Bernie is running

[Vintage Paw]

I still don't understand caucuses.

So, the caucus was meant to elect delegates, who went to the county delegate conference to elect delegates to go to the national delegate conference? I think. Or maybe not. idk.

Anyway, the state has flipped for Bernie.

I think.

 

[Vintage Paw]

Add in 'state delegate convention' in between county and national

Fucking American politics.

 

[Vintage Paw]

Right, so...

there are allegations of shenanigans from the caucus, delegates being registered as alternates, delegates being told to stay home or leave early, etc... which may have undermined the Sanders vote to begin with.

The same appears to have been attempted today, with the DNC telling delegates they didn't need to go last night to register, and they didn't need to turn up today. But the Sanders campaign has been absolutely on the ball about this since they know it's a tactic that has been used in several states now. So delegates turned up in their droves. Hence the flip to Sanders. Additionally, a few Clinton delegates switched to Sanders.

I got it slightly wrong earlier. In 08 Clinton won the caucus in Nevada by about 2%, but at state convention it flipped for Obama at about 11%.

 

[Vintage Paw]

Caucuses are bullshit.

 

[agricola]

Caucuses are bullshit.

They are, but we are going to see a lot more of them next time (in the Republican race at least).

 

[Vintage Paw]

No doubt. Got to stifle the popular vote somehow.

 

[Vintage Paw]

Just found out my Michigan friend has put a Sanders sign in her front yard. The only political sign of any flavour on her block apparently. But all the others in the same neighbourhood (in Oakland County) are all Sanders

Not that it much matters considering they've already had their primary

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

omfg

Don’t be smug about Trump and abortion | Letters

Mention of old lefties dressed in tight clothing always summons up an image I had hoped was erased from my brain. Unfortunately...

 

[binka]

RealClearPolitics - 2016 Latest Polls

Good resource for all the latest polls. Interesting how Clinton's lead in NY is being eroded - down to +12 now in a state she must have thought she'd be guaranteed a thumping majority

 

[Vintage Paw]

It's really interesting. At first very few people had heard of Sanders. But as he makes his way around the country, it really is the case that the more people hear about him, see his rallies, hear his platform, the more they drift towards him. I suppose that's to be expected, but I don't think Clinton et al expected it.

 

[ruffneck23]

and the whole email thing has really started to damage Clinton..

 

[Vintage Paw]

Has it though? Outside of circles that don't like her already, I mean.

 

[DotCommunist]

the repubs must be hitting her on it surely? they probably recon they could srtand a dogs anus against sanders and win by shouting COMMIE loud enough, so clear the field of the electable opponent.

 

[Vintage Paw]

The GOP have been hitting her on it since the story broke. I've seen no evidence of her feeling truly put out by it. It's low level annoyance stuff that's been going on for months and months. An interviewer asking a question about it today is little different to an interviewer asking a question about it 12 months ago.

What matters is whether people who either took no notice or didn't think she'd done anything wrong are starting to think otherwise. I've not seen that happening. The same people are talking about it who have always talked about it. Even if they're talking more loudly it makes little difference if it doesn't move more people against her.

Honestly, for the moment it's a non-issue. Unless she's charged (which is highly doubtful) there's little traction in using it as a weapon against her. The right banging on about it have sounded desperate and vicious for months - typical stuff they use to discredit any and every Dem they hate. The left banging on about it sound petty and opportunistic. There are far more important and salient things to hold her accountable for.

 

[Vintage Paw]

They'd be dead wrong about Sanders, though. Socialist has been bandied around with gusto and everyone who loves him loves him for that. For the first time in relatively recent American history, socialist isn't a label that hurts (mostly because it's prefixed with 'democratic'). They spent hundreds of hours of air time calling Obama a socialist and that did fuck all too. I doubt even using the dreaded C word would touch him. There's little the GOP can do to bring down Sanders. To the people who matter, his record and beliefs are flawless. The GOP will hate him regardless. They have more leverage against Clinton.

 

[DotCommunist]

They'd be dead wrong about Sanders, though. Socialist has been bandied around with gusto and everyone who loves him loves him for that. For the first time in relatively recent American history, socialist isn't a label that hurts (mostly because it's prefixed with 'democratic'). They spent hundreds of hours of air time calling Obama a socialist and that did fuck all too. I doubt even using the dreaded C word would touch him. There's little the GOP can do to bring down Sanders. To the people who matter, his record and beliefs are flawless. The GOP will hate him regardless. They have more leverage against Clinton.

I enjoy reading about the american new left, both its social and intertwined political expressions. For a brief time it must have looked like they could honestly do it, break the hold of capital etc etc.


not that sanders is any sort of revo but yes its nice to hear a dem say socialist without looking like he has stood in something nasty.

another thing as I was typing that just occurred to me- saner Machiavellian heads in the GOP probably see killary as 'someone we can work with' i.e buy

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

and the whole email thing has really started to damage Clinton..

I really don't see it that way. Most of the people it matters to arn't going to vote for her anyway.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

They'd be dead wrong about Sanders, though. Socialist has been bandied around with gusto and everyone who loves him loves him for that. For the first time in relatively recent American history, socialist isn't a label that hurts (mostly because it's prefixed with 'democratic'). They spent hundreds of hours of air time calling Obama a socialist and that did fuck all too. I doubt even using the dreaded C word would touch him. There's little the GOP can do to bring down Sanders. To the people who matter, his record and beliefs are flawless. The GOP will hate him regardless. They have more leverage against Clinton.

Cry "wolf" one too many times and people stop listening.

 

[gosub]

I really don't see it that way. Most of the people it matters to arn't going to vote for her anyway.

Not being a sceptic, don't have a vote. I think it does matter, it all grew out of a reluctance to have her correspondence not on public record (not a good sign) but I think it matter less than stopping Trump

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

Not being a sceptic, don't have a vote. I think it does matter, it all grew out of a reluctance to have her correspondence not on public record (not a good sign) but I think it matter less than stopping Trump

My concern is the intellectual dishonesty that seems inherent in caring about Clinton having a private server, but not Colin Powell or Condolessa Rice. Its suddenly a concern when it can be used as a club by the GOP. When that party could use it as a shield, it was just fine with them.

I'm not accusing you of this, but as far as I can see this is just another example of coming up with rules to apply that never existed in the past. I'm fine with prohibiting private servers, but it should be applied to everyone equally. It should also be codified in law, not in informal practice.

 

[Vintage Paw]

Plus it only matters, like I said before, to people who didn't like her to begin with.

Unless it ends with her being indicted for something, it'll have very little impact on anything that actually matters.

 

[SpineyNorman]

Not being a sceptic, don't have a vote. I think it does matter, it all grew out of a reluctance to have her correspondence not on public record (not a good sign) but I think it matter less than stopping Trump

I assume you mean septic, since last time I checked lack of scepticism did not exclude you from enjoying the full rights of the voting franchise.

 

[Yuwipi Woman]

I assume you mean septic, since last time I checked scepticism did not exclude you from enjoying the full rights of the voting franchise.

Too bad. A little of that would be quite helpful.

 

[SpineyNorman]

Too bad. A little of that would be quite helpful.

I almost tacked something on the end of that about lack of scepticism explaining a lot about historical election results but I was too lazy and now you've beaten me to it

 

[Dogsauce]

I imagine there will be some Bernie-leaning democrat supporters who are conflicted when landing blows on Clinton, since if she takes too much damage it might then harm her fight against Trump, who I imagine they'd see as a greater evil. Even with Clinton's record, I don't think many will want a Republican administration instead that will stitch up the Supreme Court for a couple of decades etc.

 

[Vintage Paw]

A quick look in the Trump thread suggests otherwise. (Although I advise against the thread atm because there's some weirdo troll on there.)

 

[bluescreen]

A quick look in the Trump thread suggests otherwise. (Although I advise against the thread atm because there's some weirdo troll on there.)

I thought he may be a new Tay-type chatbot, but krtek a houby recognises his style from elsewhere.

 

[Vintage Paw]

The whole thing is tedious. I'm steering clear.

 

[krtek a houby]

I thought he may be a new Tay-type chatbot, but krtek a houby recognises his style from elsewhere.

Unfortunately, he won't go away until he's bored. He stayed on the other sites for a long, long time and would never answer any straight questions. He actually sees the opposition to his lunacy as some kind of badge on honour

 

[bluescreen]

Thanks. It's hard to understand the mentality. I'm avoiding him from now on.