Donald Trump - MAGAtwat news and discussion

[Boo Radley75]

The origanel reason for that (in the 1700s) was because of the size of the country and time taken to travel to washington. Totally outdated now of course.

Much like a lot of their constitution, like needing the common man to arm himself in case the British invade.

 

[krtek a houby]

The glorious 47th PotUS continues to put the enemies of America in their place.

This week's lawsuit is against a Des Moines pollster who outrageously claimed Harris was leading over the President elect.

Clearly an act of "election interference".

Trump sues Iowa newspaper over election poll claiming Harris’s lead

Des Moines Register and pollster Ann Selzer accused of consumer fraud and ‘election interference’ in lawsuit

www.theguardian.com

Trump said on Monday. “I’m going to be bringing one against the people in Iowa, their newspaper, which had a very, very good pollster who got me right all the time, and then just before the election, she said I was going to lose by three or four points and it became the biggest story all over the world.”

He continued: “In my opinion, it was fraud and it was election interference. She’s gotten me right always, she’s a very good pollster she knows what she was doing.”

He added: “It costs a lot of money to do it, but we have to straighten out the press. Our press is very corrupt, almost as corrupt as our elections.”

 

[Boo Radley75]

Do you not think if you come from your gaff to our gaff you should be a bit humble, ready to size it up and meet the long time regulars in the middle?

Sounds like the sort of thing the far right say to immigrants.

 

[krtek a houby]

Dp

 

[krtek a houby]

Sounds like the sort of thing the far right say to immigrants.

Humberto may be tired and emotional, but he is not far right.

 

[Humberto]

Sounds like the sort of thing the far right say to immigrants.

Yep av refugees contribute so much. It's been good.

 

[HeAthen]

If you voted against Trump you certainly can complain about the shit he pulls.
If you didn't take part in democracy you have zero right to complain about anything he does.

While I always vote and certainly agree that it is important to do so, I can also see people's argument who say they can't vote for any of the candidates (rather than those who just can't be arsed).

If we take the UK GE as an example, I won't vote Tory (ever), I won't vote LibDem, I couldn't vote Labour (Especially not with Rachel fucking Reeves as my MP). The only candidate I could vote for was the Green candidate and that's where my vote went but I recognise that that not everyone has that option. I've certainly lived in places previously where finding a candidate or party standing that I can comfortably vote for has been very difficult. The important thing for me in deciding where my vote goes is that I have someone to vote 'for'. I can't do the whole voting against or protest vote malarky.

I'm not sure how many candidates there were in the US election outside of Trump, Harris and RFK (even though he had unoficially withdrawn but was still on the ballot) but I can understad why people found they couldn't vote for those three.

 

[HeAthen]

Why are we back to this lame shit again?

Seemingly so. The ones doing it are, as Trump would say "SO SAD, THE SADDLIEST SET OF SADDOS"

 

[HeAthen]

Humberto may be tired and emotional, but he is not far right.

Boo didn't say they were but the language quoted is very similar to the othering the far-right engage in.

 

[Flavour]

If you didn't take part in democracy you have zero right to complain about anything he does.

By voting you condone / support the system, and therefore must accept the result, and everything which results from it. Voting legitmizes the government. So one could also argue the opposite.

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

While I always vote and certainly agree that it is important to do so, I can also see people's argument who say they can't vote for any of the candidates (rather than those who just can't be arsed).

If we take the UK GE as an example, I won't vote Tory (ever), I won't vote LibDem, I couldn't vote Labour (Especially not with Rachel fucking Reeves as my MP). The only candidate I could vote for was the Green candidate and that's where my vote went but I recognise that that not everyone has that option. I've certainly lived in places previously where finding a candidate or party standing that I can comfortably vote for has been very difficult. The important thing for me in deciding where my vote goes is that I have someone to vote 'for'. I can't do the whole voting against or protest vote malarky.

I'm not sure how many candidates there were in the US election outside of Trump, Harris and RFK (even though he had unoficially withdrawn but was still on the ballot) but I can understad why people found they couldn't vote for those three.

List here: https://ballotpedia.org/Presidential_candidates,_2024

There are loads, although I don't think they were all on the slate in every state. There are only two candidates really though aren't there - I mean if I was American I'd probably cast a token third party vote (and voted Green here too) but I can't see it makes any difference if you don't feel like making the effort. You can tell yourself you've done something but it's pretty meaningless at the end of the day.

 

[two sheds]

By voting you condone / support the system, and therefore must accept the result, and everything which results from it. Voting legitmizes the government. So one could also argue the opposite.

If a dictator is voted in, do you feel that people who didn't vote have less responsibility for the result than people who voted against?

 

[kabbes]

If a dictator is voted in, do you feel that people who didn't vote have less responsibility for the result than people who voted against?

By “people” do you mean each individual person? Or the populace as an imagined group?

 

[two sheds]

individual people, who Flavour seemed to be talking about.

 

[DotCommunist]

the right to vote means the right not to exercise it as well as to exercise it. Mandatory voting has done nothing for Aus. As for the stupidity thing- heres the point. Its a democracy (of a sort) and even people you think are thickos get to vote. The antidemocratic nature of capital L liberalism etc

 

[Flavour]

If a dictator is voted in, do you feel that people who didn't vote have less responsibility for the result than people who voted against?

the context of why they didn’t vote matters—apathy may imply greater moral culpability than principled abstention in a flawed system.

 

[Skinny Ethel]

Bellypork chinese style today

 

[Skinny Ethel]

Shit wrong thread.

 

[two sheds]

the context of why they didn’t vote matters—apathy may imply greater moral culpability than principled abstention in a flawed system.

Same effect though, and I'm not sure principled abstention in a flawed system lets someone off the responsibility of letting a dictator in. In some ways surely it's worse since it confirms that that person knew what was going to happen.

I quite understand people not voting and I generally respect their decision. Not voting and claiming to have no responsibility for a dictator getting in while saying people who voted against a dictator did have responsibility seems to be like mental gymnastics though.

 

[kabbes]

individual people, who Flavour seemed to be talking about.

If it’s individual people you’re interested in then I’d say that no individual has anything more than the most negligible responsibility imaginable for what happens in the nation-state as a whole, and the difference between voting and not voting is meaningless.

 

[hitmouse]

Are you intelligent and decent people?

You're dismissing millions of people who didn't vote the way you wanted.

It's the epitome of elitism and snobbery to do such a thing. Can you understand why someone might have cast their vote for the Republicans?

I did hope that that article I posted yesterday might spark some reflection, but I suspect that the people who need to read it won't have. I'll have another try at just posting a shorter bit from it:

“We will not walk in fear, one of another. We will not be driven by fear into an age of unreason, if we dig deep in our history and our doctrine, and remember that we are not descended from fearful men–not from men who feared to write, to speak, to associate and to defend causes that were, for the moment, unpopular.”

The idea in that quote is that we must fight McCarthyism, for sure, but also that we ought not to be driven by fear into an age of unreason. We ought not to let fear of one another dominate our lives. For the most part, I want to say this to all of the people who have bought into the propaganda against queer people, especially trans people, of late. But I also want to remind myself of this. We ought not walk in fear, one of another.

I have enemies, to be sure. They’ve sent me photos of my family. They’ve told me they would burn down my house with me inside. But the average person, including the average person here in West Virginia where I live, is not my enemy. I am frustrated–beyond frustrated–to know that an overwhelming majority of my neighbors voted for a president who explicitly spreads hatred against queer people. Yet these people have never made me feel unsafe personally...

It’s not like you cross the imaginary line from Maryland to West Virginia and suddenly everyone is a different type of person. The people here aren’t, you know, monsters. No matter what horror movies have told you.

 

[xenon]

The idea if you didn't vote excludes you from having any valid criticism of the system, the government of the day or it's chief representatives is such brainless twoddle.

 

[xenon]

It's easy to find individuals who voted a certain way moronic, risible and plenty of examples exist to be found, catering to your own political leanings. I'm not objecting to it because I'm a softy excuse finding handwringing type.

I'm objecting cos it's boring and banal, adding nothing to a discussion about political drivers, trends, consequences and possible areas of challenge.

 

[two sheds]

The idea if you didn't vote excludes you from having any valid criticism of the system, the government of the day or it's chief representatives is such brainless twoddle.

Indeed, but the idea if you didn't vote excludes you from having any responsibility for the election of the government of the day seems similarly brainless twoddle.

 

[magneze]

Bellypork chinese style today

Feels like the most on topic post for a while.

 

[Flavour]

Bellypork chinese style today

Remember when Liz Truss talked about pork markets in Beijing, that was hilarious.

Something something tariffs, it's all connected

 

[xenon]

Indeed, but the idea if you didn't vote excludes you from having any responsibility for the election of the government of the day seems similarly brainless twoddle.

Not sure about that. Elections aren't trollie problems.

 

[two sheds]

If it’s individual people you’re interested in then I’d say that no individual has anything more than the most negligible responsibility imaginable for what happens in the nation-state as a whole, and the difference between voting and not voting is meaningless.

Well quite, which is why this insistence on placing responsibility on individual voters puzzles me. Hence:

Mind you, if you voted for Starmer’s Labour Party then I would actually agree that you really are a fucking idiot. But that’s by the by.

Tories and Reform: parties of the intellectuals

(((near 10 million fucking idiot Labour voters )))

 

[kabbes]

Indeed, but the idea if you didn't vote excludes you from having any responsibility for the election of the government of the day seems similarly brainless twoddle.

No individual has anything more than the very most negligible responsibility for the election of the government of the day. This is the dead end of trying to analyse social phenomena by looking at individuals.

 

[kabbes]

Well quite, which is why this insistence on placing responsibility on individual voters puzzles me. Hence:
(Etc)

That was just me being facetious. It was humour, not a serious assertion