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Barbarism is already here. The MSM helped bring us to it. The autocrats are already in power, they own the MSM.

Your loathing of independent media is nothing more than fear of the unknown, of the unfamiliar, You should get over it.
Lol no hun I actively help write independent media, both as my day job and as a volunteer. What I don't do is treat "independent" as an automatic recommendation, because the sphere is jam packed with scumbags whose whole job is to sound plausible while rinsing money off the foolish and gullible. Particularly on the right, because that can make a whole lot of money from tapping billionaires for funds.

There is the barbarism of the everyday, which certainly does exist, but that is nowhere close to the future that awaits us at the end of the trail being laid down now. The current conflict is between two distinct visions for capitalism, one being the neoliberal one in which billionaires operate at a remove, essentially the status quo, the other being the one you're unwittingly supporting which seems to be leaning towards a form of ultra-xenophobic, socially-regressive militarised autocracy in which even the sharply limited democratic mandates available now are swept away and free speech becomes little more than a rhetorical pretence.

Neither are great, the latter however, if enacted in full, would in all probability see me arrested for sedition. It's already seeing people jailed for years on end simply for protesting. Personally I do prefer the system where I still get to pop down the shops of an evening.
 
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There are certainly some very good independent journalists, as there are good journalists working for the MSM. Where you are going wrong is thinking you've got an eye for who's trustworthy, because you've been very clear over the last while in showing yourself as having swallowed more Koolaid than a compound full of cultists. "Variety" is not some magic salve if you're uncritically nodding along with the loons and dismissing everyone else.

Yeah, “independent journalism” for this fascist dipshit is Russia Today, Press TV and the Grey Zone.
 
I know people who have worked for all three. The sensible ones quickly moved on and had some instructive stories about their experiences. In the former case there were two floors at the old RT HQ, one for the journalists and one for their Russian handlers, who very much were not hands-off. "Independent" was not the word I heard about it. Generally speaking there are three types of people who sign up to work for that end of the industry, folks who really need the income, folks with zero qualms about repeating absolute nonsense as long as they get money and a profile, and folks whose personal dogmas match up with the firm's general objectives.
 
I know people who have worked for all three. The sensible ones quickly moved on and had some instructive stories about their experiences. In the former case there were two floors at the old RT HQ, one for the journalists and one for their Russian handlers, who very much were not hands-off. "Independent" was not the word I heard about it. Generally speaking there are three types of people who sign up to work for that end of the industry, folks who really need the income, folks with zero qualms about repeating absolute nonsense as long as they get money and a profile, and folks whose personal dogmas match up with the firm's general objectives.

Can you clarify the 'all three' you refer to please? I'm not clear what you referring to, despite paging back through a few previous posts. :confused:
 
Generally speaking there are three types of people who sign up to work for that end of the industry, folks who really need the income, folks with zero qualms about repeating absolute nonsense as long as they get money and a profile, and folks whose personal dogmas match up with the firm's general objectives.

Not a million miles from the BBC tbf....
 
The second is Iran-backed, the third is Max Blumenthal doing a dual grift of crowdfunding and cash from unnamed "progressive individuals" - ie. shady bastards he'd rather not namecheck.

Edit: The only person I've met who's done GBeebies is Lisa Mckenzie afaik, it's probably a bit too active turncoat for my contacts list, you lose more opportunities than you gain unless you're up for nailing your entire future to gammon Toryism.
 
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Bullshit.

For all the mistakes made by the beeb over the years (and there are many of those) there are still people there with integrity.

The BBC is the best of the Western MSM by a very long way, but it's not above bending the truth on certain issues. Israel springs to mind.
 
Bullshit.

For all the mistakes made by the beeb over the years (and there are many of those) there are still people there with integrity.
Much as Phil's whirring mess of a bullshit compass can't countenance it, the Beeb's got basic professional editorial standards and a fear of serious litigation which tend to impact on how egregiously it can lie and dissemble. That's not to say it doesn't regularly omit, exaggerate, misdirect and sometimes lie. It definitely does, especially on matters the government cares about – it's a State broadcaster after all – but Phil's casual out-of-hand dismissal is laughable.

The Beeb's relationship with accuracy, subject selection etc is complex, full of contrasting and contradictory pressures, as is always the case with large institutions, all of which gets boiled down to a pathetic rendition of cartoon villainy when the tin foil set get talking about it.
 
Much as Phil's whirring mess of a bullshit compass can't countenance it, the Beeb's got basic professional editorial standards and a fear of serious litigation which tend to impact on how egregiously it can lie and dissemble. That's not to say it doesn't regularly omit, exaggerate, misdirect and sometimes lie. It definitely does, especially on matters the government cares about – it's a State broadcaster after all – but Phil's casual out-of-hand dismissal is laughable.

The Beeb's relationship with accuracy, subject selection etc is complex, full of contrasting and contradictory pressures, as is always the case with large institutions, all of which gets boiled down to a pathetic rendition of cartoon villainy when the tin foil set get talking about it.

I basically agree with you about the people who work at the Beeb, but they're subject to pressure from above, and it is exerted when it feels the need.
 
Much as Phil's whirring mess of a bullshit compass can't countenance it, the Beeb's got basic professional editorial standards and a fear of serious litigation which tend to impact on how egregiously it can lie and dissemble. That's not to say it doesn't regularly omit, exaggerate, misdirect and sometimes lie. It definitely does, especially on matters the government cares about – it's a State broadcaster after all – but Phil's casual out-of-hand dismissal is laughable.

The Beeb's relationship with accuracy, subject selection etc is complex, full of contrasting and contradictory pressures, as is always the case with large institutions, all of which gets boiled down to a pathetic rendition of cartoon villainy when the tin foil set get talking about it.
They never really recovered from the WMD/dossier/David Kelly fallout with the Blair govt...
 
They never really recovered from the WMD/dossier/David Kelly fallout with the Blair govt...

The BBC disgraced themselves over Jeremy Corbyn, and over Red Ken before that--both times using anti-semitism as the stick. Before that they disgraced themselves over Scargill and Benn. Also over every war since the Falklands.

The people who work there are great, but they'll disgrace themselves when ordered to do so on pain of employment.
 
It's had a rough ride pretty much since Blair, yeah. People often focus on the hostile environment fostered under Boris Johnson towards BBC funding but Cameron and Osborne were just as bad with threats, attempts to put their men in at the top levels, teamups with Murdoch to trash its reputation etc. Funding cuts and the threat of such alone have hollowed out much of its formerly pretty decent investigations department and absolutely ruined its regional programming.

The BBC disgraced themselves over Jeremy Corbyn, and over Red Ken before that--both times using anti-semitism as the stick.

Again, you're looking for the simple case here when it isn't - actually it's an interesting cultural-political case study that could stand a much more in-depth look one of these days. The BBC didn't afaics need much bearing down from government in that case because its institutional tendencies were already aligned with the project to destroy Corbynism. Newsnight wasn't acting on instruction when it did that splash image of him with the Kremlin in the background and a red star superimposed on his hat, that was the watercooler chat about him and had been for a long time.

The Beeb's journalists, particularly the survivors from years of cuts, tend towards a centrism which pretends to itself that this amounts to evenhandedness. But that doesn't mean everyone in the firm agreed either, or that all the content was so inclined. And those same institutional tendencies do often clash with Tory/State values, which is usually what fuels the spats where it's accused of a left-wing bias.
 
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The BBC disgraced themselves over Jeremy Corbyn, and over Red Ken before that--both times using anti-semitism as the stick. Before that they disgraced themselves over Scargill and Benn. Also over every war since the Falklands.

The people who work there are great, but they'll disgrace themselves when ordered to do so on pain of employment.
It's difficult for staff when they are told not to use social media to express their views, when wrong UN's like Fox inspire a mob to turn up outside their place of work, when cuts decimated the workforce... and management cared more about not upsetting the government of the day than dedicated workers.

The workers behind the scenes, in particular.
 
Barbarism is already here. The MSM helped bring us to it. The autocrats are already in power, they own the MSM.

Your loathing of independent media is nothing more than fear of the unknown, of the unfamiliar, You should get over it.
You're so full of s---, the toilet's jealous.

Having unregulated "talking heads" filling YouTube with hours of diatribe in the name of free speech is why we've got so many boys filled with misogyny and negativity, how we ended up with people believing the Trump lies over a stolen election, and much else besides.

It's not "independent media", and you know it. It's dangerous, rabble rousing, minority hating, democracy denying, misogynistic crap.
 
Tbf he's not been quite as bad as usual here, some of it even prompted slightly more in-depth replies than "fuck off dwyer".
 
The rhetoric of a fascist tyrant:

Trump quotes Putin condemning American democracy, praises autocrat Orban Trump also called Jan. 6 defendants “hostages” and again demonized immigrants as “poisoning the blood of our country”

The crowd of thousands in a college arena cheered Trump’s recitation of an anti-immigrant poem called “The Snake” that he has repeated on the campaign trail and popularized since the 2016 campaign.


I know others on here don't agree with my stance on Trump supporters but I reiterate my attitude to them: fuck all of them. If you attend these Nuremberg-style rallies and whoop and cheer some uber-privileged would-be tough guy engaging in the most hateful, dehumanising rhetoric about desperate, marginalised people you are simply a contemptible piece of shit who doesn't deserve any solidarity.
 
The rhetoric of a fascist tyrant:




I know others on here don't agree with my stance on Trump supporters but I reiterate my attitude to them: fuck all of them. If you attend these Nuremberg-style rallies and whoop and cheer some uber-privileged would-be tough guy engaging in the most hateful, dehumanising rhetoric about desperate, marginalised people you are simply a contemptible piece of shit who doesn't deserve any solidarity.
This is the thing which baffles me about certain posters still posting here.


We know Trump wants to be a dictator (beyond just day one)
We know Trump wants to restrict or even stop elections
We know Trump wants to only have judges he appointed, following laws only he approves.

If you support Trump, as certain posters do, you support the destruction of American democracy and the implementation of a dictatorship.
 
The rhetoric of a fascist tyrant:




I know others on here don't agree with my stance on Trump supporters but I reiterate my attitude to them: fuck all of them. If you attend these Nuremberg-style rallies and whoop and cheer some uber-privileged would-be tough guy engaging in the most hateful, dehumanising rhetoric about desperate, marginalised people you are simply a contemptible piece of shit who doesn't deserve any solidarity.
But Jeff, it's all about owning the libs...
 
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