Just Stop Oil

[NoXion]

Petition is doing good numbers, for what it's worth (nothing), 17k so far, reckon it will hit 100k

Stop Jailing Truth Tellers

Subject: Sign the petition! Stop Jailing Those Telling The Truth. Body: Friend, I signed a petition on Action Network telling the UK attorney general to stop imprisoning protesters telling the truth on climate. Care-workers, teachers, students, grandparents and now doctors. The British state...

actionnetwork.org

Signed, for whatever it's worth. I may disagree with JSO's tactics, but it's utterly absurd and authoritarian to imprison anyone for the non-violent exercise of their conscience.

 

[lazythursday]

I was going to reply, but I really can't be arsed.

You can't be arsed. I find that quite perplexing to be honest. I know I don't share your politics but you've always fundamentally seemed like a decent bloke. Why aren't you more curious as to why protestors (including climate scientists) are going to these lengths? It really isn't because they're deluded fanatics.

 

[barlimo]

Signed, for whatever it's worth. I may disagree with JSO's tactics, but it's utterly absurd and authoritarian to imprison anyone for the non-violent exercise of their conscience.

Some forms of protest don't help at all, JSO's being a case in point. They merely angered a lot of people and brought their cause into disrepute.

 

[NoXion]

Some forms of protest don't help at all, JSO's being a case in point. They merely angered a lot of people and brought their cause into disrepute.

To a limited extent I would agree that JSO's approach is counterproductive. Still, they've been scrupulously non-violent when good arguments can be made for more forceful action. Sending them to prison is tedious muscle flexing by the establishment.

But hey, if such sentences can make even opinionated right-wingers go "now, hang on a minute... ", then maybe that's something JSO can turn to its advantage,

 

[barlimo]

To a limited extent I would agree that JSO's approach is counterproductive. Still, they've been scrupulously non-violent when good arguments can be made for more forceful action. Sending them to prison is tedious muscle flexing by the establishment.

But hey, if such sentences can make even opinionated right-wingers go "now, hang on a minute... ", then maybe that's something JSO can turn to its advantage,

That's true as the sentence was way over the top.

 

[hash tag]

Some forms of protest don't help at all, JSO's being a case in point. They merely angered a lot of people and brought their cause into disrepute.

Judging by the amount of sympathy being shown for the jailed protesters, maybe their protest wasn't so counter productive after all.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Fucking hell. Four- and five-year prison sentences.

I don't share others' enthusiasm for JSO. I think their actions make fuck all positive difference and their sole real-world effect is to make the world that little bit worse for everyone. But those sentences are brutal and absurd.

 

[DotCommunist]

There is no key to this lock mate. No chess move. It's raw unbudging power.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

I do find it interesting how many people say "what they're doing won't achieve anything". Well it seems that the state entirely disagrees there, and is super keen to punish anyone doing such things at an absurd level to discourage anyone else even thinking about it.

 

[Dystopiary]

Should these two threads be merged? Both active.

Just Stop Oil

 

[Kid_Eternity]

I do find it interesting how many people say "what they're doing won't achieve anything". Well it seems that the state entirely disagrees there, and is super keen to punish anyone doing such things at an absurd level to discourage anyone else even thinking about it.

Exactly. The threat of a good example…

 

[two sheds]

... which would be much better aimed at people higher up in the food chain ...

like those who are actively involved with polluting the planet

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

The new legislation that prevents them explaining why they blocked the roads etc., the thing that got so many acquitted, have heard it said that you don’t have the right to explain in court why you broke the law and this legislation confirms that. So what about murder, are they saying cops who kill will no longer be able to argue justifiable homicide? Will they fuck.

 

[Kevbad the Bad]

You won't know if someone has broken the law until they have been found guilty, so up until that point they should surely have the right to explain their actions.

 

[Karl Masks]

I'm ambivalent about the tactics. But please suggest something better because the threat is enormous and the level of action truly pitiful. Pretty much anything is justified at this point. JSO etc are just people screaming 'what the fuck?' at society. The fact that some people are already suffering does not mean we should just sit back and let that be magnified a hundred-fold. Of course we have to fight for the here and now as well.

Firstly it would be fallacious to assume that anyone critical of their tactics has a burden of responsibility to provide an alternative. Criticism should stand or fall on its own merits.

However I agree that the enormity of the problem is a crisis. I'm not certain, at this point, enough can be done to mitigate it. What's required is beyond the ken and the will of pretty much every major power - and that's before Trump is elected. Even factoring in China going green (which of course is deliberately misrepresented by the deniers).

What do I think JSO should do? Pick targets that people can understand are part of the problem. No one is going to be sympathetic when the target are a divided working class. Hallam erroneously believes this antagonistic approach will galvanise mass support. He thinks that all it takes is a handful of activists to be radical, including getting arrested. He is wrong. People just look at them as criminals and draw the conclusion therefore they must be wrong in their cause. If you target the capitalists then people will be more sympathetic. The problem is systemic, blaming the rest of us is just falling for capitalist divide and rule.

I am open to better suggestions. Hoepfully, so are JSO. But they adamantly defend actions such as blocking mothers taking their kids to hospital, consequently they are completely misguided and thus easy pickings for alan partidge-a-likes on GMB.

 

[Karl Masks]

It helps keep it in the news, on the agenda, in the minds eye and if it gets people talking about it....
A suspended sentence was more than enough. "We" are trying to free up space in prisons, not stretch it with a few protesters.

The sentence is ridiculous, and so were the tactics. Both things can be true

 

[Karl Masks]

I’m personally more offended by the members of the public who assaulted the JSO protestors because they had to wait for a few minutes in their precious car

Sure, but if you're a mother taking a kid to a hospital apopintment, or a delivery driver on a tight schedule (upon which your wage depends) then it's a different proposition.

 

[Artaxerxes]

Can’t believe protests might affect people, clearly they should be carefully scheduled to provide the minimum disruption. Maybe we could arrange them in a nice little field in the country somewhere by appointment

 

[FridgeMagnet]

Should these two threads be merged? Both active.

Just Stop Oil

Yes I reckon so

 

[FridgeMagnet]

Have merged the two JSO threads

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I do find it interesting how many people say "what they're doing won't achieve anything". Well it seems that the state entirely disagrees there, and is super keen to punish anyone doing such things at an absurd level to discourage anyone else even thinking about it.

Hmmm. It is a demostration of power by the state to keep people in line. Exemplary. They do the same thing after riots, sending people to prison for looting a bottle of water after the 2011 riots, for example. Was that an indication that the 2011 riots achieved something other than a vicious reaction from the state?

 

[hash tag]

Can’t believe protests might affect people, clearly they should be carefully scheduled to provide the minimum disruption. Maybe we could arrange them in a nice little field in the country somewhere by appointment

Booked at least two weeks in advance and widespread public broadcasts made on television and radio.

 

[Artaxerxes]

Booked at least two weeks in advance and widespread public broadcasts made on television and radio.

Free eggs provided by the Met to bystanders

 

[Artaxerxes]

I do find it interesting how many people say "what they're doing won't achieve anything". Well it seems that the state entirely disagrees there, and is super keen to punish anyone doing such things at an absurd level to discourage anyone else even thinking about it.

These are very clear arbitrary punishment sentences to dissuade others, absolutely heavy handed as a message to deter others.

We’ll see if it works but it’s a sign the government is afraid of just how weak JSO makes them look by targeting these key little factors of modern life like roads and stopping the day to day economy

 

[lazythursday]

Putting climate aside for a moment, if we had a significant upswing of protest in this country related to everyday concerns eg cost of living, incomes, inequality etc, what could that look like? It's not going to be walkouts at the mills and mines is it? It would be some sort of disruption that might well include road blocking as one of the most effective ways of snarling up the system in this country (as we've also seen by more right-oriented protests in the past too). I think it's pretty disingenuous of some posters to hold their hands up in horror about how this is awful for the working class when you know damn well in different circumstances blocking major arteries of capitalism would be a triumph

 

[mojo pixy]

Can’t believe protests might affect people, clearly they should be carefully scheduled to provide the minimum disruption. Maybe we could arrange them in a nice little field in the country somewhere by appointment

Indeed, maybe 'protesters' should in future just mutter to themselves in their garden shed or some overgrown corner of the local park, so as not to annoy or inconvenience anyone. Better still, let's just leave governments and oil companies to it, surely they have all our best interests at heart?

Anyway whatever you do, nobody mention the suffragists! That's different, what they were doing was important whereas this is just hippies and students etc

 

[danny la rouge]

Indeed, maybe 'protesters' should in future just mutter to themselves in their garden shed or some overgrown corner of the local park, so as not to annoy or inconvenience anyone. Better still, let's just leave governments and oil companies to it, surely they have all our best interests at heart?

Anyway whatever you do, nobody mention the suffragists! That's different, what they were doing was important whereas this is just hippies and students etc

Can’t you tell the difference? The suffragists had the decency to be in history! It’s like Cable Street. They were only punching long ago fascists. Not now fascists.

 

[Kevbad the Bad]

It was the suffragettes who were law-breaking. The suffragists behaved themselves.

 

[Elpenor]

Sure, but if you're a mother taking a kid to a hospital apopintment, or a delivery driver on a tight schedule (upon which your wage depends) then it's a different proposition.

Yes those circumstances would clearly permit violence

 

[DotCommunist]

The Times Editorials on the Tolpuddle Martyrs (March 1834) to Just Stop Oil (July 2024)

The Times Editorials on the Tolpuddle Martyrs (March 1834) to Just Stop Oil (July 2024) 190 years have passed by The Times is still in favour of stiff sentences for those who have the temerity to o…

kmflett.wordpress.com

not comparing the groups but the times editorials on the sentences for both. Interesting.