IRA worship
- Thread starter In Bloom
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Fisher_Gate
Active Member
Idris2002 said:
Good analysis though ...
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
using the wrong fork? belching? chewing with their mouths open?Idris2002 said:
what?
please tell!
Idris2002
canadian girlfriend
Nothing so exotic. I went to a showing of Pilger's Palestine doc. It had even managed to attract a couple of 'real people' i.e. not students or activist types.
While we were waiting to begin, the baldy guy just sat there and stared into space, occasionally sipping from a carry-out cappucino.
I also didn't care for the way their old guy talked about the 'joosh lobby' in America.
While we were waiting to begin, the baldy guy just sat there and stared into space, occasionally sipping from a carry-out cappucino.
I also didn't care for the way their old guy talked about the 'joosh lobby' in America.
Politically SD are one of the biggest jokes in town. They have a particularly strong case of 'leadership of the working class in exile-itis". I recall, with pain, their repeated demands that the bin tax campaign should abandon its blockades of bin depots and instead occupy the trade union headquarters. I also recall their one Dublin member standing up at a meeting and demanding that the SWP assert their leadership of the campaign (to the bemusement / horror / hilarity of the campaign which generally didn't want the SWP to do anything like that). They are only worth reading after a few bongs for a giggle.Idris2002 said:
pilchardman
Dances With Penguins
Is that comment made in relation to Class War, or is it general?john x said:
pilchardman
Dances With Penguins
OK, I'll reply then. Being covered by "general", but not by "Class War".john x said:
I don't uncritically support "national liberation movements" myself. Indeed I'm very suspicious of such movements. "National" is not something I feel attracted to at all.
However, there are those on "the left" who do seem oddly attracted to these movements. Just don't count me among them.
I've never got this either.
My Dad is a northern Irish catholic, so I'm not entirely disconnected from this- i've always seen the IRA as anti w/c nationalist murderers. All my family in ireland think the same. So does my dad.
The homogenising of Irish opinion I see on here from pro-ira posters is something that always makes me suspicious.
Good posts everyone- perhaps someone competant and knowledgeable enough to put the pro- case might come on the thread soon?
My Dad is a northern Irish catholic, so I'm not entirely disconnected from this- i've always seen the IRA as anti w/c nationalist murderers. All my family in ireland think the same. So does my dad.
The homogenising of Irish opinion I see on here from pro-ira posters is something that always makes me suspicious.
Good posts everyone- perhaps someone competant and knowledgeable enough to put the pro- case might come on the thread soon?
What's not to like. The IRA are patriotic, hate the British, love the God fella and belong to a profoundly white monoculture. At least that's how the Yanks see them; bit like the Israelis, just more deferential and lacking the firepower.
That the IRA style themselves as revolutionary Socialists in Ireland is almost always news to their Yank fans. Come to think of it the Israelis probably have a more solid Socialist pedigree.
That the IRA style themselves as revolutionary Socialists in Ireland is almost always news to their Yank fans. Come to think of it the Israelis probably have a more solid Socialist pedigree.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
like? examples!kropotkin said:
Divisive Cotton
Now I just have my toy soldiers
kropotkin said:
Nobody is 'homogenising Irish opinion' - those that have supported revolutionary republicanism have never really been traditionally more than 10% of the Northern Irish population and perhaps 5% of the Republic.
"And it was a war forced upon them, not the other way around"
how true is this though DC?? .. it is clear that the civil rights movement was a far greater threat to Unionism (and the british state) than the P/IRA ever became .. and it was consequently attacked from all sides .. from the RUC/ from street burnings .. till it was so bad the british state intervened as it was an international embarressmnet .. but what needs to be asked is how much did the all ireland catholic middle classes/establishment push / support the movement to the armed struggle when this just gave the northen working classes another 25 years of pain
to the IRA supportters .. do you think without the P/IRA campaign the northern w/c would be better or worse of today??
how true is this though DC?? .. it is clear that the civil rights movement was a far greater threat to Unionism (and the british state) than the P/IRA ever became .. and it was consequently attacked from all sides .. from the RUC/ from street burnings .. till it was so bad the british state intervened as it was an international embarressmnet .. but what needs to be asked is how much did the all ireland catholic middle classes/establishment push / support the movement to the armed struggle when this just gave the northen working classes another 25 years of pain
to the IRA supportters .. do you think without the P/IRA campaign the northern w/c would be better or worse of today??
Idris2002
canadian girlfriend
oi2002 said:
I know a QUB academic who was giving some seps a tour of Belfast. As they turned into one street, he said 'you can tell this a republican street by all the Palestinian flags'.
Cue shock horror and amazement by the septics, who tearfully asked if the republicans were anti-semites.
Divisive Cotton
Now I just have my toy soldiers
durruti02 said:
For staters, it's completely true.
The reformist civil rights movement was a threat to the Unionist/Orange state because it was seen as the thin edge of the wedge, whether the end to partition or a more confident working class. Either way, it would have ended their total iron grip on the statelet. Revolutionary republicanism was a threat because it took the fight to their doorsteps - literally.
I'm not sure what you mean by 'how much did the all ireland catholic middle classes/establishment push / support the movement to the armed struggle when this just gave the northen working classes another 25 years of pain'.
Didn't the IRA want to overthrow of the Dublin government too?
Would the northern w/c be in a better position today - obviously that includes Loyalists as well. Well, there was an absence of capitalist investment in Northern Ireland because of the troubles, althought not an abscence of state investment. But capital flight is the price to pay where the working class are trying to assert power - do you think it would be in different in Hackney? It certainly wasn't any different in Liverpool.
revol68
what, fucking what?
Idris2002 said:
correct i am neither the ginger american nor the eco hippy. I know both of them though. Used to live with the hippy one with glasses and goatee thou. I'm much more into my marxism than those two and hate tall ginger ones flirting with identity politics (not unknown for an american).
I might have met you with them thou, i'm a short arse who wears my jeans too low.
revol68
what, fucking what?
Divisive Cotton said:
Fuck me man do you actually have any fucking clue beyond what you read in official republican propaganda?
Oh aye the provos seriously aimed to overthrow the Dublin government, cock!
I think your mistaking the working class tearing lumps out of itself for the working class trying to assert power. For once and all the republican struggle never had fuck all to do with class, it might have involved working class people but it was not the working class fighting for itself.
Divisive Cotton
Now I just have my toy soldiers
revol68 said:
I'm sick to death of your ill-thought through juvenile and ideological puritanical ramblings. Fuck off back to college. Do you have any idea what the nature of revolutions entail? You end up shotting more of 'your side' than you will be those you're seeking to overthrow. Northern Ireland serves as a reminder of that.
revol68
what, fucking what?
man are you on crack? speak to some fucking republicans they never really gave to shits about revolution they only cared about a united ireland, the revolution bit was a ncie wee appendix to hoodwink gobshites like yourself.
Basically you see it as republicans figthing for a revolution and loyalist being counter revolutionaries? Congratulations you've just made a complete cock of yourself.
Basically you see it as republicans figthing for a revolution and loyalist being counter revolutionaries? Congratulations you've just made a complete cock of yourself.
Divisive Cotton
Now I just have my toy soldiers
revol68 said:
Pickman's post here was excellent. Why? Because it speaks from the sheer honesty of being active on the ground. He's not an Irish nationalist, far from it, an anti-nationalist. But time and time again he has stood shoulder to shoulder with Irish Republicans on the same issues against the common enemy, and from which he has quite obviously formed a better appreciation of the struggle.
None of your posts on this board ever demonstrate experience.
You're just an archair theorist gobshite.
miss giggles
an unknown quantity...
I think it's all very shallow really. The IRA are getting a bit romantacised now, because Al Quida don't make phone calls.
fishfingerer
sultan of cringe
You sound like a sunday independent hack.revol68 said:
revol68
what, fucking what?
sorry mate but your pathetic attempt to aliign yourself with someone else in order to attack me don't really work.
You know nothing about my activity, i've been on bloody sunday marches (though fuck knows why considering some of the sectarian assholes i find myself surrounded by), i've been involved in issues that effect the working class of all communities, water tax, anti fascism and anti pfi. I've also had the pleasure of being shot out of my hosue by loyalists and you have the nerve to till me im sitting on my fucking armchair.
Where the fuck are you sitting?
and once again you talk of this "struggle', well it isn't my struggle, it was never more than the struggle of 10 % of the population at most (and i really mean at most, as the IRA never had more than a 1000 active volunteers).
The "struggle" you talk about was nothing more than a nationalist bloodletting, that only help perpeuate and reinforce the sectarian divide, it did nothing more than put alot of working class people in graves and jails, whilst nothing changed, we still live in shitholes, we still have the worst wages in the UK, and now we have the Greek farce of watching self labelled socialists suck the balls of industry, close hospitals (the other lots tho) and implement neo liberalism with a nice wee green ribbon.
Catch yourself fucking on!
You know nothing about my activity, i've been on bloody sunday marches (though fuck knows why considering some of the sectarian assholes i find myself surrounded by), i've been involved in issues that effect the working class of all communities, water tax, anti fascism and anti pfi. I've also had the pleasure of being shot out of my hosue by loyalists and you have the nerve to till me im sitting on my fucking armchair.
Where the fuck are you sitting?
and once again you talk of this "struggle', well it isn't my struggle, it was never more than the struggle of 10 % of the population at most (and i really mean at most, as the IRA never had more than a 1000 active volunteers).
The "struggle" you talk about was nothing more than a nationalist bloodletting, that only help perpeuate and reinforce the sectarian divide, it did nothing more than put alot of working class people in graves and jails, whilst nothing changed, we still live in shitholes, we still have the worst wages in the UK, and now we have the Greek farce of watching self labelled socialists suck the balls of industry, close hospitals (the other lots tho) and implement neo liberalism with a nice wee green ribbon.
Catch yourself fucking on!
Divisive Cotton
Now I just have my toy soldiers
revol68 said:
I very much doubt that any of this is true.
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