Jeremy Corbyn's time is up

[mojo pixy]

Yes, presumably by ditching values ''the people'' don't like. Maybe also adopting a few new ones that they do like.

That's called populism, and its what you're advocating. Be honest about it

 

[oryx]

A general strike which would (wrongly) turn people against them. Any labour party should surely be proposing stronger legislation not just expecting unions to fight all the time for better conditions.

The presence of the 'gig' economy is another open goal. Left wing policies from Corbyn on them. Nothing of note.

Yeah, you're right re the open goal on the gig economy.

One really important thing is getting working people to see how they're being shafted. A large portion of the population work, and will be affected by pay freezes, zero hours, the 'race to the bottom' in terms of working conditions etc. Workers' right have been steadily eroded since Thatcher (and if the Blair/Brown government did anything specifically to address that, I must have blinked and missed it). Solidarity and a sense of community amongst the working population, and a recognition that the government and employers must be challenged on workers' rights, are all-important.

The Labour party is the one with the firm, historical and current links to trade unions, not the Tories nor LibDems nor Greens etc.

 

[B.I.G]

Yes, presumably by ditching values ''the people'' don't like. Maybe also adopting a few new ones that they do like.

That's called populism, and its what you're advocating. Be honest about it

Err no. Great banter though.

Are you saying that the electorate and the working class in particular do not share Corbyn's values as they stand?

 

[mojo pixy]

Are you saying that the electorate and the working class in particular do not share Corbyn's values as they stand?

As I understand things, that's what you're arguing.

Err no. Great banter though.

Not really.

 

[B.I.G]

Yeah, you're right re the open goal on the gig economy.

One really important thing is getting working people to see how they're being shafted. A large portion of the population work, and will be affected by pay freezes, zero hours, the 'race to the bottom' in terms of working conditions etc. Workers' right have been steadily eroded since Thatcher (and if the Blair/Brown government did anything specifically to address that, I must have blinked and missed it). Solidarity and a sense of community amongst the working population, and a recognition that the government and employers must be challenged on workers' rights, are all-important.

The Labour party is the one with the firm, historical and current links to trade unions, not the Tories nor LibDems nor Greens etc.

Transport.
The NHS.
Education.
Law and Order.
The economy.
Vulnerable people in society.

These are all other open goals that Corbyn should have policies on that should be obvious. No idea why he doesn't.

 

[B.I.G]

As I understand things, that's what you're arguing.



Not really.

Its not what I said thought.

 

[mojo pixy]

Its not what I said though.

It totally is:

Labour needs to appeal to the people that match their own values. If their values are really so narrow that they can't ever win an election ever again then so be it, but at the moment they are barely appealing to anyone.

Err no. Corbyn has values. The electorate has values. He needs to find the policies that he agrees with that will appeal to the electorate. And then campaign to win the election on those policies.

Also,

Any labour party should surely be proposing stronger legislation not just expecting unions to fight all the time for better conditions.

If he pushes unions the tories will just do away with the legislation asap when they get into power.

If the following gov't can ditch legislation on unions, they can ditch any legislation

 

[Humberto]

A Labour leader worth their salt would rigorously challenge the neoliberal orthodoxy and the austerity agenda it has spawned. Be against those that sell everything for buttons because their ideology demands it (even if it makes no sense) and look to reverse it. A Labour leader should confront this situation and have an effect in the short term and tell people what is really going on and where they are being led.

 

[B.I.G]

It totally is:



Also,



If the following gov't can ditch legislation on unions, they can ditch any legislation

Hmmmm. If the Tory party just abolished the NHS overnight it wouldn't lead to a massive electoral defeat?

As for everything else, you are deliberately misunderstanding what I wrote. Great banter as I already said.

 

[mojo pixy]

If I'm misunderstanding then it's not deliberate, it's because you keep contradicting yourself.

 

[B.I.G]

If I'm misunderstanding then it's not deliberate, it's because you keep contradicting yourself.

No its not

 

[mojo pixy]

Yes it is, and yes you do. sort yourself out.

 

[B.I.G]

Yes it is, and yes you do. sort yourself out.

Hahaha no I don't. For all my flaws, I am very consistent.

 

[mojo pixy]

.

 

[mojo pixy]

Go on then, be consistent with this:

You asked

Are you saying that the electorate and the working class in particular do not share Corbyn's values as they stand?

I replied that was what you were arguing, based on these posts:

Labour needs to appeal to the people that match their own values. If their values are really so narrow that they can't ever win an election ever again then so be it, but at the moment they are barely appealing to anyone.

Err no. Corbyn has values. The electorate has values. He needs to find the policies that he agrees with that will appeal to the electorate. And then campaign to win the election on those policies.

Then you posted:

Any labour party should surely be proposing stronger legislation not just expecting unions to fight all the time for better conditions.

If he pushes unions the tories will just do away with the legislation asap when they get into power.

So you'll need to explain how, if ''the tories'' can ''just do away with the legislation'' on unions, they can't do the exact same thing with whatever

stronger legislation

you think Labour should be proposing.

 

[B.I.G]

Go on then, be consistent with this:

You asked

I replied that was what you were arguing, based on these posts:



Then you posted:


So you'll need to explain how, if ''the tories'' can ''just do away with the legislation'' on unions, they can't do the exact same thing with whatever

you think Labour should be proposing.

Loads of people that vote Tory don't like or actively hate unions. Therefore they could pass legislation abolishing them and it might even help them at the ballot box. Its a very minor point though certainly not worth all these quotes.

Labour should propose a rise in the minimum wage, plus be against loopholes around it.

 

[mojo pixy]

None of that has anything to do with what I posted, and in no way explains the blatant contradictions.

 

[B.I.G]

None of that has anything to do with what I posted, and in no way explains the blatant contradictions.

There are no blatant contradictions but ok you win

It would be useful if Labour proposed some policies that might help them win votes and maybe, just maybe, these policies could be in line with the ideas of the leadership. oooh the contradictions!

 

[mojo pixy]

Labour should propose a rise in the minimum wage, plus be against loopholes around it.

Careful there. Someone'll write an angry letter to The Telegraph.

 

[B.I.G]

Careful there. Someone'll write an angry letter to The Telegraph.

Great banter again. Fine, the labour party should propose some hardcore revolutionary shit

 

[mojo pixy]

Transport.
The NHS and Vulnerable People in Society.
Education.
Law and Order.
The economy.

These are all other open goals that Corbyn should have policies on that should be obvious. No idea why he doesn't.

You numpty.

 

[mojo pixy]

I'M NOT EVEN IN THE LABOUR PARTY FFS

 

[B.I.G]

Transport.
The NHS and Vulnerable People in Society.
Education.
Law and Order.
The economy.



You numpty.

People are always going to political websites to read up on their policies. That'sa lot of words to say not very much.

 

[mojo pixy]

You wanted policies, there they are.

 

[B.I.G]

You wanted policies, there they are.

Election won then

 

[mojo pixy]

At least, if you want more specific policies, join up and go to meetings to argue for them. Obviously.

 

[mojo pixy]

...then knock on doors and convince random neighbours to vote.

You know, all that stuff you seem to be expecting other people to do...

 

[B.I.G]

At least, if you want more specific policies, join up and go to meetings to argue for them. Obviously.

I'll get right on that. I definitely spend a lot of time worrying about the Labour party and their policies.

 

[mojo pixy]

o . . . . . k

 

[B.I.G]

...then knock on doors and convince random neighbours to vote.

You know, all that stuff you seem to be expecting other people to do...

Other people being the leader of the Labour party.