Also exploited by very effective campaigning by Respect in Bradford by what I read in the Times today (not the most unbiased source but it rang fairly true). Which is fine, and if Galloway/ Respect want to show how a more left wing MP can be effective locally and in parliament, well all good to them. Time will tell if he is interested in really changing things.
Galloway returns to Parliament in sensational win in Bradford West - Labour/Coalition smashed
- Thread starter Fisher_Gate
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Also exploited by very effective campaigning by Respect in Bradford by what I read in the Times today (not the most unbiased source but it rang fairly true). Which is fine, and if Galloway/ Respect want to show how a more left wing MP can be effective locally and in parliament, well all good to them. Time will tell if he is interested in really changing things.
Time will tell if he is interested in really changing things.
Come ON 8115... I LOVE this election result too...to pieces... but we've ALL gotta remember that "Gorgeous George Galloway" is himself, always was, always will be... an opportunist snakeoil salesman/Elmar Gantry evangelist, with an ego bigger than the universe, and a desire ONLY to continue to ride his lifelong wave of personal prosperity on the back of pseudo radicalism and fooling the Muslim community that he's their "special pal". Just don't actually BELIEVE in the bastard... let's just hope what he's done is a crack in the Labour Party hegemony over the working class voter.
Come ON 8115... I LOVE this election result too...to pieces... but we've ALL gotta remember that "Gorgeous George Galloway" is himself, always was, always will be... an opportunist snakeoil salesman/Elmar Gantry evangelist, with an ego bigger than the universe, and a desire ONLY to continue to ride his lifelong wave of personal prosperity on the back of pseudo radicalism and fooling the Muslim community that he's their "special pal". Just don't actually BELIEVE in the bastard... let's just hope what he's done is a crack in the Labour Party hegemony over the working class voter.
barney_pig
Po-cha-na-quar-hip
Galloway's victory in Bradford is little different to Griffen's and Brons' in the last Euros; both he and they exploited dissatisfaction with the status quo, and the establishments tweedle dum/ tweedledee political nonchoice, and both he, and they, were able to corner the communal frustrations of the majority ethnic/religious group.
to see this as a break with labour is correct, but to see this as a break to the left is lunatic.
to see this as a break with labour is correct, but to see this as a break to the left is lunatic.
free spirit
more tea vicar?
it's a lot different to the BNP given that the BNP only got seats due to the party list / PR type system, where as Galloway won an outright majority.
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Why?
The issues GG was campaigning on were predominantly left issues (as far as I can tell)
So I think that remark needs further explanation.
barney_pig
Po-cha-na-quar-hip
barney_pig
Po-cha-na-quar-hip
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Still not clear. Yes we know GG is a dick, but he seems to have run against Labour on what are predominantly left issues in Bradford.
So I still don't get how it's 'lunatic' to see the result as a 'break to the left' unless you think that means something very different to an indication of 'significant support for left policy positions' by the people who elected him.
So I still don't get how it's 'lunatic' to see the result as a 'break to the left' unless you think that means something very different to an indication of 'significant support for left policy positions' by the people who elected him.
barney_pig
Po-cha-na-quar-hip
teetotalism is a left wing issue?
who is a real muslim is a left wing issue?
Galloway is the paid propagandist of the Iranian Government who denies the butchering of thousands of workers and alibis the mass murdering dictators of the near and far east, and this is a victory for the left?
who is a real muslim is a left wing issue?
Galloway is the paid propagandist of the Iranian Government who denies the butchering of thousands of workers and alibis the mass murdering dictators of the near and far east, and this is a victory for the left?
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
It was Labour who ran a muslim candidate.
Galloway was clearly positioning himself well to the left of labour on policy issues.
I have yet to see evidence that his stance on Sky-Pixies or his penchant for sucking the dicks of dodgy Arab leaders was noticeably more electorally significant than his stance on (say) NHS privatisation.
I haven't seen as much evidence one way or the other as I'd like though, so if you have anything pertinent, then I'd be interested to see it.
Galloway was clearly positioning himself well to the left of labour on policy issues.
I have yet to see evidence that his stance on Sky-Pixies or his penchant for sucking the dicks of dodgy Arab leaders was noticeably more electorally significant than his stance on (say) NHS privatisation.
I haven't seen as much evidence one way or the other as I'd like though, so if you have anything pertinent, then I'd be interested to see it.
barney_pig
Po-cha-na-quar-hip
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Sure, we know he was running in a community that's 38% muslim, against a muslim and hence had to make a show of respect for muslim views on sky-pixies. Hardly a surprise.
What you need to show though, in order for your argument to hold water, is that the deciding issues weren't primarily left issues (e.g. opposition to the cuts etc) but were rather, sky-pixie issues or whatever else it is you're trying to imply that they were.
What you need to show though, in order for your argument to hold water, is that the deciding issues weren't primarily left issues (e.g. opposition to the cuts etc) but were rather, sky-pixie issues or whatever else it is you're trying to imply that they were.
DexterTCN
Troy and Abed in the morning
barney...which part of that leaflet is inaccurate? There's nothing wrong with a politician of any ilk releasing their version of reality to the voters they're looking to for votes. There's nothing in that leaflet that is left or right wing apart from being against the war...in which he was correct...and left wing.
Ibn Khaldoun
the present is dead, long live the future . . .
Congratulations George Galloway and RESPECT, and well done people of Bradford West!
barney_pig
Po-cha-na-quar-hip
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Still not seeing a coherent argument here.
I'd be extremely surprised if anyone here is unaware of Galloway's character and history, at least in outline. I'd also be very surprised if many people here have much enthusiasm for religious delusions of whatever flavour.
The question of whether Bradford West represents any sort of swing to the left, however conditional, is an interesting and I think important one though. If it does represent anything remotely like a 37% swing to the left of Labour, that's definitely not a trivial outcome.
The crucial point being, how much of this is reproducible without either Galloway or a constituency that's 38% muslim?
So all this banging on about how Islamic Galloway sounds or which dodgy Middle East leaders' dicks he's sucked is, to my mind, begging the question unless you can first make the case that Bradford was won primarily by kow-towing to Islamists (or whatever it is that you're trying to argue) and that any of the obviously left-of-Labour stuff that GG appeared to be campaigning on didn't matter; or at least was so insignificant in comparison to, say, GG's claim to be teetotal, that we can't legitimately infer anything from it about what might happen elsewhere.
So if you want to argue that this means nothing for the left, let's see something a bit better than all this MEMRI-style "Galloway is a paid Iranian agent" shit. What's next? Mulsamic Rayguns?
I'd be extremely surprised if anyone here is unaware of Galloway's character and history, at least in outline. I'd also be very surprised if many people here have much enthusiasm for religious delusions of whatever flavour.
The question of whether Bradford West represents any sort of swing to the left, however conditional, is an interesting and I think important one though. If it does represent anything remotely like a 37% swing to the left of Labour, that's definitely not a trivial outcome.
The crucial point being, how much of this is reproducible without either Galloway or a constituency that's 38% muslim?
So all this banging on about how Islamic Galloway sounds or which dodgy Middle East leaders' dicks he's sucked is, to my mind, begging the question unless you can first make the case that Bradford was won primarily by kow-towing to Islamists (or whatever it is that you're trying to argue) and that any of the obviously left-of-Labour stuff that GG appeared to be campaigning on didn't matter; or at least was so insignificant in comparison to, say, GG's claim to be teetotal, that we can't legitimately infer anything from it about what might happen elsewhere.
So if you want to argue that this means nothing for the left, let's see something a bit better than all this MEMRI-style "Galloway is a paid Iranian agent" shit. What's next? Mulsamic Rayguns?
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Thanks for that. We need more stuff like this.
Spin ('nothing wrong with Ed') apart, that strikes me as having some good insights.
It tends to support a hypothesis along the lines that: "young and disenfranchised" was probably a lot more significant than "pakistani and muslim" in producing this result.
It also suggests that Labour gave them an open goal by assuming that the result was a shoo-in for a young scion of the local old-boys network and treating it as a national campaigning opportunity. While Galloway convincingly pretended to care about local issues.
articul8
Dishonest sociopath
You can't separate these two factors out so easily - it was part of Gallowar's back history of speaking out against the war etc (eg. US Senate hearing footage) - speaking truth and shattering cosy political consensus) that meant that muslim youth in particular would give him a hearing.
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
Sure. I guess I was overstating my point a bit, but the "young and disenfranchised" aspect (along with the local issue stuff) does seem to have been far more important than, let's say most of the political class have been giving credit for.
I think it's very convenient for them to try to suggest that this is all about Galloway sucking up to muslims and nothing at all do do with the failure of the neo-liberal parties to offer anything that young working class people in Bradford might give a shit about.
If Labour have any electoral sense (and they DO seem pretty switched on on that front at least), they will be SHITTING themselves about this result. They spend YEARS sucking up to the local Muslim bigwigs who count for so much in the traditional Muslim community in terms of delivering the vote, and arch poseur , George Galloway, cruises in, no previous organisation, and with a bit of Left rhetoric against the cuts and Labour uselessness, sucking up to "Muslim values", and his usual rhetoric on Iraq/Afghanistan (but presumeably nowt on his great pal Bashar Asaad), and bugger me, he landslides it !
Chillingly , one could easily imagine some similar "protest vote" upset in another Labour safe seat - with a big WHITE working class majority, going to the BNP, in the current turmoil of UK politics !
(Something that ALWAYS amazes me when I see Galloway doing his almost "pidgeon English" patronising "me love Allah" ... "the Prophet be praised" stuff in meetings with Muslim communities, is that the locals can't SEE what an insincere twat he is -- a bit like the colonial era British nabob doing a bit of networking with the "natives"... "me Great White Chief... you lovely loyal chappies.. Allah be praised !")
Chillingly , one could easily imagine some similar "protest vote" upset in another Labour safe seat - with a big WHITE working class majority, going to the BNP, in the current turmoil of UK politics !
(Something that ALWAYS amazes me when I see Galloway doing his almost "pidgeon English" patronising "me love Allah" ... "the Prophet be praised" stuff in meetings with Muslim communities, is that the locals can't SEE what an insincere twat he is -- a bit like the colonial era British nabob doing a bit of networking with the "natives"... "me Great White Chief... you lovely loyal chappies.. Allah be praised !")
Bernie Gunther
Fundamentalist Druid
I don't think I could imagine the BNP mobilising large numbers of disenfranchised youth, including (as I understand it) lots of students, to campaign for them enthusiastically, which seems to have been the case and to have been a significant factor in Bradford.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Do fuck off, you shit-stirrer.
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