Britain First

[Magnus McGinty]

Why? How on earth is it doing them favours? You think it acts as a recruiting sergeant for BF or something daft like that? The only people getting up in arms about this are dickheads like them.

You are basically advocating that racism, as an element of other crimes, should go unpunished. Bonkers.

I’m not saying it should go unpunished. In fact I’m not going to repeat myself. I made my points up thread.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

i don't know about you but i was pleased when charlie sargent out of c18 was put away for murder. i don't see taking some pleasure from the jailing of fascists as bad. it doesn't mean you support the whole state structure, it means taking pleasure in bad things happening to bad people.

I suppose the liberals will sleep sounder under the illusion that the state will protect them from fascism.

 

[Spymaster]

I’m not saying it should go unpunished.

Of course you are. Very explicitly. You're saying that their sentences shouldn't have been bumped because of the religious or racial element. How is that not leaving the racism element unpunished?

 

[Pickman's model]

I suppose the liberals will sleep sounder under the illusion that the state will protect them from fascism.

it will protect them from fascism to the same extent it protects them from rain

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Of course you are. Very explicitly. You're saying that their sentences shouldn't have been bumped because of the religious or racial element. How is that not leaving the racism element unpunished?

I’ve made my points. I’m not playing merry-go-rounds with you.

 

[not-bono-ever]

whataboutery death spiral

 

[donkyboy]

I read that Britain Furst have stupidly printed the prison address for their beloved leader. Should be interesting when she gets tons of hate mail.

 

[Spymaster]

I’ve made my points. I’m not playing merry-go-rounds with you.

You haven't made any points, dude. Not coherent ones anyway. You've said that banging them up for longer because of the hate element is doing them a favour but you haven't said why, and (I think) you've said that racism should be punished but argued the exact opposite. Can you see why I'm confused?

 

[Magnus McGinty]

You haven't made any points, dude. Not coherent ones anyway. You've said that banging them up for longer because of the hate element is doing them a favour but you haven't said why, and (I think) you've said that racism should be punished but argued the exact opposite. Can you see why I'm confused?

I covered it in post #655. You didn’t pull me then so I can only assume you joined the thread late and haven’t read previous points.

 

[Pickman's model]

I read that Britain Furst have stupidly printed the prison address for their beloved leader. Should be interesting when she gets tons of hate mail.

share the address

 

[lazythursday]

I covered it in post #655. You didn’t pull me then so I can only assume you joined the thread late and haven’t read previous points.

Post #655 isn't really clear at all. Are you arguing against the very notion of racially aggravated crime being a legal concept with harsher sentences, or simply saying that it shouldn't have been applied in this particular case because the political context might help boost Britain First?

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Post #655 isn't really clear at all. Are you arguing against the very notion of racially aggravated crime being a legal concept with harsher sentences, or simply saying that it shouldn't have been applied in this particular case because the political context might help boost Britain First?

I’m making a political/antifascist argument that it’s counter productive to make them martyrs / play into their narrative.

 

[Spymaster]

I covered it in post #655. You didn’t pull me then so I can only assume you joined the thread late and haven’t read previous points.

They could simply have had their collars felt for harassment. What has happened is they’ve had aggravating factors bolted on which plays right into their narrative of minorities getting special treatment which helps their organisations grow. All being cheered on by you.

The "aggravating factor" being racism.

That doesn't cover anything though does it. The only narrative of minorities getting special treatment is by dickheads for dickheads. It's not going to convince anyone remotely reasonable.

Seriously. Right here you are arguing that the racism in this case shouldn't be punished. Absolutely slap-bang, that's what you're saying.

 

[Treacle Toes]

I’m making a political/antifascist argument that it’s counter productive to make them martyrs / play into their narrative.

You are arguing that the racist element of their crimes be ignored so we don't upset them, other racists or would be racists. Not very socialist/antifacist of you at all.

FFS, they got weeks not years!! Martyrs? Have a word with yourself.

 

[Pickman's model]

I’m making a political/antifascist argument that it’s counter productive to make them martyrs / play into their narrative.

i don't think you can call prison sentences which - combined - are only a couple of weeks more than a year is making martyrs of them, and this is in any case a different argument from that you were formerly proposing.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

The "aggravating factor" being racism.

That doesn't cover anything though does it. The only narrative of minorities getting special treatment is by dickheads for dickheads. It's not going to convince anyone remotely reasonable.

Seriously. Right here you are arguing that the racism in this case shouldn't be punished. Absolutely slap-bang, that's what you're saying.

Looking over at places like Austria, Italy, France, Hungary, I feel a growing unease at how the far right are developing. This is all under the European liberal consensus.
So pardon me if me if challenging some shibboleths causes offence.

 

[Pickman's model]

Looking over at places like Austria, Italy, France, Hungary, I feel a growing unease at how the far right are developing. This is all under the European liberal consensus.
So pardon me if me if challenging some shibboleths causes offence.

not sure how you got here from where you were

 

[The39thStep]

This is quite a useful 'live' report on the findings of guilt/not guilty and the sentencing with defence, prosecution and judges remarks.
Updates as Britain First leaders Paul Golding and Jayda Fransen jailed

 

[Magnus McGinty]

not sure how you got here from where you were

I imagine so.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Looking over at places like Austria, Italy, France, Hungary, I feel a growing unease at how the far right are developing. This is all under the European liberal consensus.
So pardon me if me if challenging some shibboleths causes offence.

So because you are scared you are arguing nonsense about ignoring racism as an element of hate crime because racists will be upset and recruit more racists!?!?!? Right you are.

 

[Pickman's model]

I imagine so.

yeh. i don't see the relevance of your 736 to Spymaster's 733, and would be grateful if you could explain it.

 

[lazythursday]

So in order to prevent the rise of the far right we should roll back protections against hate crimes? Shall we throw out all the race relations and equalities acts at the same time? How much do we need to abandon in order to win?

 

[Magnus McGinty]

So because you are scared you are arguing nonsense about ignoring racism as an element of hate crime because racists will be upset and recruit more racists!?!?!? Right you are.

Why are they growing?

 

[Magnus McGinty]

yeh. i don't see the relevance of your 736 to Spymaster's 733, and would be grateful if you could explain it.

I’m losing interest in the debate tbh. You guys carry on.

 

[Treacle Toes]

I’m losing the debate tbh. You guys carry on.

FIFY

 

[Pickman's model]

Why are they growing?

i don't think bf are growing

 

[ddraig]

FIFY

nail on head
poor poor mendacious magnus and his shitty agenda

 

[andysays]

I’m making a political/antifascist argument that it’s counter productive to make them martyrs / play into their narrative.

Sorry, I was wrong earlier. This nonsense IS comical.

You fucking clown.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

FIFY

I’m not ‘losing’ - I’ve made my points and I stand by them. I can leave it at that.

 

[Pickman's model]

I’m not ‘losing’ - I’ve made my points and I stand by them. I can leave it at that.

yeh, but you're having trouble defending them.