Yep. With Covid knocking out all income for getting on a year and a half and Brexit destroying lucrative European dates/festivals for the foreseeable future, it's pretty hard to justify the expenditure of joining the MU which traditionally has very little power to affect positive change for small bands and artists.
I've asked you nicely in private, now I'll ask you in public not so nicely. Don't talk to me on here, you fucking cunt.
Who the fuck are you to tell people what they can or can not afford, or how they should spend their money? It's up to them to decide if the MU brings enough benefits to justify spending an additional £5 a week on top of all their other bills - and hugely reduced income because of Covid/Brexit.
Middle class Liberal rage. Bless.
I don't have any experience of the Musician's Union, but I would guess that, like any union, they exist primarily to fight for the interests of their actual members, so if small bands and artists don't join, it's hardly surprising that their interests aren't represented.
Why is it, do you think, that so few small bands and artists have joined? Any ideas?
It wasn't particularly problematic until Covid and now Brexit, and it's sad to hear you so desperate to support Brexit that you're reduced to dad-like "get a proper job" rhetoric'
The collective bargaining power of bands on the lower rungs of the live scene is not what those demanding you join a union imagine it to be.
This!!
You are really not covering yourself in glory here. I'm not sure what you think you are bringing to the table.
Could do with a thread on Brexit and it’s impact on silversmiths , this one is past its sell by date .
I'm sorry you're in a shitty position ATM, but lashing out at what you think I've said rather than responding to what I've actually said doesn't really achieve anything
no need to have a thread on every occupation and brexit, it'd be ridiculous - you'd be on about 'and what about the lapis lazuli carvers or the pure-finders'
I didn't 'lash out' at all. Stop gaslighting and answer the points.
It's pretty much non existent. Pubs and small venues are struggling to stay afloat and there's little the MU can do about it. And that's not to put them down as union - I know they do good work if you're in the 'right' kind of jobs - but the financial realities at the bottom of the music industry make it hard to find valid reasons to join them.
I was pointing out the laughable hypocrisy of the little baby who refuses to join a union calling for solidarity for others who also refuse to join a union. The baby got all sweary Mary because he looked silly and he does not like oiks showing him up.
"Gaslighting" is it?
I just did some back of a fag packet costings and at union minimum rates - including a support band, also on union minimum, a rider and a sound tech (so not even including travel, overnight costs, promotion, venue hire, etc etc) - promoters are looking at needing an audience of a hundred at £5 a ticket before they even break even. Anyone imagining that kind of audience is reliably available for small bands (even tbh some not so small bands) has never tried their hand at promoting. And anyone who thinks they can charge much more for tickets to unknown or underground artists is also deluded. The margins are tiny and even with everyone being screwed promoters regularly make a loss - it would simply stop altogether if MU minimums were kept to across the board.
Should we merge this with other Brexit threads or would it contaminate the content of the other threads ?
bring it up with editor, i have no great views on the matter
Sorry, which parts did I specifically fail to address?
The MU famously demand a reasonable rate for performing. On one hand here it’s demanded that musicians and other creatives are shown solidarity. On the other that bands should continue to accept low or no fees (or a pint each in some instances ) and the MU are wrong to object.
I see no reason why this thread should change. merge or move. It's in the music forum and it's all about the impact of Brexit on musicians and the music industry.
Sorry, a pint in what 'instances'?
The MU minimum is a reasonable rate, I agree. But the economics of the lower end of the music industry mean that - unless there's a wholesale change in the gig-going public's attitude to paying for live music - it's not an achievable amount for huge numbers of bands. How do you pay union rates when 30 people turn up to the show at £5 a ticket? How do you pay union rates when a hundred people turn up, but you don't have a door charge? Where's the money coming from?
So you think it acceptable to pay little or no fee to bands to perform? Yes or no will do.
This argument was used a lot to oppose the introduction of the UK’s minimum wage. Im not surprised to see it advanced here. Especially amongst people who would not join a union.
I have read all the posts, and sorry but it's you that are coming off looking quite remarkably bad.
You posted on these boards here several times that you paid a pint approx per performer at your Offline gigs at the Albert in Brixton.
Stick me on ignore then creep.
Absolutely. I promote shows myself from time to time - I've never made a profit, and often have to pay some expenses out of my own pocket - I would not be able to do it at all if I had to find hundreds of pounds out of the ether each time I did it. It's always upfront what the situation is though, and most of the people who play the nights I do are regular performers.
