Do you want AV for the UK? Cast your vote here!

[Streathamite]

The idea that we should help the Tories stay in government and do better in elections for decades to come, just in order to piss off LD activists in the short term when they are already pissed off anyway, seems like a spectacular own goal.

But it won't help the Tories stay in govt

 

[articul8]

I have never defended the LDs. They are the opposition to Labour locally, and I spend my time fighting them - including with the anti-cuts group.

 

[articul8]

But it won't help the Tories stay in govt

It won't make it any easier to get rid

 

[Andrew Hertford]

So no PR for 'generations to come' then?

AV is not so different to FPTP that it justifies that seedy 'epic video game voiceover' voice you're putting on there.

That's right, no pr for generations to come.

In my best seedy 'epic video game voiceover' voice: "You've had your chance. Game over."

 

[Streathamite]

It won't make it any easier to get rid

HUH? It certainly will -the libdems could implode within months.
sheesh, whatever you're smoking....

 

[Santino]

Socialists have always championed democratic reform in the UK. The Tories and their allies on the side of protecting the status quo.

Since when was a largely inconsequential tweak to the voting system 'democratic reform'?

 

[stethoscope]

Socialists have always championed democratic reform in the UK. The Tories and their allies on the side of protecting the status quo.

STV please, not some poor alternative which is about all the Lib Dems could muster from their coalition agreement. I'd rather stick with FPTP than AV.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

STV please, not some poor alternative which is about all the Lib Dems could muster from their coalition agreement. I'd rather stick with FPTP than AV.

This is why even a yes vote isn't really any kind of victory for the libdems. Most of them want stv too – that is they believe in it. Agreeing to a vote that only includes AV last year was no kind of victory to Clegg and co at all.

 

[Streathamite]

I find this incredible. This is a decision that will determine the way we elect our governments for generations to come, so to base your decision purely on the hope that you might be able to inflict a little damage onto the present 2011 government is short sighted in the extreme.

Fuck me, someone's talking even more bollocks than articul8!

 

[articul8]

I will continue to campaign for PR. But neither Labour nor the Tories were ever going to offer that - AV is the most that can be concretely won at the moment. And that is something Labour was fighting for way back in 1930.

 

[fractionMan]

You will continue to campaign for AV because that's what you're paid to do, not because it's of any benefit.

 

[stethoscope]

former far-left .

No so former, thankyou very much

But you're in the Labour party

 

[stethoscope]

Important that the Lab troops are all 'on message'.

 

[Streathamite]

I will continue to campaign for PR. But neither Labour nor the Tories were ever going to offer that.

But the ONLY way you will get that is extra-parliamentary pressure on them-not with this limp dick of a "reform"

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I will continue to campaign for PR. But neither Labour nor the Tories were ever going to offer that - AV is the most that can be concretely won at the moment.

How so? A straight offer last May to Brown – a vote that includes stv and you're still pm.

Was that tried?

 

[articul8]

Brown couldn't have got his own MPs to back that even if he wanted to. Too many are in safe seats and would rather go into opposition than lose their jobs for life.

 

[Santino]

Brown couldn't have got his own MPs to back that even if he wanted to. Too many are in safe seats and would rather go into opposition than lose their jobs for life.

Unlike, say, the Tories?

 

[Andrew Hertford]

Fuck me, someone's talking even more bollocks than articul8!

"Bollocks"?

Does that mean I get to call you a liar and a paedophile?

 

[Streathamite]

"Bollocks"?

Does that mean I get to call you a liar and a paedophile?

no,it means you maintain your 100% record of missing the point by a mile....apart from that making no sense at all
fuck, you're thick...

 

[Refused as fuck]

Why are you voting with the Tories?

Who says I'm voting? Why are you voting with peadophiles, tax dodgers and rapists?

 

[kabbes]

I find this incredible. This is a decision that will determine the way we elect our governments for generations to come, so to base your decision purely on the hope that you might be able to inflict a little damage onto the present 2011 government is short sighted in the extreme.

I find this incredible. The decisions made by the present 2011 government are systematically destroying our welfare state and will detrimentally affect lives for generations to come, so to base your decision purely on the hope that you might be able to make a marginal and ineffective change to a voting system is short sighted in the extreme.

 

[Streathamite]

I find this incredible. The decisions made by the present 2011 government are systematically destroying our welfare state and will detrimentally affect lives for generations to come, so to base your decision purely on the hope that you might be able to make a marginal and ineffective change to a voting system is short sighted in the extreme.

and myopic,blinkered and thoroughly fatheaded....

 

[Andrew Hertford]

I find this incredible. The decisions made by the present 2011 government are systematically destroying our welfare state and will detrimentally affect lives for generations to come, so to base your decision purely on the hope that you might be able to make a marginal and ineffective change to a voting system is short sighted in the extreme.

So why not vote for a fairer system which is also likely to result in less big majority tory governments in the future? THAT'S WHY THE TORIES DON'T WANT IT!!

I don't know whether to laugh or cry to see so many on the left lining up alongside Cameron. Are you actually tories in disguise?

 

[Santino]

So why not vote for a fairer system which is also likely to result in less big majority tory governments in the future? THAT'S WHY THE TORIES DON'T WANT IT!!

I don't know whether to laugh or cry to see so many on the left lining up alongside Cameron. Are you actually tories in disguise?

If Cameron voted against the death penalty would you vote FOR it?

 

[Andrew Hertford]

If Cameron voted against the death penalty would you vote FOR it?

No, vote for what you believe in. If you want a system that'll continually benefit the tories and will continually give us governments with less than 40% of the vote then vote for fptp. I'm sure millions will join you..

 

[Santino]

No, vote for what you believe in. If you want a system that'll continually benefit the tories and will continually give us governments with less than 40% of the vote then vote for fptp. I'm sure millions will join you..

Do you want a system that will benefit the Lib Dems?

 

[Andrew Hertford]

Do you want a system that will benefit the Lib Dems?

No, I want a system that is fairer than fptp, one that'll mean my vote won't get chucked straight in the bin and one that will give us a more representative parliament. AV isn't perfect but we're only being given a choice of two. If we vote to keep fptp then that'll be it, we probably won't get asked again in our lifetime.

A good electoral system shouldn't benefit any one party over the others. Fptp patently does.

 

[butchersapron]

Labour you mean?

 

[killer b]

interesting: the percentage split of the vote is almost identical to the 'avatars on urban' poll.

 

[Streathamite]

So why not vote for a fairer system which is also likely to result in less big majority tory governments in the future? THAT'S WHY THE TORIES DON'T WANT IT!!

except it's effect in that regard is minimal-as has been continually proven on the 2 threads, and as you'd know if you'd actually bothered to read both threads

I don't know whether to laugh or cry to see so many on the left lining up alongside Cameron. Are you actually tories in disguise?

EEK!They've cloned articul8! Exactly the same shit-fer-brains argument!
WHO CARES what the Tories are doing?'NO'= LD leadership in the shit