Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion
- Thread starter Sasaferrato
- Start date
Yep. All the people I know that are in one, it's about supporting an elderly/disabled relative or friend. Surely there'd still need to be provision for that?
platinumsage
HaveMyPassword123
ah fair enough.
I could be too as I live on my own. But I'm not as it doesn't seem the right thing to do. As I said above though, the people I know that are in one, it's because of caring responsibilities.
I've completely lost track tbh.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
Absolutely, but the impact on various isolated people would be huge
But if you're not supposed to be leaving home it makes sense, otherwise the advice is contradictory.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
Yeah, exactly that. You'd still be able to do care responsibilities, but support bubbles are not the same thing. Although I do get some people might see an overlap/grey area.
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Lord Camomile
Yipchaa!
Likewise, figure it's for those who need it but personally I don't need it enough to justify the risk. Always been a bit of a solitary homebod, anyway.
But imagine for those who do need it it's a crucial part of getting through all this
Cid
Proper break this time
Support bubble registry might work... Just a self-assessed agreement between two parties (with incapacity exceptions). The exact structure doesn't even matter hugely, simply the extra step and acknowledgement would likely cut a large amount of fiddling around the edges. If that is a concern. Which I'm not sure it is.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
I think maybe not getting rid but it could do with a bit more clarity around the rules, I find the support bubble thing confusing so I haven't really bothered with it and I think there's a lot of confusion about what they actually are so a lot of people eg are seeing friends as part of a support bubble when they're both couples.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
I expect what we'll see is a short period of very strict restrictions on top of what we have now, and the suspension of support bubbles will be part of that?
Why's the support bubble thing confusing btw?
Cid
Proper break this time
I suspect the actual solution is, as it has always been, dumping in a couple of short periods of very hard lockdown... 2 weeks now in a kind of LD1+... iirc we closed construction and most housing stuff at that time, so do that again. Restrict the definition of essential retail. Spot checks on roads. etc etc. Then potentially period of that late in lockdown.
Cid
Proper break this time
A support bubble registry would work well for that I think... Though of course you do always get gaps around the edges with regards to access to technology etc.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
Well for example I don't know if the 'going for walks outside your household' also includes a support bubble and some of the stuff on the website is really confusing and seems to contradict itself. I know that a single person can be in a bubble of any size but I know people who are part of a couple who are in a bubble with another couple, but nobody else, and seemed to think that was fine.
Oh, it's not that I don't need it tbh. Apart from a few weeks in the summer and a week over christmas I haven't been in a room with another adult for longer than a couple of minutes in almost a year and tbh it's really starting to bite. Still. Not going to risk it right now.Likewise, figure it's for those who need it but personally I don't need it enough to justify the risk. Always been a bit of a solitary homebod, anyway.
But imagine for those who do need it it's a crucial part of getting through all this
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
Yeah, I think it gets used by quite a few people to convince themselves they're following the rules. Best one I've come across is lots of people from different households hanging out together drinking saying they're a bubble for the few hours they're out together. The actual rule is reasonably simple though I think.
Cid
Proper break this time
I mean it's pretty clear that a support bubble is a one person household + support. That bit at least should be easy.
I do think people are er... a bit too easily confused... when it comes to rules that affect their personal ability to do shit. The problem is that you can't really just tell them not to. Because you already have, and they haven't. You need to build in structures that reinforce the behaviours you want to promote. Could be registry. Could be a mass mail-out, or a poster campaign. It can't be done via the news.
Thora
Differently Ethical
The support bubble thing has got a bit confusing maybe as they expanded it. And there were support bubbles, childcare bubbles and then Christmas bubbles. People don’t necessarily get that you can’t socialise with your childcare bubble. I’m in a support bubble with my sister so that means we can socialise in a group of 10.
elbows
Well-Known Member
I'm not ready to properly join in this bit of conversation yet, but I just wanted to cmment on this bit for now.
It does not take weeks for deaths reported today to be allocated an actual date of death. Those deaths are not reported at all to start with (ie on the same day the deaths happened), they dont show up in either number, and when they are reported there is also a date of death provided at the very same time.
So for example all the deaths that will be reported in today number will end up on both graphs straight away. The difference is only that all the ones reported today will end up in todays entry on one graph, but spread across various dates in the other graph. But they are the same deaths, added to the data at the same time.
The only exception (apart from when there is a data/system malfunction) is that there are very small fluctuations that can happen later. Presumably some of the dates for specific deaths get tweaked later, so for example on some past days the numbers for particular dates may go up or down by a couple, presumably because some cases already reported have their date of death changed slightly later. Since the numbers involved are very small, there is barely any point me even mentioning this except I am a nerd.
As for the ONS data involving Covid-19 on the death certificate, if it were not for the additional lag in reporting these numbers, they are the only numbers I would rely on for tracking this side of the pandemic. The caveats about such data being provisional are pretty standard stuff when it comes to ONS death reporting data, in the same way that during normal non-pandemic times, it takes forever for the ONS to report final numbers for deaths registered on a particular week, month and year. eg Im not even sure there is a real, final number for 2019 yet, although I havent checked that for a while. In any case, later corrections to these figures matter more to people who need to know a precise number for a particular day and to have the number declared to be officially final. Later revisions are not usually large enough to make a difference to trends people saw in earlier, provisional versions of ONS data. So its just the long delay in collating and publishing such info that stops ONS data being ideal for pandemic tracking day by day.
Probably later I will have something to say about what the current numbers show and whether it really matters which daily number people use to track these trends.
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Lord Camomile
Yipchaa!
Ach, that really sucks, but fair play on making the sacrifice anyway.
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