Treacle Toes
Time
Oh dear.
David Starkey On Newsnight....
- Thread starter cantsin
- Start date
Oh dear.
And now he goes on TV denouncıng the youth for theır 'completely false' dıalect.
Hypocrısy thy name ıs Starkey.
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
The link isn't the joke, you know. It was just for people who couldn't tell it was a joke.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Yup.
Still, I expect he's one of those rather crass people who believe that learning elocution has nothing in common with learning a local dialect or youthspeak. After all, he was trading up, and sees white working class people who speak an urban dialect as "trading down".
The late, great Rabbi Hugo Gryn had it right when he told Starkey that for all his learning he'd always be a boor.
Poo Flakes
Active Member
The first part might be true, but to associate it with black culture is fucking moronic. You might say "a lot of young people are twats" and go on to suggest it is because they listen to crap music, swapping twat for black and crap for black in that sentence is presumably what many people object to, as it is pretty obviously right-wing hyperbole.
Yeah, "I am an Anarchist" did so much good for the ideology, and preached that we should all live in a society of mutual co-operation rather than competition. Where have those days gone?
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
It was reflecting for fucks sake. What ideology? A very confused post there.
Poo Flakes
Active Member
So we do not interpret punk music literally? Right, just keep me right here.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
There are very few things that you should interpret literally - instructions and so on are about it. So no, you shouldn't.
What ideology?
It isn't anything to do with black culture, as I pointed out-the kind of accent the little white morons mimic is fake even when it comes from little black morons.
I don't think the 'anarchy' Johnny Rotten had in mind had anything to do with 'a society of mutual co-operation,' but the fact remains that most other forms of popular music haven't usually glorified murder and the ill treatment of women, gays etc like much 'Gangsta' shite does.
ericjarvis
give a feck for the feckless
Yeah right. So the song in which the singer compares his lover to a toy, invites the listener to take a feel, and threatens to imprison her in a box out of jealousy, isn't dodgy at all *. Have you listened to ANY traditional folk, blues, early rock and roll...
The history of popular music is littered with sexism of the very worst kind, and references to just about every form of violence imaginable. Admittedly you have to know the euphemisms when it comes to folk or blues, but what the hell did you think "jelly roll" is, or what "wearing green" entails? That doesn't justify the violence and misogyny in much "gangsta rap", but it's most certainly nothing unique or even new.
* Living Doll
gavman
pj slumpy
he had a sudden surge in credibility after the 'jamie's school' tv series. he apparently managed to get some boys to show an interest in the more violent aspects of history, and suddenly he's a dr spock for teenagers. or he was until this appearance..
Who are you, Paul Gambaccini?
I'm well aware of all the commonplaces you've just tried to put me right about, but, as I said, the fact remains that murder, ill-treatment of women and gays and so on, and a 'gangsta's' lifestyle, has never been as systematically expounded and glorified as it is in gangsta rap.
Treacle Toes
Time
Are you falling into a trap of thinking that the 'patois' Starkey referred to is actually something that has been 'copied' from somewhere else?
By definition a patios is not copied, it is organic and evolves. What Starkey was referring to is a Patois of type, some might even call it a dialect, it combines influences from informal and formal language forms from all over England and the world, it reflects the ethnic diversity and the influences of the people that use it.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
It's not been copied, it's been constructed here. It's as real as these posts.
Treacle Toes
Time
Which is what i've just said.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
You're right 100% Rutita, i think i should have quoted someone else to make the point.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
The slur against Jamacian patois what particularly disgusting. In fact, it is a dialect that can be used beautifully as anybody familar with the poetry of Linton Kwesi Johnson or the lyrics of Damian Marley will know.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
He really deserves a lot of shit for this. Everybody knows he's a pundit troll, but he overplayed his hand with that performance.
Treacle Toes
Time
Bizarre line up given the recent racist rantings of Starkey. Or have you just made that up?
Treacle Toes
Time
.
rekil
to menny cranks
Treacle Toes
Time
Ooooh, I see....protest potential.
Whatever it is, it's still bollocks when people contrive to use it in place of their real accent. Especially when they're white, the little imbeciles.
That accent he's referring to is quite different to what's used by older Jamaicans. And, as I said, it's contrived, used in place of people's local dialects.
Treacle Toes
Time
'Their real accent'? You are missing the point. For most...it is their real accent, it's the dialect they speak. It is not copied. It is a pastiche, that is what Patois' are.
Treacle Toes
Time
The accent/dialect/patois he is refering to is different to older Jamaicans because it's not Jamaican patois. You are making the same mistake as he has.
No it isn't. There are white kids- and black kids-who grow up speaking with the same accent as their parents, neighbours and other people of their UK region, and then adopt this ridiculous way of speaking due to fashion and peer pressure etc.
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