians, not people of principal.

 

[shaman75]

 

[spitfire]

Both channels have now dropped coverage of the bridge.........

Maybe not a great place to be right now.

 

[Cobbles]

Looked like some lads were gonna try to pull down the tree in trafalgur sq at one point but it didnt happen.

Why carry out that specific piece of pointless vandalism?

 

[where to]

Clare Solomon on twitter:

I'm 'not at all impressed' with the shabby response by Aaron Porter to today's fantastic demo & Shutdown London. NUS/UCU rally + glowstick vigil of 200 people= £12,000 (incl 60 paid professional security guards/stewards): ULU/LSA/London Region UCU March on Parliament of 50,000 = £600. This is just the beginning...

 

[girasol]

If this is what it's like in the middle of winter, fuck knows what it will be like in the heat of summer.

I suppose it depends if the momentum keeps up.

Lots of Ifs/buts/maybes?

When is the next big one? Maybe some of us retirees could come out of sofa retirement?

I hear there's one on Saturday for people what work

 

[rekil]

i like him all the more for that tbh. a shame to send him to the lime pits, but we all have to make sacrifices.

Reckless is the grandson of Henry McDevitt, a Fianna Fáil Teachta Dála for Donegal East in the Dáil Éireann from 1938 until 1943.

He's one of ours, the lime pits it is and that's the end of it.

 

[ymu]

You seriously think the bulk of LibDems would fall on their own swords by bringing on an early election and getting themselves kicked out to save a few councillors?

They will hang in there hoping that things will get better over the next four years, most of this will be forgotten, and they'll have at least some chance of saving their sorry arses - FFS they are politicians, not people of principal.

You appear not to have read, or at least comprehended, my post. I'll not bother repeating it.

 

[lopsidedbunny]

Intresting, I watched that on the BBC on telly at work the person who filmed that clip was a Police Constable.

I am not pulling your leg here.

------0

Reviewing the clip it appear to be a t.v. footage, you do see the police with the camera run in front of the clp. Oh hum!

 

[spitfire]

I hear there's one on Saturday for people what work

oh rly?

 

[twentythreedom]

Genuine question, where has there been anything bias in the BBC’s rolling coverage of the protests?

their reporters seemed genuinely surprised and shocked when the police made the fucking stupid horse charge

surprised? why did they bring crash helmets?

 

[teuchter]

 

[nick h.]

Clegg won't. But it ain't his choice. The MPs know they will all lose their seats because of this - they owe him no loyalty. The party has far, far more power in local councils than they do in parliament - the councillors will lose their seats too. It only takles 75 constituency parties (approx one in eight) to force a leadership election.

It's up to us to keep the pressure up. They won't get away with this, and enough careerists realising this can force the government to fall regardless of what the leadership wants.

But if you're a Lib Dem MP you've got to choose between the lesser of two evils (a) bring down the govt, be hated, and get no votes in the next election or two, and back to the two party system indefinitely, or (b) keep the coalition together, pass some sort of PR bill, be hated, get no votes for an election or two, but retain some chance of getting power again one day. Of course they'd have a tough sell on their hands if PR comes down to a simple public referendum - but perhaps the Tories will bribe them with something more winnable.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Both channels have now dropped coverage of the bridge.........

Maybe not a great place to be right now.

Still on BBC 24

 

[editor]

Some pics:

More here: http://www.urban75.org/blog/parliament-student-protest-photos/

 

[claphamboy]

You appear not to have read, or at least comprehended, my post. I'll not bother repeating it.

I comprehended what you were suggesting, you seem to think the party can change the leadership and a new leader could force their MPs to bring down the coalition, in theory with shitloads of ifs and buts that could happen.

Talking to local LibDem councillors and activists that's so unlikely that's in way off in cloud cuckoo land, as you appear to be.

FFS earlier you posted the suggestion that Coronation Street was going to loss out on ratings to the News Channels, I seriously suggest you try to get a grip on your imagination.

 

[killer b]

But if you're a Lib Dem MP you've got to choose between the lesser of two evils (a) bring down the govt, be hated, and get no votes in the next election or two, and back to the two party system indefinitely, or (b) keep the coalition together, pass some sort of PR bill, be hated, get no votes for an election or two, but retain some chance of getting power again one day. Of course they'd have a tough sell on their hands if PR comes down to a simple public referendum - but perhaps the Tories will bribe them with something more winnable.

the problem with your second scenario, nick, is that they aren't going to pass a PR bill. so either way they're fucked.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Some pics:

Poor horse

 

[lopsidedbunny]

So what happening to the protestors in the South Bank? Any News?

 

[nick h.]

the problem with your second scenario, nick, is that they aren't going to pass a PR bill. so either way they're fucked.

Why not? I thought the Tories had to deliver it to keep the coalition together. But I've been abroad all year so I don't know the details.

 

[lopsidedbunny]

Watching the BBC the protestors are still on Westminster Bridge out of sight out of mind

 

[IC3D]

Watching the BBC the protestors are still on Westminster Bridge out of sight out of mind

like peaceful protest.

 

[ymu]

But if you're a Lib Dem MP you've got to choose between the lesser of two evils (a) bring down the govt, be hated, and get no votes in the next election or two, and back to the two party system indefinitely, or (b) keep the coalition together, pass some sort of PR bill, be hated, get no votes for an election or two, but retain some chance of getting power again one day. Of course they'd have a tough sell on their hands if PR comes down to a simple public referendum - but perhaps the Tories will bribe them with something more winnable.

They'll be dead as a parliamentary party for a generation. There's no way back for them now. It comes down to whether they can salvage the local parties - ie whether the local parties decide to fight for their own political lives and screw the MPs. That's where their power base is. 4000 councillors and dozens of councils where they hold power or the balance of power.

 

[killer b]

Why not? I thought the Tories had to deliver it to keep the coalition together. But I've been abroad all year so I don't know the details.

they've got a referendum on AV (which is the weakest possible form of PR) next year, which they will almost certainly lose. there won't be another referendum this parliament, so that's their lot.

once they lose the referendum (and all their councillors get wiped out in the local elections on the same day), they may get a bit more nervous on the lib dem benches.

 

[DrRingDing]

Good pics ed.

 

[claphamboy]

surprised? why did they bring crash helmets?

Are you seriously that fucking stupid?

Err, ‘missiles’ raining down were a fairly predictable outcome no matter what else happened, hence having helmets for protection, and were occurring before the police horse charge, which the BBC reporters were clearly surprised by.

Where you watching at the time?

 

[weepiper]

they've got a referendum on AV (which is the weakest possible form of PR) next year, which they will almost certainly lose. there won't be another referendum this parliament, so that's their lot.

once they lose the referendum (and all their councillors get wiped out in the local elections on the same day), they may get a bit more nervous on the lib dem benches.

we have a Scottish Parliamentary election next year, and the Scottish Lib-Dems are absolutely HUMPED after today.