Coronavirus in the UK - news, lockdown and discussion

[Cid]

The quotes make more sense when pre-pandemic orthodox wisdom is taken into account, and when the history of certain people that were quoted is taken into account.

I cant do the full subject justice right now, but in terms of orthodox approach and lack of ambition, such things are also present in the very first posts I made about this pandemic. When I spoke about how if the new virus could transmit very effectively between people, humanity would not stop it or even really try to. It is a source of regret that I've spend much of the pandemic commentating on what was happening and what might happen next, instead of what should happen next. I attempted to compensate for this later by picking at various aspects of the orthodox approach, but my ideas were still limited.

As for specific people that were quoted, Woolhouse is the obvious one to pick on. Pandemic cunt. May occasionally come out with something sensible I agree with, but for sure an example of how much horror a particular narrow view can impose. He saw lockdown as something that caused more harm than good, eg in this quote from August:

Lockdown was a “monumental mistake on a global scale”, claims UK scientist – TheLiberal.ie – Our News, Your Views

One of the UK government’s top scientific advisers on infectious diseases has said that the Covid-19…

theliberal.ie

That sort of thing alone is enough for me to view him as a dangerous shithead in this pandemic. And the shitty nature of his stance is made worse when exploring what he actually did on a personal level compared to the approach he would have the rest of us take. This article is from last April:

Scottish Govt coronavirus advisor slammed for moving to island holiday home

Professor Mark Woolhouse, who sits on Nicola Sturgeon's Covid-19 taskforce, has angered residents on a tiny Hebridean island.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk

Yeah, I haven't kept on top of the various personalities like you have... It is fucking frustrating that the media is still reporting this shit, in this way.

 

[quimcunx]

I'd say more important is the govt putting more restrictions on companies and workers and supporting their restrictions with test and trace and decent sick pay etc.

Also housing unhoused people reducing the risk to them and to outreach workers.

 

[elbows]

Yeah, I haven't kept on top of the various personalities like you have... It is fucking frustrating that the media is still reporting this shit, in this way.

I havent managed this properly either, I have a very small list of the same few 'expert' names that came up enough in the first wave for me to form an opinion. I may feel the need to document some of them in more detail at some point, and I will be interested to see what the eventual public inquiry makes of this side of things.

Meanwhile I dont know quite how many times I will feel the need to go on about how I dont believe in putting all my future faith in single silver bullets, but it always makes me feel better when I hear the following sort of thing expressed:

Dr Deepti Gurdasani, an epidemiologist from Queen Mary University, said although vaccines were “critical”, even once the top four priority groups are vaccinated there will still be many more vulnerable groups who will not have received a vaccine by mid-February.

“It’s really worrying this rhetoric that vaccines are this end point that will allow us to open up society when the majority of people will not be protected from infection,” she told the BBC.

“We need a long term plan so that once restrictions are eased we don’t end up exactly in the situation [of] needing yet another lockdown.”

She added that this included an effective test-and-trace system and quarantine measures at borders.

From 13:29 entry of BBC live updates page https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-55605009

 

[Hyperdark]

"Dr Deepti Gurdasani, an epidemiologist from Queen Mary University, said although vaccines were “critical”, even once the top four priority groups are vaccinated there will still be many more vulnerable groups who will not have received a vaccine by mid-February."

Its getting a little bit frustrating to hear statements being made that relate to England only, re-stated as if its a UK wide position, Wales for instance has published no estimate on timing.
May I ask that when stating England specific stuff that the poster notes this, its bad enough the BBC doing it

 

[elbows]

I'll keep it in mind but I wouldnt change anything about that particular post as a result, since the exact timing is hardly central to her point, and I'd apply the point to most countries.

 

[bimble]

I’m really behind on the thread sorry. Just saw someone saying that Matt Hancock ‘refused to rule out’ ending support bubbles amongst other ideas for tightening the lockdown.
This is really scary for me, without my bubble I think I’d quickly get a lot more er..eccentric.
So my question is Is this just scaremongering or are they seriously considering ending bubbles does anyone know?

 

[elbows]

I’m really behind on the thread sorry. Just saw someone saying that Matt Hancock ‘refused to rule out’ ending support bubbles amongst other ideas for tightening the lockdown.
This is really scary for me, without my bubble I think I’d quickly get a lot more er..eccentric.
So my question is Is this just scaremongering or are they seriously considering ending bubbles does anyone know?

Well they have deliberately signalled in recent days a desire to wield a big stick more this time. How much of that will remain simply a threat of the stick, and if they actually use the stick where they will end up sticking it, remains to be seen.

I suppose I expect them to do some thing intended to shock people into feeling different about the current lockdown at some point in the coming days. I dont know what.

 

[andysays]

I’m really behind on the thread sorry. Just saw someone saying that Matt Hancock ‘refused to rule out’ ending support bubbles amongst other ideas for tightening the lockdown.
This is really scary for me, without my bubble I think I’d quickly get a lot more er..eccentric.
So my question is Is this just scaremongering or are they seriously considering ending bubbles does anyone know?

He was replying to a question about the possibility of ending support bubbles rather than volunteering the idea that this is something which might happen.

There are all sorts of things which might hypothetically be done, and it's probably sensible that none are simply ruled out at this stage, but nothing he said should be taken as meaning this is an option the government are actively considering ATM

 

[Cid]

I’m really behind on the thread sorry. Just saw someone saying that Matt Hancock ‘refused to rule out’ ending support bubbles amongst other ideas for tightening the lockdown.
This is really scary for me, without my bubble I think I’d quickly get a lot more er..eccentric.
So my question is Is this just scaremongering or are they seriously considering ending bubbles does anyone know?

It’s wrong. It was part of a long interview with Marr... marr asked whether a bunch of measures were on the table, Hancock just said he didn’t want to speculate or something. There were no firm refusals to rule out or anything, and marr didn’t follow up afaik.

They may still do it of course, they are tories. I just don’t think you can read much into it on that basis.

 

[platinumsage]

I’m really behind on the thread sorry. Just saw someone saying that Matt Hancock ‘refused to rule out’ ending support bubbles amongst other ideas for tightening the lockdown.
This is really scary for me, without my bubble I think I’d quickly get a lot more er..eccentric.
So my question is Is this just scaremongering or are they seriously considering ending bubbles does anyone know?

No, the journalist fired a lot of random things that could be tightened at him, and he didn't comment.

 

[Cid]

It’s about 32 minutes into this morning’s marr show.

 

[bimble]

Thank you! Am tentatively reassured.

 

[Cid]

I would just add that Marr is one of those people with a lot of access... he probably has some basis for asking about those suggestions. But impossible to say more than that.

 

[sparkybird]

You'd have thought it would be obvious that vaccinating healthcare staff would be a force multiplier

Even Mexico's AMLO decided it was best to start with health care workers. What is wrong with this govt?

 

[Steel Icarus]

In-laws came round to drop pressies off for my son who is 17 today. They were on the doorstep for fifteen minutes and in that time next door had visitors who went inside, other side of them had someone go in, two different groups of kids went past (four girls on foot and three boys on bikes) and kids from two other neighborhood houses were playing with a ball in a front garden.

Anecdotal yes but it doesn't feel in any way different to the summer

 

[Miss-Shelf]

Somehow Argos is open around here.

Argos sell reasonably priced oxymeters often available quicker than amazon will ship from China so I'm glad they are open

 

[teqniq]

 

[StoneRoad]

Driving around today (to collect a parcel from the works that arrived a couple of days ago) the damp, cold & dismal is at least stopping people wandering about - just worried that they are inside in under-ventilated spaces, instead !

 

[LDC]

Thank you! Am tentatively reassured.

I think an ending of support bubbles is entirely possible in the short near future. I do think people need to be prepared for a short period (2 weeks maybe) of much tighter restrictions that involve actually not leaving home for anything except critical work, food and medical appointments, and maybe one session of exercise a day from your house alone or with one other household member. It's fucking grim, but we're in a very bad way.

 

[elbows]

I do think people need to be prepared for a short period (2 weeks maybe) of much tighter restrictions that involve actually not leaving home for anything except critical work, food and medical appointments, and maybe one session of exercise a day from your house alone or with one other household member. It's fucking grim, but we're in a very bad way.

Although tempting, I'm not sure I would agree with anything stronger being added that only lasts 2 weeks at this stage, because of the risk stemming from the extent to which behaviours may bounce back once that period ended. Especially since apparently some of the stuff thats worrying the establishment and making them think of going further is how slowly the wave may decline once past the peak.

 

[andysays]

I think an ending of support bubbles is entirely possible in the short near future. I do think people need to be prepared for a short period (2 weeks maybe) of much tighter restrictions that involve actually not leaving home for anything except critical work, food and medical appointments, and maybe one session of exercise a day from your house alone or with one other household member. It's fucking grim, but we're in a very bad way.

Yeah I think, on the level of individual preparedness, practical and mental health-wise, it's worth being aware that something along these lines is at least a possibility, whether or not it actually happens.

 

[bimble]

Yes, I get that it may happen, and if it does I’ll manage. If they also remove the ability to walk (exercise) outdoors with one other person I’d probably really struggle though, and I’m not by any means the most vulnerable, mental health wise, I just live in an isolated place and have felt it more this time around, how much I need to see a friendly face in real life every few days, not on a screen.

 

[editor]

Yes, I get that it may happen, and if it does I’ll manage. If they also remove the ability to walk (exercise) outdoors with one other person I’d probably really struggle though, and I’m not by any means the most vulnerable, mental health wise, I just live in an isolated place and have felt it more this time around, how much I need to see a friendly face in real life every few days, not on a screen.

I feel your pain. I haven't had a face to face chat with anyone for what seems like a very long time indeed.

 

[elbows]

Although tempting, I'm not sure I would agree with anything stronger being added that only lasts 2 weeks at this stage, because of the risk stemming from the extent to which behaviours may bounce back once that period ended. Especially since apparently some of the stuff thats worrying the establishment and making them think of going further is how slowly the wave may decline once past the peak.

Exceptions to my thinking on that would be if the measures involved were not expected to involve a rapid behavioural bounce back afterwards, eg if they shocked people in a manner that lasted a good while. Or measures that are done not to control the number of infections, but are just designed to reduce other pressures on health service and vital infrastructure during the very peak, not that I have many ideas about what such measures could be at this stage.

 

[Mation]

What is wrong with this govt?

How much time do you have? It may take a while to list...

 

[chilango]

We can talk endlessly about how to interpret the vague rules we've been given but as long as people have to go out to work it isn't going to make a blind bit of difference.

 

[Sue]

I think an ending of support bubbles is entirely possible in the short near future. I do think people need to be prepared for a short period (2 weeks maybe) of much tighter restrictions that involve actually not leaving home for anything except critical work, food and medical appointments, and maybe one session of exercise a day from your house alone or with one other household member. It's fucking grim, but we're in a very bad way.

I'm not sure what other people have been doing, but this pretty much sums up my 2020. I mean what else is there to do..?

 

[Thora]

I'm not sure what other people have been doing, but this pretty much sums up my 2020. I mean what else is there to do..?

Even during this lockdown you can leave your house for non-critical work or to go shopping at B&M. In the three or four weeks before this lockdown I went shopping, to the cinema, nail salon, pub, restaurant, took kids to swimming lessons, toddler music class.
The actual legal restrictions haven’t been very restrictive.

 

[chilango]

I picked up a Costa drive-through and then went to a garden centre to look at sheds today.

I really shouldn't be able to.

 

[Sue]

Even during this lockdown you can leave your house for non-critical work or to go shopping at B&M. In the three or four weeks before this lockdown I went shopping, to the cinema, nail salon, pub, restaurant, took kids to swimming lessons, toddler music class.
The actual legal restrictions haven’t been very restrictive.

I now feel like I've been doing this all wrong.