Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion

[teuchter]

Hard to prove conclusively perhaps, but if they've been isolating except when working it will be most likely that's where they've caught it.

And aren't civil cases decided on a balance of probability?

You'd have to also look at what TfL did to mitigate - and I think they did quite a lot relatively rapidly. It's likely that some of those bus drivers became infected well before the lockdown when everyone was going about business as usual. And what were TfL's other options post lockdown - stop operating services altogether?

 

[Artaxerxes]

I am shocked I tell you, shocked.

 

[little_legs]

Grant Shapps says he wouldn't get on a tube:

Grant Shapps says he would not get on crowded bus or tube

Transport secretary urges people not to ‘flood back’ on to public transport as lockdown eases

www.theguardian.com

He's also rephrased the 10% capacity claim as 'One in 10 people will be able to travel without overcrowding' which is a bit different from 10% capacity. It means 90% of services will be overcrowded.

Jump in the pool but don't get wet.

 

[ska invita]

Has there not been instructions that only x number of people are to be let on the bus? We've spent enough time talking about the tube logistics. Or is it just bus passengers are even more lowly.

all talk has been just that...what happneed to 10% on trains? waffle

FT reports UK death toll passes 50k

Excess UK deaths in Covid-19 pandemic top 50,000 - Google Search

www.google.com

 

[SpookyFrank]

You have got to be fucking kidding me.

 

[ddraig]

What an utter utter tory sniveling cunt!

 

[elbows]

You have got to be fucking kidding me.

Its news but its been around slightly longer than that article, they arent the first to mention it. I wish I could tell you where and when I first heard about it, I know it wasnt that long ago, but it was before that story because I said this on Monday:

Other gaps in public knowledge of the outbreak bother me greatly too. For example local authorities were complaining that the 2nd tier (provided by companies etc) test results were not available to them so they couldnt tell how many people had tested positive locally recently.

Increasingly on so many fronts in this country, new muddle is making its presence felt. Maybe we need to track the M as well as the R. When the ratio of muddle, M, is above 1, exponential growth of failure is expected. Stay Absurd, Control the Gravy Train, Save a Contract for your chums.

 

[elbows]

The North, especially the North West could probably do with more attention. Not that I really know what to say to add to this article at the moment:

Exclusive: Virus persisting at higher rate in north of England

Coronavirus spread appears to be persisting at a higher rate in parts of the north of England - prompting warnings that the mortality gap between those more and less deprived will get bigger.

www.hsj.co.uk

 

[little_legs]

 

[Dogsauce]

Any chance some of the reckless tube/bus commuters are people who’ve had the virus? There must be many in London who are pretty sure or have been confirmed to have had it, why would you bother with masks and distancing if there isn’t a risk to others or yourself. I mean I understand the concept of setting an example and solidarity, but can’t expect everyone else to.

 

[zahir]

Yesterday’s independent SAGE press conference

 

[Orang Utan]

Any chance some of the reckless tube/bus commuters are people who’ve had the virus? There must be many in London who are pretty sure or have been confirmed to have had it, why would you bother with masks and distancing if there isn’t a risk to others or yourself. I mean I understand the concept of setting an example and solidarity, but can’t expect everyone else to.

I don’t think it’s necessary to call them reckless. Surely they just don’t want to lose their jobs.
And surely it’s irrelevant if they’ve had CV-19 or not as they can still carry and spread the virus?

 

[belboid]

Some fuckwit has started advertising one of those may 16th Mass Gatherings for Sheffield now. I am tempted to go along with various bottles of piss. It’s more essential than going to collect sourdough starter at least.

 

[Humberto]

Any chance some of the reckless tube/bus commuters are people who’ve had the virus? There must be many in London who are pretty sure or have been confirmed to have had it, why would you bother with masks and distancing if there isn’t a risk to others or yourself. I mean I understand the concept of setting an example and solidarity, but can’t expect everyone else to.

Plus catching it doesn't give future immunity as I understand it.

 

[little_legs]

Coronavirus: Social distancing 'impossible' on London commute

Trains at London Waterloo have been running at 45% of normal capacity since Monday, after reducing services by 75% since the earlier stages of the lockdown. Services are expected to rise to 82% from next Monday. Several of London's main roads experienced higher traffic than in recent weeks. Queues of up to 45 minutes were recorded on a five mile stretch along the East India Dock Road.

 

[Teaboy]

I don’t think it’s necessary to call them reckless. Surely they just don’t want to lose their jobs.
And surely it’s irrelevant if they’ve had CV-19 or not as they can still carry and spread the virus?

I'm no expert here but I would have thought if immunity exists it means that you can't transmit it to others. Well I suppose it could live on your clothes or something but not through coughing and sneezing etc.

Plus catching it doesn't give future immunity as I understand it.

Pretty much everything I read suggests it will most likely give you immunity (mutations aside) but that immunity will not last especially long, maybe a couple of years or so. There have been a handful of cases where people might of got it twice but it could be explained by false positive tests or not fully recovered from the first bout. There will no doubt be the odd unlucky person who gets it twice maybe three times but in theory they will be very rare.

Nothing is certain about all this of course.

 

[Teaboy]

I suspect a lot of Londoners will think they have already had it. It must have been running rampant through the city even in January let alone in February and public transport and density of living being what it is. Just a shame none of us had access to testing back then.

I have no doubt that bringing the lockdown measures in countrywide at the same time meant exposure was reduced elsewhere in the country. London was already fucked by then and probably why we see such a dramatic fall off on the London figures. Almost a cliff edge.

 

[little_legs]

I suspect a lot of Londoners will think they have already had it.

No.

But I suspect I will get it.

 

[Saul Goodman]

reckless tube/bus commuters

You mean people who've been told to get back to work, and it's a choice between that and being made homeless and starving to death?

 

[Teaboy]

No.

But I suspect I will get it.

You may have. Loads of people are asymptomatic. You may have had a light case in January and put it down to a cold.

 

[little_legs]

Sir/Ma'am, respectfully you know nothing about me. And just because some people reported a Christmas/January flu it does not mean at all that they had it.

 

[Humberto]

Pretty much everything I read suggests it will most likely give you immunity (mutations aside) but that immunity will not last especially long, maybe a couple of years or so. There have been a handful of cases where people might of got it twice but it could be explained by false positive tests or not fully recovered from the first bout. There will no doubt be the odd unlucky person who gets it twice maybe three times but in theory they will be very rare.

Nothing is certain about all this of course.

OK. Well that is better than I thought was the case.

 

[Teaboy]

Sir/Ma'am, respectfully you know nothing about me. And just because some people reported a Christmas/January flu it does not mean at all that they had it.

OK I was just saying maybe. And the first comment you replied to was me saying I suspect a lot of Londoners not all. I don't know anything about you that's why there are qualifications in my statements. Not sure why you thought I was only talking about only you in a city of 8M. Whatevs. What a strange thing to write.

 

[Orang Utan]

I'm no expert here but I would have thought if immunity exists it means that you can't transmit it to others. Well I suppose it could live on your clothes or something but not through coughing and sneezing etc.

aye, that’s what I meant, and surely it doesn’t instantly die when it makes contact with skin either

 

[little_legs]

OK I was just saying maybe. And the first comment you replied to was me saying I suspect a lot of Londoners not all. I don't know anything about you that's why there are qualifications in my statements. Not sure why you thought I was only talking about only you in a city of 8M. Whatevs. What a strange thing to write.

Shut up. I don't have time for your weaseling out.

 

[Numbers]

OK I was just saying maybe. And the first comment you replied to was me saying I suspect a lot of Londoners not all. I don't know anything about you that's why there are qualifications in my statements. Not sure why you thought I was only talking about only you in a city of 8M. Whatevs. What a strange thing to write.

Was a bit odd alright.

 

[yield]

Pretty much everything I read suggests it will most likely give you immunity (mutations aside) but that immunity will not last especially long, maybe a couple of years or so. There have been a handful of cases where people might of got it twice but it could be explained by false positive tests or not fully recovered from the first bout. There will no doubt be the odd unlucky person who gets it twice maybe three times but in theory they will be very rare.

Nothing is certain about all this of course.

Honestly not piling in Teaboy but where have you read that?

"Immunity passports" in the context of COVID-19

Scientific Brief

www.who.int

April 24, 2020

There is currently no evidence that people who have recovered from COVID-19 and have antibodies are protected from a second infection.

Maybe 2hats or elbows can put my fears to rest?

 

[teuchter]

A lack of evidence doesn't mean a lack of likelihood.

 

[Teaboy]

Shut up. I don't have time for your weaseling out.

OK. This has got very odd. Time for us both to leave it. FWIW I hope you don't get it because you do sound very worried.

 

[2hats]

Any chance some of the reckless tube/bus commuters are people who’ve had the virus? There must be many in London who are pretty sure or have been confirmed to have had it, why would you bother with masks and distancing if there isn’t a risk to others or yourself. I mean I understand the concept of setting an example and solidarity, but can’t expect everyone else to.

1. Anyone who has been exposed to and recovered from SARS-CoV-2 can still transfer fomites to naive hosts, just as can those who have not yet been infected.

2. Pretty much every person returning to work who has previously been exposed to SARS-CoV-2 and developed moderate to mild symptoms, or was asymptomatic, will have had a low to negligible immune response (evidence thus far suggests). Those persons quite possibly will be more able to subsequently, respiratorily, briefly transmit SARS-Cov-2 (and increasingly so with degree of absence of symptoms).

Those who developed a strong immune response are likely to have been in the hospitalised/ICU cohort so aren't likely to be joining the hordes of returning commuters any time soon.

Time is required for more research.