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Is Brexit actually going to happen?

Will we have a brexit?

  • Yes - A fully independant Britain making its own way in the world (apart from scotland).

    Votes: 66 18.2%

  • A Semi-Detached Norway type deal

    Votes: 111 30.7%

  • No - 2nd referendum and/or face saving fudge to let us slink back in feeling a bit fucking stupid

    Votes: 185 51.1%
  • Total voters
    362
Kaka Tim said:
did you not read what i put? The DUP will never accept n.ireland having a different arrangement with the EU to the rest of the uk because it will make the north more aligned with the republic. The union is an article of faith with them (there's a clue in the name). They will not budge on this.
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The irony here is that NI already has different arrangements to the rest of the UK, so the DUP are effectively seeking to pick and choose which special arrangements they like and which they don't...
 
Kaka Tim said:
did you not read what i put? The DUP will never accept n.ireland having a different arrangement with the EU to the rest of the uk because it will make the north more aligned with the republic. The union is an article of faith with them (there's a clue in the name). They will not budge on this.
Click to expand...

They can not budge all they want but if the Westminster billions dried up, they would soon fall into line.
The one ace they have is May who is craven.
 
Kaka Tim said:
they absolutely wont fall into line. there is nothing they like better then taking a "cut nose to spite face" stand on principle. and their own supporters would crucify them. possibly literally.
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Maybe it's me but I seem to remember their No at the Anglo Irish agreement in the 80's when God's own Rev spoke to a huge crowd in Belfast. Yet Thatcher ignored them. The DUP were quite 'no' to the GFA, yet a few years later they sat in Stormont, milking their position for their own interest bring down said Stormont with bullshit about the Irish language.

I certainly wouldn't view all DUP supporters as the same. I suspect their rural base views a border with the south with some dread.
 
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sleaterkinney said:
It's what the people want:


Insect-filled chocolates, rat hair-infested noodles, and orange juice containing maggots are just some of the “horrors” UK consumers could be forced to accept if post-Brexit Britain signs a wide-ranging trade deal with the USA.

UK consumers could be forced to accept insects, mould and rat hair in food as part of post-Brexit trade deal
Click to expand...

It's fine

Here's what you need to know about the ground-up insects that Starbucks puts in your Frappuccino
 
flypanam said:
Maybe it's me but I seem to remember their No at the Anglo Irish agreement in the 80's when God's own Rev spoke to a huge crowd in Belfast. Yet Thatcher ignored them. The DUP were quite 'no' to the GFA, yet a few years later they sat in Stormont, milking their position for their own interest bring down said Stormont with bullshit about the Irish language.

I certainly would view all DUP supporters as the same. I suspect their rural base views a border with the south with some dread.
Click to expand...

they didn't have the veto on the Anglo-Irish agreement or the GFA - but it was a fati-compli - so they could claim to have stuck to their guns. But they absolutely have a veto over a sea border - and even if they weren't propping up the government, such a move would be met with ferocious resistance by loyalists ultras - riots, boycotts, strikes, sabotage. Its pretty fundamental - n.ireland in the customs unions along side the republic and rest of the UK outside would be seen - accurately - as a fundamental weakening of the union. basically - they'd go fucking apeshit.

And a hard border in n.ireland would have the same outcome.

This has been absolutely clear from day one of the brexit process and the government's approach has been to try and ignore in the hope it goes away - but now its crunch time and the only possible outcomes are customs union (i.e BINO) or no deal. one is a pointless pile of shit and the other is a clusterfuck.
 
Funny how when the EU was negotiating TTIP, people across Europe were (rightly) up in arms about the prospect of Monsanto products poisoning us to death for corporate profit, yet when Beyer (a European company) bought Monsanto outright this year, nobody seemed to bat an eyelid.
Funny old world.
 
pocketscience said:
Funny how when the EU was negotiating TTIP, people across Europe were (rightly) up in arms about the prospect of Monsanto products poisoning us to death for corporate profit, yet when Beyer (a European company) bought Monsanto outright this year, nobody seemed to bat an eyelid.
Funny old world.
Click to expand...
Luckily brexit will mean the UK avoiding all the GM foodstuffs that the Germans are now going to introduce, and we will be able to insist on higher standards in future trade deals.
Funny old world.
 
Kaka Tim said:
they didn't have the veto on the Anglo-Irish agreement or the GFA - but it was a fati-compli - so they could claim to have stuck to their guns. But they absolutely have a veto over a sea border - and even if they weren't propping up the government, such a move would be met with ferocious resistance by loyalists ultras - riots, boycotts, strikes, sabotage. Its pretty fundamental - n.ireland in the customs unions along side the republic and rest of the UK outside would be seen - accurately - as a fundamental weakening of the union. basically - they'd go fucking apeshit.

And a hard border in n.ireland would have the same outcome.

This has been absolutely clear from day one of the brexit process and the government's approach has been to try and ignore in the hope it goes away - but now its crunch time and the only possible outcomes are customs union (i.e BINO) or no deal. one is a pointless pile of shit and the other is a clusterfuck.
Click to expand...
If sorry I don’t think loyalists will be up in arms against the British state, when have they? The strike in the seventies was more of a lockout. They can’t even muster a piss at Drumcree these days. The fleg protest was impressive then just quickly went out. Loyalism is more divided than ever.

The traditional response of unionism when confronted with problems is to kill catholics. I could certainly see some of that occurring.

Given their preference is for a Tory government I suspect this is all bluster. I suspect that what they want is a change to the GFA that Arlene was banging on about last week.
 
Cloo said:
Well yes, is it fairly politically sensitive than a political campaign might have broken the rules to achieve its aims, causing potential massive economic and social damage to the country
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conversely, what exactly do you think might be achieved by investigating and prosecuting those involved?

do you think there might be some legitimate political sensitivity about criminalising a referendum result that was, at least in large part, a result of public disengagement with, and anger towards, a professionalised political class?

you think their might be dangers, perhaps greater dangers than brexit presents, in telling 17 million people that because they are thicky racists who fall for any old shite, their votes don't matter as much as the 16 million votes of the brighter, better educated people who don't get taken in by populist nonsense?

are you entirely sure that you want the spending of the 'remain' campaigns gone through in a forensic manner - what value would you put having the Govenor of the Bank of England standing up and telling the electorate that if they vote to leave they can expect the dead to pile up in the streets and for whats left of the living to be chewing raw potatoes in the snow?
 
flypanam said:
If sorry I don’t think loyalists will be up in arms against the British state, when have they? The strike in the seventies was more of a lockout. They can’t even muster a piss at Drumcree these days. The fleg protest was impressive then just quickly went out. Loyalism is more divided than ever.
.
Click to expand...

Well arguably the examples you state make my point - If they caused that amount of aggro over purely symbolic - and brain bashingly petty - issues such as drumcree, holy cross and flegs - how much more aggro will they create over something as fundamental as separating norn iron from GB via a sea border? An act that has a united Ireland as its logical - and possibly inevitable - outcome?
And what better way to unite unionists then an existential threat to the union?
 
the stagger's stephen bush's take on it -
the “U” in DUP doesn’t stand for “Don’t let Jeremy Corbyn become Prime Minister”; it stands for “Unionist”. And a deal that could unify the Conservative Party – Great Britain out of the customs union and single market while Northern Ireland remains aligned with the European Union – would put a stick of dynamite under the union between Great Britain and Northern Ireland
Click to expand...

To survive the Budget, Theresa May must realise where the DUP’s priorities lie
 
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