Serge Forward
Just enjoyin' my coffee.
Very few now. The general theme is to stick the boot in the unions.
Keir Starmer's time is up
- Thread starter agricola
- Start date
rekil
to menny cranks
Can someone contact him (keir starmer) on the twitter machine and get him to denounce the strike in Emmerdale and demonisation of wealth creator Kim Tate? #activism
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
The fact Starmer is the best thing we have to look forward to is somehow worse than knowing we're already ruled by Johnson IMO. Nothing evil this lot has done will be undone, because Starmer supports all of it, and we'll most likely get even more authoritarian bullshit to go with ongoing economic decline, endless privatisation and a general slide toward arbitrary depths of cruelty, cynicism and inequality.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
This is the best account yet of Starmer’s role as a Shadow Brexit Secretary and his role in blocking a serious and popular approach by Corbyn (aided by the piss weak panicking McDonnell it must be said). His description of a plan to put forward a serious programme around Brexit highluhting State Aid, investment and job as 'outrageous' is instructive. Corbyn should have sacked him (and Thornberry and the other Planet Remain dwellers):
www.newstatesman.com
Tell us who you really are, Keir Starmer
The most detailed study of the Labour leader so far charts his role in the Brexit wars and in the downfall of Corbynism.
www.newstatesman.com
Last edited:
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
the paint is peeling off the wall and revealing starmer actually shammer.This is the best account yet of Starmer’s role as a Shadow Brexit Secretary and his role in blocking a serious and popular approach by Corbyn (aided by the piss weak panicking McDonnell it must be said). His description of a plan to put forward a serious programme around Brexit highluhting State Aid, investment and job as 'outrageous' is instructive. Corbyn should have sacked him (and Thornberry and the other Planet Remain dwellers):
Tell us who you really are, Keir Starmer
The most detailed study of the Labour leader so far charts his role in the Brexit wars and in the downfall of Corbynism.
ska invita
back on the other side
yes hearing Len McCluskey interview he also said McDonnel was key in the 2nd Ref policy change...and Diane Abbott also. TBF they were "respecting conference democracy" which is where the pressure really came fromThis is the best account of Starmer’s role as a Shadow Brexit Secretary and his role in blocking a serious and popular approach by Corbyn (aided by the piss weak panicking McDonnell it must be said):
Tell us who you really are, Keir Starmer
The most detailed study of the Labour leader so far charts his role in the Brexit wars and in the downfall of Corbynism.
( i havent read the article you've just posted yet, paywall etc)
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
paywall? i saw no paywall
ska invita
back on the other side
3 free articles and then no more...i could clear my cookies or whatever but not right now
teqniq
DisMembered
That's a pretty damning article TBH, i am not surprised.This is the best account yet of Starmer’s role as a Shadow Brexit Secretary and his role in blocking a serious and popular approach by Corbyn (aided by the piss weak panicking McDonnell it must be said). His description of a plan to put forward a serious programme around Brexit highluhting State Aid, investment and job as 'outrageous' is instructive. Corbyn should have sacked him (and Thornberry and the other Planet Remain dwellers):
Tell us who you really are, Keir Starmer
The most detailed study of the Labour leader so far charts his role in the Brexit wars and in the downfall of Corbynism.
In other news Labour seem to think this will be a vote winner. Not that I am a fan of the limp-dems but really?? is this the best that Labour could come up with?
ska invita
back on the other side
they'll be accusing them of anti-Semitism next
Funky_monks
Neo-Rustic
I saw that too.
It's reasonably depressing. I honestly think that the Tories are more likely than Labour to relax drug policy, mostly because of the $$$ (mostly white) people are making in the US after cannabis decriminalisation.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
It would be ironic, if it wasn’t so infuriating, that:
1. Starmer is the author of the policy that cost Labour the ‘red wall’ and also (as we now know beyond doubt) a key player in the manoeuvring that bounced Corbyn into accepting that policy. 2. As leader Starmer now prances around deindustrialised midlands and northern towns blaming Corbyn for the loss of the ‘red wall’.
As for McDonnell he doesn’t come out of this looking good either. Apparently, he was motivated by a fear of a split in the Labour PLP and by the strength of feeling by middle class labour remainer activists.
The tradition I come from is that you stand by and argue for the politics and ideas that you believe in. Win or lose. I once thought McDonnell was the same. The ease with which he ditched 30 years of implacable opposition to the EU suggests not
ska invita
back on the other side
Its a tricky one
I'm with you on " stand by and argue for the politics and ideas that you believe in", but i also believe in the principle of strong democracy. Unfortunately Brexit was such a divisive issue Im not sure it was ever going to be possible to when over a majority of LP members with argument, where sentiment was 2 to 1 against (or near enough).
That said Corbyn and McD didn't really try to make that post-referendum case with any vigour... generally Corbyn's instincts are towards avoiding confrontation, which I sympathise with, but the project he was involved with was a war, not a co-operative society meeting, and he should've been a bit more hardline here and there. As a leader with some faithful support he should've risked that allegiance more. A hard hand to play whatever the tactic
Kaka Tim
Half Arsed and Slapdash till I Die
Much as I despise him - I dont think you cant hang the 2019 debacle on starmer.
the overwhelming majority of labour mps were remain.
the overwhelming majority of labour members were remain
the majority of the unions backed remain.
The majority of labour voters voted remain.
There is no way labour could have pushed a more pro brexit line - It was fucked whatever it did - and they were never going to out brexit the tories. And whoever had been leader. And it wasn't just brexit that lost them the red wall - the whole "pro terrorist" smears made Corbyn toxic to a lot of voters.
Johnson and co played a blinder by making brexit a "culture war" issue - recognising (in contrast to May) that its supporters were coming from a position of emotion and idealism rather than rational argument. So they eat into labours pro brexit voters whilst the toxifycation of Corbyn prevented too many remainer tories switching to Labour.
the overwhelming majority of labour mps were remain.
the overwhelming majority of labour members were remain
the majority of the unions backed remain.
The majority of labour voters voted remain.
There is no way labour could have pushed a more pro brexit line - It was fucked whatever it did - and they were never going to out brexit the tories. And whoever had been leader. And it wasn't just brexit that lost them the red wall - the whole "pro terrorist" smears made Corbyn toxic to a lot of voters.
Johnson and co played a blinder by making brexit a "culture war" issue - recognising (in contrast to May) that its supporters were coming from a position of emotion and idealism rather than rational argument. So they eat into labours pro brexit voters whilst the toxifycation of Corbyn prevented too many remainer tories switching to Labour.
magneze
🎧
I'm not sure they were screwed whatever they did. The "2nd ref" position was a poor fudge, but still better than the "you got it wrong, idiots" Remain position. A "we don't like it, but we'll do it better than the Tories" would have been a better position and more effective. Maybe still a loss, but substantially less IMHO. But who knows? That would have neutralized the "get Brexit done" message pretty effectively.
Kevbad the Bad
Amiable Bowel Syndrome
Well that does it then. I'm voting Lib Dem next week. I never realised just how much power local government had.
Kaka Tim
Half Arsed and Slapdash till I Die
The "2nd ref on final deal" may have won some remainer votes whilst losing leaver ones - but I don't think it was the clincher - it was labour voting against the tories (terrible) Brexit deal was what did for them. And voting for it would have been suicide as well. A nuanced, balanced position on brexit - which was what labour was striving for - was always going to please nobody.
PR1Berske
Alligator in chains by the park gates.
This is a thread for another place perhaps but I agree with your main point. The Tories shape-shift like no other party, even the LibDems.
I can imagine a very British compromise : part sell-off the NHS, choose a dozen urban areas to sell weed through a private company who passes your purchase to your GP ( so at least they can claim the NHS isn't entirely private) and take it from there. "See, we offered legalised weed to a Labour Council but they refused! Only Conservative councillors are trusting you with your own choices in life...!"
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
Key part. The Brexit referendum, and the outcome couldn't have been more of a catastrophe for Labour. They were fucked either way
Puddy_Tat
🐈⬛
on the other paw, and while accepting there were a whole host of other factors between 2017 and 2019, but labour went in to the 2017 election on the basis of respecting the result of the referendum, and got a swing close to 1997 (but didn't quite win)
TopCat
Putin fanboy
Keir Starmer the grownup needs to rediscover the radical youth he once was | Andy Beckett
The Labour leader hopes his sober, moderate image will take him to No 10. But a nation in need of change demands more of him, says Guardian columnist Andy Beckett
Larry O'Hara
Well-Known Member
Apologies if I've missed the reference, but Seymour's article was a review of the interesting book by Oliver Eagleton, 'The Starmer Project' (Verso). Some good analysis of his CPS antics (apart from phone-hacking aspect). A bit harsh on McDonnell, his views would be interesting. Well worth a look: far superior to the drivel from that wind-sock Owen Jones. I have always thought Starmer scum: this book supplies chapter & verse.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Wheeling Blair out in the last week of campaigning is a real vote winner, no? 
steveseagull
Well-Known Member
So the daft twat has now got himself under investigation by the police. If he is fined, I suspect he will have choice but to resign. What an absolute mess.
The party should then follow precedence and remove the whip.
The party should then follow precedence and remove the whip.
Similar threads
