Is Brexit actually going to happen?

[OzT]

I think it's daft having a Remainer in charge of a goverment trying to carry out the peoples wishes to leave.

All she had to do, and I think she's playing a blinder here, is to fluff about getting a deal she knows the Leave side will not accept, thus vote against it, and then maybe a general election with Labour coming in, and trigger off the offer from the EU to not leave. But the aim is to not Leave, even though she is supposedly working for a Leave deal.

Hmm re reading that it was quite hard reading but hope I got what I was trying to say across?

 

[Pickman's model]

I think it's daft having a Remainer in charge of a goverment trying to carry out the peoples wishes to leave.

All she had to do, and I think she's playing a blinder here, is to fluff about getting a deal she knows the Leave side will not accept, thus vote against it, and then maybe a general election with Labour coming in, and trigger off the offer from the EU to not leave. But the aim is to not Leave, even though she is supposedly working for a Leave deal.

Hmm re reading that it was quite hard reading but hope I got what I was trying to say across?

How is it dafter than any other time politicians are in government?

 

[ska invita]

I think it's daft having a Remainer in charge of a goverment trying to carry out the peoples wishes to leave.

All she had to do, and I think she's playing a blinder here, is to fluff about getting a deal she knows the Leave side will not accept, thus vote against it, and then maybe a general election with Labour coming in, and trigger off the offer from the EU to not leave. But the aim is to not Leave, even though she is supposedly working for a Leave deal.

Hmm re reading that it was quite hard reading but hope I got what I was trying to say across?

She got a more Brexity deal than the Norwayesque thing I was expecting.

 

[Pickman's model]

She got a more Brexity deal than the Norwayesque thing I was expecting.

The sort of Brexit deal where the eu says when you can go

 

[OzT]

She got a more Brexity deal than the Norwayesque thing I was expecting.

But I think she knows the house will vote against her deal, hence I said wot I said above.

Disclaimer: I know very little about the whole Brexit thing other than reading the Metro so my views are in no way knowledable or come from any useful sources

 

[Winot]

She got a more Brexity deal than the Norwayesque thing I was expecting.

Yep. And as has been pointed out by others, shot through with her real passion, which is reducing immigration.

 

[philosophical]

I called Philosophical an Irish Border Dalek if anyone is still interested.

The Irish border is still a fundamental issue regarding the practicalities of Brexit.
That is the issue, and won't change because some posters wish to describe other posters in either entertaining or insulting ways.

 

[ska invita]

The sort of Brexit deal where the eu says when you can go

I bet they had a good chuckle at that clause

I doubt in reality it's as bad as it sounds but it has a strong ring of humiliation about it

 

[The Fornicator]

Yep. And as has been pointed out by others, shot through with her real passion, which is reducing immigration.

What is the latest data you've seen on immigration, or do you mean European migration?

 

[kabbes]

The Irish border is still a fundamental issue regarding the practicalities of Brexit.
That is the issue, and won't change because some posters wish to describe other posters in either entertaining or insulting ways.

It's only a fundamental issue to the extent that it reveals the true priorities of the parties involved. The real fundamental issue is that Brexit is not the priority. For example, as repeatedly mentioned, the unification of the island of Ireland removes all the border issues in one fell swoop. But the maintenance of the UK union outranks Brexit in the eyes of those making the decisions.

 

[philosophical]

It's only a fundamental issue to the extent that it reveals the true priorities of the parties involved. The real fundamental issue is that Brexit is not the priority. For example, as repeatedly mentioned, the unification of the island of Ireland removes all the border issues in one fell swoop. But the maintenance of the UK union outranks Brexit in the eyes of those making the decisions.

The four words on the ballot paper (for brexit) were 'Leave the European Union'. Leave something and there is a border or separatIon.
That is why I see the land border in Ireland as a practical and fundamental issue.

 

[kabbes]

The four words on the ballot paper (for brexit) were 'Leave the European Union'. Leave something and there is a border or separatIon.
That is why I see the land border in Ireland as a practical and fundamental issue.

It's only a fundamental issue to the extent that it reveals the true priorities of the parties involved. The real fundamental issue is that Brexit is not the priority. For example, as repeatedly mentioned, the unification of the island of Ireland removes all the border issues in one fell swoop. But the maintenance of the UK union outranks Brexit in the eyes of those making the decisions.

.

 

[pocketscience]

It's only a fundamental issue to the extent that it reveals the true priorities of the parties involved. The real fundamental issue is that Brexit is not the priority. For example, as repeatedly mentioned, the unification of the island of Ireland removes all the border issues in one fell swoop. But the maintenance of the UK union outranks Brexit in the eyes of those making the decisions.

It's telling as well that the threat of terrorism which directly impacts that particular negotiation (ireland border/ united ireland) hasn't been challenged - particularly seeing as May and the Eu persue a zero tolerance policy on terrorism

 

[The Fornicator]

It's only a fundamental issue to the extent that it reveals the true priorities of the parties involved. The real fundamental issue is that Brexit is not the priority. For example, as repeatedly mentioned, the unification of the island of Ireland removes all the border issues in one fell swoop. But the maintenance of the UK union outranks Brexit in the eyes of those making the decisions.

Lets not forget the Brussels priority of blocking Brexit, and/or buying time, by other means.

 

[andysays]

I'd normally agree with you, but there's no road left to kick the can down. There's got to be some sort of change of tack.

May may be crap at negotiating, but she appears to be in a class of her own when it comes to can kicking.

If she can postpone this 'meaningful vote' for a bit longer, the clock will have run down so far that there will be no time for anything else, except a total cancellation.

I was originally sceptical about this being a deliberate tactic, but I'm slowly becoming convinced.

 

[Wilf]

The Irish border is still a fundamental issue regarding the practicalities of Brexit.
That is the issue, and won't change because some posters wish to describe other posters in either entertaining or insulting ways.

Renegotiate! Renegotiate!

 

[The Fornicator]

Renegotiate! Renegotiate!

Oh no, you can't renegotiate because, you know, you can't renegotiate.

 

[pocketscience]

Renegotiate! Renegotiate!

 

[Winot]

What is the latest data you've seen on immigration, or do you mean European migration?

I just meant that her passion is reducing the numbers of people coming into this country who aren't British. Obviously stopping FoM won't of itself achieve her immigration targets, but she has focussed on FoM instead of coming out of a customs union (for example).

 

[andysays]

FWIW, I've just heard something on LBC suggesting that significant numbers of NI unions polled chose remaining in the EU over remaining in UK

 

[The Fornicator]

That would go really well. Perhaps Paul MacCartney could record a single in support.

 

[teuchter]

But the maintenance of the UK union outranks Brexit in the eyes of those making the decisions.

You make it sound like NI moving from the UK to the ROI would just be a trivial matter of some paperwork and something that most people would agree would be reasonable to do without asking the people who live there.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

It's only a fundamental issue to the extent that it reveals the true priorities of the parties involved. The real fundamental issue is that Brexit is not the priority. For example, as repeatedly mentioned, the unification of the island of Ireland removes all the border issues in one fell swoop. But the maintenance of the UK union outranks Brexit in the eyes of those making the decisions.

Brexit is not a priority over everything, no. Of course it isn't. It shouldn't be a priority over respecting the GFA, for example. On that extremely narrow point, I am in agreement with May.

 

[pocketscience]

You make it sound like NI moving from the UK to the ROI would just be a trivial matter of some paperwork and something that most people would agree would be reasonable to do without asking the people who live there.

It's been pointed out before many times that any solution will cost some effort. A bit of effort shouldn't really be a sole factor to decide to do nothing.
All solutions need persuing: united ireland, hard border, irish sea border, fully independent NI in EU (give scotland that too)

 

[pocketscience]

Brexit is not a priority over everything, no. Of course it isn't. It shouldn't be a priority over respecting the GFA, for example. On that extremely narrow point, I am in agreement with May.

Are you saying that the GFA takes priority over respecting brexit then?

 

[flypanam]

You make it sound like NI moving from the UK to the ROI would just be a trivial matter of some paperwork and something that most people would agree would be reasonable to do without asking the people who live there.

Quite like how the 6 counties came into existence then.

 

[Chz]

Are you saying that the GFA takes priority over respecting brexit then?

The time it took to get the GFA in order makes Brexit look like a pinky swear. Do you think our government's solemn promise to the people of Ireland to help resolve decades of violence should be less important?

Though I suppose no-one at all should be surprised that Westminster has learned nothing from the past.

 

[philosophical]

Renegotiate! Renegotiate!

I have not mentioned renegotiation.
You mention again your Dalek idea presumably in an attempt to mock me, and by association any mentions I make regarding the border on the island of Ireland.

 

[Wilf]

May may be crap at negotiating, but she appears to be in a class of her own when it comes to can kicking.

If she can postpone this 'meaningful vote' for a bit longer, the clock will have run down so far that there will be no time for anything else, except a total cancellation.

I was originally sceptical about this being a deliberate tactic, but I'm slowly becoming convinced.

Yep, I'd agree with that. And in parallel, her opponents seem to have missed every opportunity to try and defeat/remove her, right back to the 10 days after the 2017 election (which was the point in normal politics where she should have resigned or be kicked out). I recognise that there never were 48 letters, but even last week a co-ordinated set of cabinet resignations and calls for her to resign might have created momentum (after the final cabinet deal - or even back to the Chequers deal). Poor leadership by Johnson, erg lot, inability to put any kind of coalition against May together. Ditto Labour, they've failed to be an active voice on brexit and even now seem unsure about vonc or calls for a 2nd ref. It's left her dull, utterly uninspiring, a laughing stock, but still keeping buggering on. And whilst the maths hasn't changed, time is increasingly on her side.

 

[philosophical]

Are you saying that the GFA takes priority over respecting brexit then?

Doesn't it?